New 2.2W Survival laser

[bennett326]

i can say SL's shipping times are phenomenal and he doesnt overcharge for shipping in my experience. may be not on topic but you guys are bashing a bit so i thought ....

 

[lasersbee]

NOTHING
Read what I've actually written before you criticize me.

Don't get your panties in a bunch.....:crackup::crackup:

No confusion here.... Not criticizing anyone...
just clearing up the facts...:beer:

I understood exactly what you wrote...
You stated that "paying rent" for a business often means working
out of your home.....

A lot of people "pay rent" for business premises.

In practice, that often means:
"I'm allocating 25% of my home mortgage/rent to a business expense, because I have a room where my computer sits, and a workshop where I keep my supplies and build stuff".

Then you go on to say that saying I have to pay business rent is
suggesting a bending of the truth...

It's still a legitimate allocation of these costs, I'm not suggesting otherwise. But it sure gives a different impression when you tell people "I have to pay rent, as overhead for my XYZ business", vs "I do work out of my home, and charge some of my living expenses to the business".

I'm only saying that there ARE legitimate sellers on LPF with actual
businesses in a true Business building and as such have associated
business expenses that you (as an example) who also sell here do
not have...

I apologize if that is not what you want to here.... but that's the
way it is...


Jerry:crackup::crackup:

 

[ZRaffleticket]

Not sure if now is a good time to but in-- on my own thread :crackup:
Sorry I havent really been getting to posting those pictures, life's been surprisingly busy recently. Once I get my night shots off my camera and etc I'll post them asap

 

[Garoq]

You pay rent for the sole purpose of assembling these? You must be doing a lot of business.

Have you ever looked up our business address on Google Maps? It's not a residence.

It's a shared facility with my rocket business. We also rent an office, a warehouse and some storage units.

 

[Garoq]

GC: A lot of people "pay rent" for business premises.

In practice, that often means:
"I'm allocating 25% of my home mortgage/rent to a business expense, because I have a room where my computer sits, and a workshop where I keep my supplies and build stuff".

It's still a legitimate allocation of these costs, I'm not suggesting otherwise. But it sure gives a different impression when you tell people "I have to pay rent, as overhead for my XYZ business", vs "I do work out of my home, and charge some of my living expenses to the business".

No idea which is which here - the above is just a general comment. I don't know how any of the commenters in this thread are setup.

Though I would note that if you're all buying your G1s from the same expensive source, and one seller can retail it for $45 while you retail it for $100, there's just no way your markup is "modest". Otherwise the $45 seller would be loosing money (unless you're just incredibly inefficient in your business overhead management).

I wish I could buy my G-1s for $45. I pay a bit more than that.

While I do write off an upstairs room at home as an office, we also own and rent commercial facilities for both the rocket and laser business operations.

 

[Garoq]

I was basing my earlier statements on the fact that previously, 2W+ a140 diodes were far more rare.

IIRC for a time the SLII was dropped from having a 2W+ reading, but sold as just 1.8W... please correct me if I'm wrong.

Obviously that's nice the case here since the diode was specifically tested though.

The original SL II was sold as 1.8W +/- 100mW with a standard lens. Over time it became difficult to find enough A140 diodes to meet that spec so we started including a G-1 lens with the bundles.

After the M140 diodes became available we created the SL II SE which has the 2.2W +/- 100mW rating with the G-1, and would also likely meet the original 1.8W spec with a standard lens. The G-1 lens is also included with this bundle.

 

[jayrob]

I wonder how many of the private sellers on this forum are paying taxes on their laser income.

Yeah I think people for the most part just assume that taxes are not a factor...

I have to pay taxes on what I sell. It sucks too...

 

[InfinitusEquitas]

The original SL II was sold as 1.8W +/- 100mW with a standard lens. Over time it became difficult to find enough A140 diodes to meet that spec so we started including a G-1 lens with the bundles.

After the M140 diodes became available we created the SL II SE which has the 2.2W +/- 100mW rating with the G-1, and would also likely meet the original 1.8W spec with a standard lens. The G-1 lens is also included with this bundle.

My bad. I thought it was 1.8W with a G1 originally. That's why I was skeptical when I saw the 2.2W label for this thread. In this case though, it's a binned m140 with a g1, so there isn't any question that it's doing 2W+.

 

[DTR]

I wonder how many of the private sellers on this forum are paying taxes on their laser income.

If you use paypal or ebay you can't avoid it unless you only sell occasionally. 200 items or $20,000 in payments and they report it. I am going to get my ass handed to me come tax time.

 

[Ghostchrome]

Have you ever looked up our business address on Google Maps? It's not a residence.

It's a shared facility with my rocket business. We also rent an office, a warehouse and some storage units.

Yeah I have. I saw that big ol' warehouse and figured that you were probably splitting the rent with another business of yours. I know businesses get creative with their accounting. My point was that it's a bit misleading to say that one of the reasons for the high pricing is that the rent had to be paid. It's already being paid by another business... Nobody needs a warehouse to put together C6 hosts - and I'm assuming that the warehouse is not chock full of Eagle Pair goggles, although I'm sure they share a little bit of the square footage.

Anyway, I'm just arguing now for the hell of it. You're absolutely entitled to charge whatever you want for your products.

 

[Sullivaf]

..........

 

[Garoq]

Yeah I have. I saw that big ol' warehouse and figured that you were probably splitting the rent with another business of yours. I know businesses get creative with their accounting. My point was that it's a bit misleading to say that one of the reasons for the high pricing is that the rent had to be paid. It's already being paid by another business... Nobody needs a warehouse to put together C6 hosts - and I'm assuming that the warehouse is not chock full of Eagle Pair goggles, although I'm sure they share a little bit of the square footage.

Anyway, I'm just arguing now for the hell of it. You're absolutely entitled to charge whatever you want for your products.

That building is a personally owned manufacturing facility and I actually collect rent from the rocket business.

We also rent a 4,800 square foot warehouse that is used exclusively for the rocket business.

Our office space across the street is rented and is used for both. Other rented storage is exclusively SL.

I pay rent and plenty of other non-direct expenses from the SL checking account.

Both product lines are priced to have about the same gross margins.

Since the companies are S corporations everything hits me personally at the end of the year.

Now let's see YOUR financial statements.

 

[rhd]

I say SL needs to make a living and doesnt work for $0.25 / hr we need to support our AMERICAN companies and pay a little more for things or in a few years we wont even be able to afford the cheap China stuff.

Buy American! Pay more, get better quality and service and save our jobs!

I'm pretty sure neither DTR nor Jayrob work for $0.25 / hr, and both are AMERICAN. Yet both manage to sell their G1/G2 lenses for ~$50 instead of $100.

If this was a $100 from US vs $50 from China argument, I'd get your point. But here, we have at least 3 laserites selling G1/G2, and they're getting the parts from the same source (I read this somewhere). In this scenario all 3 sellers are US-based, and have substantial credibility and customer service.

Two of those sellers sell the lens for around $50
One of those sellers marks it up to $100

Done, that's it. That's our fact base here. This isn't a China v USA debate. IF the overhead of SL's operations really cause the extra 100% markup, then they're the worst business organizers on the planet.

 

[jayrob]

Here's a couple of facts about the lenses to help you understand about some of the differences in pricing...

The 405-G-1 glass lens that I sell, is the same as the G2. The only difference, is that the G2 is from a different supplier. Slightly different coating. But the exact same lens design. Same output potential. I tested the G2 long ago, and if was any better, then I would have changed over.

The real difference, is in the mounting of the lenses. I mount my lens assembly into a machined out AixiZ nut, and also enlarge the entry aperture to allow maximum light from the diode into the lens.

The G2 from DTR is a few bucks cheaper than my G1 assembly, but it is not mounted the same. His is basically just put into the bottom of the lens nut, and held in place with the tiny threaded retaining ring. So in other words, the retaining ring is the entry aperture, and is not enlarged. (like I do with my modification)

That said, it's still a good set up for the price. I spend quite a bit of extra time for the mounting of my set up, and thus the extra cost.

Now, in defense of Garoq, I think he is just trying to offer the best options. He buys his 405-G-1 glass lens assemblies direct from me. He marks them up, and bundles them in a package deal with his kits. (and also offers them stand alone, and I'm guessing his stand alone profit is higher than when bundled with a kit) He probably has many other customers from other sources besides LPF, and I'm sure his overhead for his business is quite a bit larger...

 

[rhd]

Now, in defense of Garoq, I think he is just trying to offer the best options. He buys his 405-G-1 glass lens assemblies direct from me. He marks them up, and bundles them in a package deal with his kits. (and also offers them stand alone, and I'm guessing his stand alone profit is higher than when bundled with a kit) He probably has many other customers from other sources besides LPF, and I'm sure his overhead for his business is quite a bit larger...

I feel a lot better about this knowing that Garoq is buying them from you, because in my mind this provides an explanation for what's going on. I wish Garoq had said this up front, instead of suggesting (in post 23) that SL was buying the lenses from the same source as you guys.

I'm less offending by them selling for $100, something they've purchased from you for around $50. That's actually still quite a bit of markup, but it's a lot more reasonable to sell for $100, something purchased for $50, versus selling for $100 something purchased for $25, especially when others are selling the same for $50.

That clarification largely removes any complaint I have. Thanks Jayrob.

 

[Sullivaf]

.......