FAKE 150mW Nichia diodes being sold

[FrostyTheDadMan]

If you want these diodes to run at 280 mW and last their full life you must pulse the current at a rate of 25 Mhz
I have the only PW driver for these hand held lasers and my testing results on a phr803t Reject is 209 mA that ran for almost 1 hour with no fail I would have ran it longer but my battery's were dieing. the diode still lives!!!!!
you can find the facts here http://www.***************.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1873&page=10
After the testing is completed the only place you will be able to get them is at LSP
they are My Design I have been working on the Pulse Drive that I call The Mighty Micro Drive for over a year now and finally got them to the testing point Daguin had agreed to be one of the testers even though he disagreed with me about the results that I expect. thats why he is one I am counting on the most. If I can make him a believer then I know they will be the best Driver.

 

[FrostyTheDadMan]

(laser enthusiast, The Mighty Micro Drive) here is a pic of the MMD running a PHR803t and my multimeter is set to Amps and It reads 0.209 I could push it higher but that will shorten the life of the Diode
http://i520.photobucket.com/albums/w327/FrostyTheDadMan/DSCF6066.jpg?t=1249174522

 

[IgorT]

Dan;
The datasheet for the 250mw peak LD shows some interesting data.

The typical operating voltage is only 4.1 VDC at 200mw of power.

You're talking about http://www.nichia.com/specification/ld/NDHV220APA-E.pdf - This is a 250mW Max CW diode.

But it's a multimode diode.... Without a FAC-microlens installed inside the can by the manufacturer, it would be pretty much useless for us.


Maybe the fact that it is a multimode is the reason for the strangely low Vf at it's rated CW power...

In any case, it is not representative of the diodes we normally use.

 

[IgorT]

If you want these diodes to run at 280 mW and last their full life you must pulse the current at a rate of 25 Mhz.

Sure, but i don't expect them to live to their full life, when driven above their CW ratings.

I would however expect MOST OF THEM to survive 150mW CW for 1000h+ if they were actually rated for that power.

And i would expect them to be capable of trading some of this life for even more power, just like all the others were so far, including the 100mW Nichia.


But these could not do that, that's the problem....




P.S. If you are looking for testers for a pulsed driver, then contact me. I have no interest in copying it, but i would not mind testing it.

Do please elaborate on the expected results thing, but do so in an email if you could, in the meanwhile i will check out the links you posted.


This thread is about something else entirelly however.

 

[IgorT]

OPINION: I think these are genuine Nichia 120mW diodes,

They may be rated for 120mW Pulsed, but that is probably the most, unless further testing/comparing should show closer resemblance to 4x's, in which case 75/150? :thinking:

The 120mW Nichia in that datasheet is a case-negative design with an internal photo diode... We have not yet seen any case-negative 405nm diodes with PDs inside..

All diodes we tested so far were floating-pin.


But a 120mW CW Nichia diode would be a great thing to have... It should be completelly equivalent to GGWs in power and toughness, but with a rounder beam.

 

[FrostyTheDadMan]

Sure, but i don't expect them to live to their full life, when driven above their CW ratings.

I would however expect MOST OF THEM to survive 150mW CW for 1000h+ if they were actually rated for that power.

And i would expect them to be capable of trading some of this life for even more power, just like all the others were so far, including the 100mW Nichia.


But these could not do that, that's the problem....




P.S. If you are looking for testers for a pulsed driver, then contact me. I have no interest in copying it, but i would not mind testing it.

Do please elaborate on the expected results thing, but do so in an email if you could, in the meanwhile i will check out the links you posted.


This thread is about something else entirelly however.

How would you even Know if it could last 1000 hours you pushed it to its death, you pushed it past its Pulsed Wave ratings with a Constant Wave driver! What are you thinking!!!!! I think you need to leave the Laser Research to the people that understand Electronic components because you don't have the basic concept of electronics! That's like putting an 1171 blower on a stock 10 year old engine. :tsk: you will blow it up!
and this thread shows me how much you talk out your Brown Eye!!!!!

yes it is how fake you are!!!! STFU

 

[pullbangdead]

How would you even Know if it could last 1000 hours you pushed it to its death, you pushed it past its Pulsed Wave ratings with a Constant Wave driver! What are you thinking!!!!! I think you need to leave the Laser Research to the people that understand Electronic components because you don't have the basic concept of electronics! That's like putting an 1171 blower on a stock 10 year old engine. :tsk: you will blow it up!
and this thread shows me how much you talk out your Brown Eye!!!!!

yes it is how fake you are!!!! STFU

Dude, chill out.

 

[FrostyTheDadMan]

Dude, chill out.

Man It Just really upsets me when some one is Dising some one with out proper cause and then he wants a refund!
LSP is one place I have found to be more then fair.
this guy will go out of his way to be fair
So unless the thread starter knows for a fact and can prove that Nichia did not make them by some micro printing on them he had no wright to use the word Fake and if they are real Nichia Diodes LSP has good grounds for a Lawsuit in which LPF and the thread starter of this thread could be named as defendants
But I dont see LSP doing that only because he is to nice of a person, so people take advantage of his kindness.
AND THAT MAKES ME SO MAD
I mean by his own findings he has proven the data sheet to be correct and he is still complaining in stead of being apologetic
So please excuse me if I have offended any one

 

[pullbangdead]

Look at this LIV curve from post #1.

This diode DOES NOT function properly if it is promised to be a rated for 150mW CW usage for 1000+ hours. It cannot be consistent, it is in no way linear in the typical operating regime. If this diode is promised to be usable in CW operation all the way up to 150mW, then it is either not functioning properly or is not actually rated for 150mW CW operation.

Am I missing something?

And even if the stuff is a little fuzzy or you find some error in reasoning or testing, there's no need for the "stfu" or any of the other trash talking. Constructive criticism, please.

 

[lasersbee]

Not to argue with you PBD... but the Chart that IgorT extrapolated
from The Monk's data on IgorT's Post #47
shows the same LD to be about twice power...:undecided:

On the 1st post chart the kink is at around 85mW...
and on The Monk's data it is around 155mW...:thinking:

All I'm saying is... there is not enough sampling of these LDs to be sure
which chart is the closest..

Jerry

 

[pullbangdead]

^I'd certainly agree with that, that we just don't know at this point.

And are you speaking of this chart? If so, and these diodes are supposed to be max 150mW CW-rated diodes, then I would argue that this diode is still not functioning properly. In normal operation, the laser's L-I curve should be linear throughout it's entire operating regime. So from looking at this chart, this diode also does not function as advertised if it is supposed to operate for 1000+ hours at 150mW. I would argue that if the L-I isn't linear all the way up to the advertised max power/current, then the laser doesn't work as advertised.

This one is much closer than the other chart, though. MUCH closer.

ETA: I was reading across a line on this one, the "kink" on it is above 150mW, so technically I would say this one would kindof maybe "work as advertised". I mean this one is seriously cutting it close. Since a diode should be able to hold it's rated power for some lifetime, I wouldn't expect them to leave such little leeway as this diode has. It really is just barely above 150mW where that kink hits at this particular temperature. Remember these diodes are rated for operation from 0 to 50 C on that data sheet. The change in temperature WILL change the power at which that kink happens for this diode, and I would wager that this diode would not go all the way to 150mW at all temperatures from 0 to 50 C. So while this 25C plot shows the diode barely making it past it's max operating power, I'm not certain that this diode is a properly-functioning 150mW CW-rated diode. So, my guess is that it's either not functioning properly, or not actually a diode rated for 150mW. I mean maybe it is, and I'm just missing something. But isn't that what all this is about? Getting the right info so we know what the things actually are?

 

[Meatball]

Man It Just really upsets me when some one is Dising some one with out proper cause and then he wants a refund!
LSP is one place I have found to be more then fair.
this guy will go out of his way to be fair
So unless the thread starter knows for a fact and can prove that Nichia did not make them by some micro printing on them he had no wright to use the word Fake and if they are real Nichia Diodes LSP has good grounds for a Lawsuit in which LPF and the thread starter of this thread could be named as defendants
But I dont see LSP doing that only because he is to nice of a person, so people take advantage of his kindness.
AND THAT MAKES ME SO MAD
I mean by his own findings he has proven the data sheet to be correct and he is still complaining in stead of being apologetic
So please excuse me if I have offended any one

This is not an attack on the seller. This is not an attack on anybody. Simple tests have been made to the diode, which do not line up with what the seller claims the results to be- whether the seller did it on purpose or not isn't the issue here. If anyone is the victim, its the L-S-P seller. Who is taking advantage of his kindness? Kind people get tricked too.

 

[IgorT]

In my opinion... according to TheMonk's chart... I can't see anything not up to spec...

I'm sure Nichia would disagree strongly, seeing a kink there.. I sure hope that they reply... They might be interested in what is sold under their name.


Otherwise, the spec-sheet of the 150mW Nichia says Ith: 50-70mA.

The three tested diodes all had 30mA threshold current. In the comparison plots, you can clearly see that the higher power 100mW Nichia and the GGW have higher thresholds. A 150mW diode would have a higher threshold still.


According to the datasheet MUCH higher in fact! I already mentioned that the threshold currents are good indicators of a diode's power rating, but haven't pointed this discrepancy out yet specifically.


Also, the Vf of these diodes went above 6V during the tests, which again should not happen according to the datasheet, and didn't happen with the 100mW Nichia.. Even as it was producing near 300mW raw power, the forward voltage remained at 5.5V, staying within what the spec sheet suggested, even when going outside it's rated pulsed power.



The spec sheet does not belong to the tested diode.



But i guess it'll take seeing a real 150mW diode, before everyone will be convinced. Until then look at the 8x graphs for what to expect..

 

[FrostyTheDadMan]

people need to understand mass-production they can only test 10 out of 10,000
If you look at the MMD post on LEF I have tested about 7 diffrent phr803t and each one ran at different mA the lowest at around 170 ma PW some 200 ma PW and the cream of the crop 250 ma PW.
I have even found a phr803t in a 6X sled and that's only because it is a very good quality Diode to good to be in a 2X or 4X sled. Things that you people are not concerting that each part of the diode cannot be exactly the same and these are the newer so the technology is not even close to perfect like the 808 nm which has been around for some time so they have been able to get the higher quality and more consistent Quality
Also as LaserBEE posted
------------------------------------------------------------------

Not to argue with you PBD... but the Chart that IgorT extrapolated
from The Monk's data on IgorT's Post #47
shows the same LD to be about twice power...

On the 1st post chart the kink is at around 85mW...
and on The Monk's data it is around 155mW...

All I'm saying is... there is not enough sampling of these LDs to be sure
which chart is the closest..
------------------------------------------------------------------
So your chart doesn't mean any thing until you have tested at least 1000 of the same diodes as the manufacture does on a daily basis then you will have a good idea of the diodes capability.

 

[jayrob]

All he is doing is comparing them against other diodes like the GGW 6X diode and the 100mW Nichia diode.

Which by the way, we don't have many tests on either. But the GGW 6X has proven to be pretty consistent, and expectations are very reliable...

For sure, much more testers are needed. Remember what happened with the SF-AW210 diodes? Some are 'HOT' but don't last long, and some are less than the GGW 6X. Very inconsistent compared to the GGW's.

Anyway, I think we all can agree that the GGW-H20L graphs, as well as the BDR-203 graphs, can be used as a good guide for expectations and comparisons...
Jay

 

[FrostyTheDadMan]

Anyway, I think we all can agree that the GGW-H20L graphs, as well as the BDR-203 graphs, can be used as a good guide for expectations and comparisons...
Jay

Hay Jay How you been long time no type.
Well I have found a Phr803t Diode in a GGW-H20L sled. Explain that one.
that was one that ran at 244 mA and it was comparable to my 6X almost better.