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FrozenGate by Avery

Unplesant dealings with FlaminPyro...

Sorry to double post, but another thing which might help prevent situations like this is for Ben to print out the results of his spectrometer readings and provide them to the buyer with the laser..
 





Sorry to double post, but another thing which might help prevent situations like this is for Ben to print out the results of his spectrometer readings and provide them to the buyer with the laser..
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Good call , EF - That would have definitely helped.

Another thing, this may sound like I'm playing "devils advocate" but in any dealings I've ever had as a seller, if the buyer is at all unhappy I always offer a complete refund providing the item is returned at their expense in the condition in which it was recieved, no questions asked - was this option offered, Ben? The more I think about this I can't help but recall that Jeff hasn't ever struck me as unreasonable, I wasn't part of this transaction (so I need to state that this is simply an opinion) but could the entire discrepancy have been cleared up with the simple, respectful, professional offer of a refund? When opinions differ, tempers and emotions can flare - but as a seller, the first responsibility one should have is to the buyer and their satisfaction, even if you feel that you didn't do anything wrong, a little sugar goes a whole lot farther than a ton of salt.
 
BrewCityMusic said:
I wasn't part of this transaction (so I need to state that this is simply an opinion) but could the entire discrepancy have been cleared up with the simple, respectful, professional offer of a refund? When opinions differ, tempers and emotions can flare - but as a seller, the first responsibility one should have is to the buyer and their satisfaction, even if you feel that you didn't do anything wrong, a little sugar goes a whole lot farther than a ton of salt.
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That's pure wisdom there. Somehow some of the sellers here are under the delusion that once a customer has pissed you off, you no longer have any obligation to them. That's BULLSHIT and there's no two ways about it. In professional business, the customer is always right unless they do something to irrefutably incriminate themselves. You can't blame a customer for any reactions (or overreactions) that are tied to their frustrations. If a customer starts calling you names and insults your mother, then end the conversation. Ending the conversation is not the same as ending your obligation to them. You can still make things right as best you can, and in fact in professional business you are ethically required to.
 
While I agree that it is the seller's responsibility to refund if a customer isn't happy, there are a few things that make it tough in the laser world.

Many people get ideas of how they expect a laser to be before they get it, like a super bright awesome orange, and then when they get it it's just a bit different from red and their expectations were a bit high. Then they begin to feel a bit remorseful. In my opinion, it is not the seller's responsibility to refund because of buyer's remorse.

I'm not saying that this was even the case in this particular transaction, but just providing a scenario. It seems to happen a lot with lasers.... people buy a laser and think it's awesome for about 10 minutes then they decide it was a lot of money for a few mW's of light on the wall.
 
True. Lasers are finicky and so are people's knowledge of them, but buyers remorse is just a fact of business, and lack of knowledge ends up causing one of the leading sources of returns for major retailers. Often, someone will buy an item and not know how to use it properly. Back it goes.. If a seller can't handle that then they shouldn't be in business.

If it were ethical to behave in that fashion, the return policies of major retail outlets would contain a lot different legalese than they currently do. You wouldn't have a 30-day return policy, for starters. If you want to sell an item "as-is, no returns" it should be clearly marked or stated as such.

Lasers are a special case for another reason as well. Loose laser diodes are rarely sold with warranties of any kind due to their sensitivity and due to the fact that the seller has no idea about the skill level of the buyer. While folks like you and I just expect that, it still needs to be clearly marked. Professional is professional. If a person can't behave professionally, then they have absolutely no business being in business.

Everybody knows it's a dog eat dog world out there. It's the responsibility of the seller to protect themselves beforehand by clearly stating the terms of sale. That way, if you tell someone that an item can't be returned, then if they try to return it you can just say no. Sure people will probably complain once in awhile, but that's just another fact of business that most sellers circumvent on many items (most of the time anyway) by offering a return period.
 
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As daguin said, I have seen his orange HeNe, at first I thought it was about identical to a 593.5 nm DPSS pen laser, but side by side there is a little difference. There is a lot more difference between a red Hene and an orange one than yellow and orange, that I could tell in about any lighting. It's sure fun, IMHO, to see all these side by side and compare. -Glenn
 
Orange henes are really orange, like the color of an orange LED, red hene's are like a bright tomato red color. Compared with a cheap laser pointer it will be VERY ORANGE, while a red heane will be a more orange shade of RED.
 
612nm IS ORANGE....

Doesn't matter what a lasers advertised color is. Since the color isn't really an accurate way to describe lasers.
The wavelength however should not be lied about.

Ex:

I can sell a "532nm yellow" laser and its perfectly fine because who knows, my eyes may be seeing it as yellow. (they don't btw)

But if the wavelength is not 532 as specified, then I'm scamming...
 
Pretty colors :drool:

Edit: Ok some silly little removed thought it was necessary to add "spam" to my Rep. Geez, I hate these "Emo" internet kids.
 
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Crazy Jay said:
Pretty colors :drool:

Edit: Ok some silly little removed thought it was necessary to add "spam" to my Rep. Geez, I hate these "Emo" internet kids.
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Well, your comment is spam...

But funny spam!:crackup:
 
No he posted
Pretty colors
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, thats it, bringing up a dead thread. I neg rep'd for spam. He went in another thread and neg rep'd me for posting this:
Very Nice! Looks good!
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in response to someone thread detailing their home made RGB.
 
Hey if your not going to say bad things about me get off this thread !!! LOL:na:


Crazy Jay said:
Pretty colors :drool:

Edit: Ok some silly little removed thought it was necessary to add "spam" to my Rep. Geez, I hate these "Emo" internet kids.
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