Old 11-24-2014, 09:36 PM #33
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

Four years ago I was on a design team for a new form of "dazzler". I cant comment on design but I can speak to some generalizations.

A few things you need to know.


1.Mainly effective as a warning/distraction device at vehicle checkpoints at long range.
2.Generally injures stupid operators who look into the bore of their own unit or aim at companions/get reflections. (lots of own team injuries at first)
3. Good for countering optical aiming, although the bad guys develop cheap countermeasures.
4. The 18.5 Hz blink does not really disrupt the human brain as claimed.
5. We quickly abandoned lasers for incoherent sources (special arc lamp)
6. If your bad guy has any combat experience or is on drugs, flashing these just can make them madder. Has some minor effectiveness if they are very tired, very scared, or weak.
7. Leads the perp/sniper/bullet right to you.
8. After one exposure you get up and fight past it.
9. Useful units generally have to include a distance sensing safety circuit to prevent injury, devices that are truly eye-safe up close are somewhat ineffective.
10. Cops have proven that huge car mounted light bars help far more then handhelds.
11. Its going to hurt when superior force turns around and uses your own unit on you. Best to have insurance, too.
Humans usually survive fights, but from a legal point of view, damaging an eye opens you to a whole new level of liability.

A 30$ high intensity flash light does the same thing at civil combat distances.

As most civilian combat is within a few meters, by the time you reach for your blinder, your toast. Making this whole thread a moot point. Better to avoid contact with the enemy in the first place. Especially when its likely to be two or three on one. Better to be Obi Wan/Yoda and know how to avoid/ when to flee.

This sort of hardware is Very useful in medium range military situations, in civilian situations, not so much at all.

Daddy Rant Mode:

To the OP, I've been around a long time. Your attitude suggests you are sub-consciously looking for trouble. You might want to reconsider why you want to carry all this stuff. Then just take the care to avoid such situations in the first place.
Things like ALICE Training stress situational awareness, avoidance, and pre-planning. Pros avoid one on ones without back-up.

End Daddy Mode.

"Non-Violence is the Sword That Heals" Martin Luther King.


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Old 11-24-2014, 09:50 PM #34
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

I think I'd be more likely to use my 445 to physically bludgeon someone than shine it at them, but I have used it before as a light source by defocussing it almost fully and it was surprisingly effective, and I imagine it would dazzle but not blind at enough of a distance, say 10 or more metres away.
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Old 11-24-2014, 10:09 PM #35
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

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Originally Posted by crashmidget View Post
and have been properly sprayed by the police while being arrested. I will say this, when I was sprayed, it was horrible. The only time I have ever feared for my life was when I got a healthy dose of OC spray from the police. It's not your eyes that hurt, that comes later.
When the police spayed me, they had already subdued and handcuffed me, I was face down on the ground, handcuffed behind my back and motionless. They were able to very precisely put the can directly in front of my face, and sprayed each eye individually.
Quote:
Originally Posted by crashmidget View Post
I own;
Taser X26 (legal for civilian to own and carry with FID Card in my state)
Tiberius Arms Tac 8 (w/Pepperball Kit) not legal for me to carry
Various Pepper Sprays, up to 1lb can of Bear Spray and 9oz can PepperGEL
JPX Jet Protector (A Tazer substitute, fires pepper spray 20' @ 400mph)
Lots of high power, quality flashlights including my favorite, the
Surefire UB3T Invictus (1000 lumens and strobe mode)-will mess you up!
I also have firearms in the home, I tend to lean towards my Remington 870 short barrel and have a variety of ammo including these special rounds Multiple Impact Ammunition Which if you haven't seen...you have to check it out...uber cool!

After having experience with all of these different types of defensive "tools", I have found that while each has their strengths, they also all suffer from a variety of limitations. ~ Crash

This is the type of stuff that makes me really question your character and your need for all these lethal and non lethal force gadgets. A lot of what you own and the little I can understand about you reminds me of a couple bounty hunter power tripping whack jobs I used to work with. Obsessed with weapons and they could name every single part, ammo, sights, ext of their insane arsenal scattered about their home for some paranoid induced never coming battle to the death. I'm really not trying to be rude but I have little time for these types. My biggest fear would not be some eternal hell, not that i believe in such nonsense, but instead being forced to walk around a Gun Show for all eternity. I wont pretend to know how you are in real life but a lot of what your'e collecting sounds in alignment with those kinds of people.
"You can pry my gun outta my cold dead hand" kinda folk.

What I wonder is why does the state allow you to carry all these weapons on your person? What do you mean you have experience using these "tools" as you put it? It sounds concerning that you did something serious enough with violence to be arrested or detained and pepper sprayed by the police but are still allowed to posses and carry a firearm and other weapons as you stated?

I'm trying to understand if you work in law enforcement or protective services or are just paranoid. Because I have worked with some pretty serious SF professionals in the military and they don't really go on about it like this. Its usually the unstable ones that are obsessed with gadgets and weapons because they think about it constantly. Its a scary type of person that stock piles weapons without real need for them IMO.
Do what is in your constitutional right to do mate as its not for me to stop that but I would hate to see a person that thinks about how to harm other as a past time receive help in their agenda to use devices of this awesome hobby to inflict intentional harm on people.

Sorry I know this is pretty rude but you're words are not at all what I am used to seeing around the forum.

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Old 11-24-2014, 10:13 PM #36
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

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Originally Posted by trencheel303 View Post
I think I'd be more likely to use my 445 to physically bludgeon someone than shine it at them, but I have used it before as a light source by defocussing it almost fully and it was surprisingly effective, and I imagine it would dazzle but not blind at enough of a distance, say 10 or more metres away.
Study up on "Nominal Ocular Hazard Distance", please.

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Old 11-24-2014, 10:26 PM #37
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

"To the OP, I've been around a long time. Your attitude suggests you are sub-consciously looking for trouble. You might want to reconsider why you want to carry all this stuff. Then just take the care to avoid such situations in the first place. Things like ALICE Training stress avoidance and pre-planning. Pros avoid one on ones without back-up." LSRFAQ

To respond to LSRFAQ, I am very appreciative of the information you provided. It's exactly the kind of real world data that I am interested in. I do understand your perspective with respect to me "sub-consciously looking for trouble", your instincts on this one may be off however. I am not just a civilian who likes to play around with weapons and dreams up scenarios where I am attacked and need to defend myself...etc. The truth is that I have rarely ever found myself in situations that I could not simply avoid or walk away from. As for my interest in all of this "tech" stuff, I am an Industrial Designer by both education and profession. My first Bachelors of Science covers electro-mechanincal engineering and material science, and my second Bachelors of Science is in Industrial Design. Problem solving is what I am all about, it's what Industrial Design is all about. As a designer, my areas of interest tend towards technology in all its forms, and how it interacts with human factors. I am also an avid outdoors guy in every possible sense. From camping to caving, climbing and scuba diving, flying sailplanes and hang-gliders, I love everything outdoors and the more tech it is the more I seem to like it.

My interest here is absolutely not in anyway related to any desire, sub-conscious or otherwise to go looking for "trouble". As a designer I am always driven to push the boundaries of whatever project I am working on. In this case, it happens to be the effectiveness of lasers as a less-than-lethal deterrent, and the usability in terms of the human factors that are involved with defending yourself from an attack.

One last thing, I am interested in your experience with "dazzler" type devices. You mentioned that they were not very effective, and that a determined person or someone on drugs maybe able to simple "adjust" to the glare and push through it. If you were working with any military or law enforcement applications in mind, you were obviously bound by strict guidelines such as the Geneva Convention with respect to causing permanent damage etc. Do you think the effectiveness of a "dazzler" would be significantly increased if you were allowed to use more powerful lasers? The B.E. Myers Glare devices for example come in the low hundreds of milliwatts. Moral, ethical and legal boundaries aside, how effective do think a "dazzler" might be if it were 2 or 3 watts?
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Old 11-24-2014, 10:59 PM #38
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

I'm going to leave you with a different thought.

Dazzlers in combat were/are part of "hearts and minds", NOT for superiority on the battlefield.

Quoting my ex boss: "Give me something so our Guys do not have to wrestle with the moral consequences of pulling the trigger. Let them have peace of mind knowing they have done everything they can before they do that. "

More power is NOT the answer. I'm a certified LSO, I'm inclined to not to comment further. One thing about our team, we had to stand in front of whatever we created, and we did.

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Old 11-24-2014, 11:52 PM #39
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

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Originally Posted by crashmidget View Post
The officers really did handcuff me, face down, then squirt the OC in each
eye. I have to agree that the officers were way out of line, especially being that all I had done was stop some scumbag from assaulting a woman. In this case, I was with a few people for a birthday night out. I was definitely drunk and definitely not on my best behavior. That said, when we went to the next bar, the bouncer started right in with one of the women we were with. They apparently had been together and had broken it off some time ago. He was being a real prick, saying nasty things to her and we were all standing there with our ID's waiting to get in. Eventually she tried to walk away and he grabbed her....that was when I got involved. I'm not a huge guy, but I can make my presence known when I have to. She told him to let her go and he didn't, so I told him to let her go....and he didn't. That's when I very gently removed his hand from hers by the wrist.

I though that settled it, we all went in, drank, sang some karaoke and all was well for an hour or so. Then, the bouncer ambushed me while coming out of the bathroom with 2 other guys and they were not so gentle. I don't remember, but my friend said that they had basically lifted me up, and opened the double doors with my face? Anyway, they got rough outside, they were all bouncers and a few cops were around. I don't know exactly when the cop arrived, all I know is that 3 big men were slamming up against a wall and trying to hurt me. I just did what came natural. I threw all of them off of me, the cop included (although I didn't know it) and ran. The cops chased me into an alley, put a good beatin on me and then you know the rest.

I don't really hold it against the cops, they were out of line but cops aren't terrible bright in general so I don't expect much from them. The bouncer however was a different story. I made a good living so I hired the best attorney money could buy.....and let me just tell all of you who may have any doubts, if you have money, you get treated very differently. I was in
a major city, it was hours of waiting to stand before the judge every time you went to court. There dozens of people on the roster. My fancy expensive attorney did the same thing all three times I had to appear. We showed up late as hell, she walked right up to the DA, ahead of a very long line, they chatted for a minute or two, then they went straight to the judge, said a few words, and we left. I never once had to stand before the judge, nor did I ever spend more than 10 minutes in that courtroom.

At the end of the day, for charges of assault on the bouncer, assault on the police officer, resisting arrest and public intoxication just to round it all out, I never ever saw the judge and my record.....what record? It never even happened. I hate to say it, but this is a very unfair legal system we have.

they were all bouncers and a few cops were around. I don't know exactly when the cop arrived
---cops? cop?

all I know is that 3 big men were slamming up against a wall and trying to hurt me.
---"slamming "me"" perhaps??

it was hours of waiting* to stand before the judge** every time you went to court.
---you? (I know, this one I am being picky with)

We showed up late as hell***

she walked right up to the DA, ahead of a very long line***
---there was a long line so late in the day? a line actually? I doubt that, so how do you even know where you are on the "line" or within the list.

I never once had to stand before the judge**, nor did I ever spend more than 10 minutes* in that courtroom


At the end of the day, for charges of assault on the bouncer, assault on the police officer, resisting arrest
---you charged the bouncer? you charged the cop?

and public intoxication just to round it all out, I never ever saw the judge** and my record.....what record?
---Cheers dude! you said it was hours of waiting to see the judge!!

It never even happened. I hate to say it, but this is a very unfair legal system we have
---It's unfair because you lost out on the assault charges against the bouncer and cop?

crashmidget, I'm confused.
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Old 11-25-2014, 12:39 AM #40
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

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So your saying you would use this if some one was coming at you to do you harm, how far away are they when you pull it out and dazzle them with it ?

if they are like 20 feet and unarmed wouldn't it be safe to say you are not in immediate danger ?

And if they are armed wouldn't you rather have a fire arm ? nothing like taking a knife to a gun fight

What if the guy was wearing dark sunglasses would your laser have any effect on him ?

And since you don't have a gun a knife or a bat with you and only a laser what's to stop him from walking right up and giving you a karate chop to the jugular ?

I think you better start carrying one of your guns around if you are that paranoid and remember just because your paranoid doesn't mean there not after you

I mean really using a laser as a weapon is not a good idea in any case.

leave the laser in it's case and we won't have to worry about some one else making the laws even more restrictive than they are now
Fp brings up very valid points. Some time ago, some company (I think it maI have been wickedlasers?) Sold something similar for self defense/police use. It was a 75mW 532 that was defocused, and the idea was, just like you are thinking (and supposedly iI worked), the light would temporary obscure the assailants vision while disorienting them. But IIRC it was supposed to be used at something like 50 feet.
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Old 11-25-2014, 03:09 AM #41
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

To the OP, I don't see how lasers will help you in other similar situations you just described to us.
Carry a concealed video recorder and if you survive the next one you will have video evidence to use in court.
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Old 11-25-2014, 03:35 AM #42
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

Quote:
Originally Posted by LaserCo View Post
they were all bouncers and a few cops were around. I don't know exactly when the cop arrived
---cops? cop?

all I know is that 3 big men were slamming up against a wall and trying to hurt me.
---"slamming "me"" perhaps??

it was hours of waiting* to stand before the judge** every time you went to court.
---you? (I know, this one I am being picky with)

We showed up late as hell***

she walked right up to the DA, ahead of a very long line***
---there was a long line so late in the day? a line actually? I doubt that, so how do you even know where you are on the "line" or within the list.

I never once had to stand before the judge**, nor did I ever spend more than 10 minutes* in that courtroom


At the end of the day, for charges of assault on the bouncer, assault on the police officer, resisting arrest
---you charged the bouncer? you charged the cop?

and public intoxication just to round it all out, I never ever saw the judge** and my record.....what record?
---Cheers dude! you said it was hours of waiting to see the judge!!

It never even happened. I hate to say it, but this is a very unfair legal system we have
---It's unfair because you lost out on the assault charges against the bouncer and cop?

crashmidget, I'm confused.

Ok, without dragging this completely off topic story out any further. I was in Indianapolis in a part of the city known as Broadripple. It's where all the bars are and everyone hangs out at night. They even close off part of the street. It's a rather small area, maybe 3 city blocks long, and there is a constant police presence at all times. The bouncer who was being nasty and put his hands on the girl didn't do anything after I pulled his hand off of her. We were a bunch of people, drunk, on our way in to drink some more. The bouncer just went back to doing whatever it was he was doing before we arrived. At some point, about an hour later, I went into the rear of the bar to use the bathroom. When I came out, the bounce (John Ambiz is his name) was standing there with two other guys. They had matching yellow shirts on so I assumed they were also bouncers, perhaps from there, or maybe next door, who knows. They dragged me out of the bar and as my friend later told me, they "opened the double doors with my face" and then took me aside of the entrance, all three of them seemed to have hands on me in one way or another, and I was trying to get them off of me. That made them push, slam, crush...whatever you want to call it even harder. I was very drunk. Somehow I threw them off of me, or maybe I just got lucky and slipped away somehow...? I started running across the street towards an alley, that was when I noticed there was a police officer in the mix chasing me. He actually threw his baton at me and left quite a mark on my back, I don't know what he was aiming for but I would guess either my head or my feet.
After that I got maybe half a block down the alley before he caught me, threw me into a chain link fence, completely ripped and ruined my favorite t-shirt...a white one with a BIG Slim Jim logo on it. The rest is as I said.

As for the court. When you are arraigned and released on bail, you are given a specific date and time to appear in court. In a major city, their are a lot of people and things get backed up quickly.....maybe you've had to wait at the doctors office? Same thing. The lawyers usually get preference over the people without lawyers because lawyers get paid for their time. Without a lawyer, you get the public defender, and his job sucks. The lawyers have to wait for their clients who are not usually punctual, and eventually a messy queue forms. It can take a very long time to get through the queue. This is where my very expensive lawyer was able to have me meet her at her office across the street from the courthouse at whatever time she told me to be there, regardless of my assigned time. We would go to the courtroom, she would have me wait in the back, she would then walk right past everyone else, through what is officially known as the "bar", the dividing line between the gallery, and the actual parties involved in the case. Only the parties involved, their respective attorneys and witnesses are permitted beyond pass
beyond the "bar" She would just walk right through everyone waiting their turn, through the "bar" and straight up to the prosecutor. They would have a few words, then approach the judge, have a few more words, and then she would simply collect me waiting at the back of the gallery and we'd leave. This happened 3 times, and I never crossed the "bar", spoke to the prosecutor, or stood before the judge. All charges were dropped and thus expunged from my record.

What exactly is it that you don't understand? It's not even a great story, nothing all that interesting happened. I simply felt like sharing my personal experience with literally buying my way out of trouble, something that is not supposed to be possible in our legal system. In retrospect, I can't even remember what compelled me to share the story in the first place?

These forum threads sure do get weird after a while....one minute you're
talking tech and learning cool stuff you didn't know, the next minute you're getting abused by the police and being called a liar lol~ No worries, I don't take it personally, I do however find the evolution of these threads very interesting.

If you stick around this one long enough, I'll tell you about the time I was kidnapped by the government because I had secret knowledge about an alien spacecraft that they had recovered in the rubble of the Twin Towers. Since I was the only one who had ever been contacted by these aliens before, they assumed I knew how to use the craft. They forced me to become one with the machine so that they could use it to for their own nefarious purposes. I was forced to do horrible things against my will until I eventually escaped by faking my own death, and being shot out of the craft Spock style into the ocean. I was eventually rescued by a floating volleyball and taken to the nearest FedEx facility to be shipped back to my house. Only they screwed up the tracking number so no one was home to sign for me when I arrived. I had to spend 3 more days in a FedEx crate before I finally got signed for and released. Things just haven't been the same since.....
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Old 11-25-2014, 03:43 AM #43
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

So you say you know the hobby is on thin ice and yet you bring this kind of stuff up again You know we have been down this road many times,
maybe you should learn how to use the search function and you might not have to bring this up for the umpteenth time


Quote:
Originally Posted by crashmidget View Post
I also want to reiterate that if this thread is making people uncomfortable, or if it strays to far towards topics we really should avoid, I encourage the admins to delete the thread. The last thing I want to do is bring any negative attention to our hobby which I fear is already on thin ice....


Well sorry to hear that but I must say I am 61 years old and never been handcuffed or even in the back of the police car so I must be doing something right
it would seem your judgment is not the best esp when your drunk, and speaking of such would you be using your laser blinder while so

I must say if I was the bad guy and you pulled out your laser blinder I would immediately not look directly at it but at the ground and I would
follow the beam directly to you and then I'd pull out my knife and cut the wire leading to your battery, So there

Every one have a good day


Quote:
Originally Posted by crashmidget View Post
The officers really did handcuff me, face down, then squirt the OC in each
eye. I have to agree that the officers were way out of line, especially being that all I had done was stop some scumbag from assaulting a woman. In this case, I was with a few people for a birthday night out. I was definitely drunk and definitely not on my best behavior. That said, when we went to the next bar, the bouncer started right in with one of the women we were with. They apparently had been together and had broken it off some time ago. He was being a real prick, saying nasty things to her and we were all standing there with our ID's waiting to get in. Eventually she tried to walk away and he grabbed her....that was when I got involved. I'm not a huge guy, but I can make my presence known when I have to. She told him to let her go and he didn't, so I told him to let her go....and he didn't. That's when I very gently removed his hand from hers by the wrist.

I though that settled it, we all went in, drank, sang some karaoke and all was well for an hour or so. Then, the bouncer ambushed me while coming out of the bathroom with 2 other guys and they were not so gentle. I don't remember, but my friend said that they had basically lifted me up, and opened the double doors with my face? Anyway, they got rough outside, they were all bouncers and a few cops were around. I don't know exactly when the cop arrived, all I know is that 3 big men were slamming up against a wall and trying to hurt me. I just did what came natural. I threw all of them off of me, the cop included (although I didn't know it) and ran. The cops chased me into an alley, put a good beatin on me and then you know the rest.

I don't really hold it against the cops, they were out of line but cops aren't terrible bright in general so I don't expect much from them. The bouncer however was a different story. I made a good living so I hired the best attorney money could buy.....and let me just tell all of you who may have any doubts, if you have money, you get treated very differently. I was in
a major city, it was hours of waiting to stand before the judge every time you went to court. There dozens of people on the roster. My fancy expensive attorney did the same thing all three times I had to appear. We showed up late as hell, she walked right up to the DA, ahead of a very long line, they chatted for a minute or two, then they went straight to the judge, said a few words, and we left. I never once had to stand before the judge, nor did I ever spend more than 10 minutes in that courtroom.

At the end of the day, for charges of assault on the bouncer, assault on the police officer, resisting arrest and public intoxication just to round it all out, I never ever saw the judge and my record.....what record? It never even happened. I hate to say it, but this is a very unfair legal system we have.
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Old 11-25-2014, 05:41 AM #44
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

Somewhere else in this forum I read about how the invisible IR lasers pop someone’s eyeball after directing it towards them. Big danger with these is that the eye(lid) does not react on the IR so the victim/intruder gets the full load on his eye without knowing, at the moment it happens and where its coming from, till his eye explodes. Seems all very irresponsible to use except when the world turns in to a dark age where zombie attacks are the daily thing. By the way there are already some animals around that inject their victims with a substance that makes their victims zombies AND there is a bacteria around that has already 40% of humanity infected and makes the victims stupid, reacting slower and making constantly the wrong decisions. Sounds already very similar to a zombie virus.

In case you want to use the IR, as you already tested yourself, don’t use it in combination with a PVS 7 Gen 3 night vision goggles as it will give no protection to your own eyes. In that case you have to wear your laser 800+Nm goggles on top of your Night Vision goggles and I assume that will intervene with each other and make’s your NV goggles useless. Also a FLIR camera in front of you wearing a 800+ Nm protection goggle will not work as the heat of the IR laser seems to low to be seen on the FLIR camera. But again in night time outside in the scenario of a zombie attack the only way you damage your own eyes will be when the zombie’s wearing reflective suits or attachments on their clothes.
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Old 11-25-2014, 06:18 AM #45
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

Quote:
Originally Posted by crashmidget View Post
If you stick around this one long enough, I'll tell you about the time I was kidnapped by the government because I had secret knowledge about an alien spacecraft that they had recovered in the rubble of the Twin Towers. Since I was the only one who had ever been contacted by these aliens before, they assumed I knew how to use the craft. They forced me to become one with the machine so that they could use it to for their own nefarious purposes. I was forced to do horrible things against my will until I eventually escaped by faking my own death, and being shot out of the craft Spock style into the ocean. I was eventually rescued by a floating volleyball and taken to the nearest FedEx facility to be shipped back to my house. Only they screwed up the tracking number so no one was home to sign for me when I arrived. I had to spend 3 more days in a FedEx crate before I finally got signed for and released. Things just haven't been the same since.....
Um... say what now?
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Old 11-25-2014, 06:48 AM #46
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

Quote:
Originally Posted by crashmidget View Post
I'll tell you about the time I was kidnapped by the government because I had secret knowledge about an alien spacecraft that they had recovered in the rubble of the Twin Towers. Since I was the only one who had ever been contacted by these aliens before, they assumed I knew how to use the craft. They forced me to become one with the machine so that they could use it to for their own nefarious purposes. I was forced to do horrible things against my will until I eventually escaped by faking my own death, and being shot out of the craft Spock style into the ocean. I was eventually rescued by a floating volleyball and taken to the nearest FedEx facility to be shipped back to my house. Only they screwed up the tracking number so no one was home to sign for me when I arrived. I had to spend 3 more days in a FedEx crate before I finally got signed for and released. Things just haven't been the same since.....
And meeting the aliens is how you got the idea of using a laser as a weapon! It all makes sense now!
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Old 11-25-2014, 07:41 AM #47
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

Hey, don't be making fake UFO reports, there are enough of them out there already making seeing the trees for the forest difficult enough, but in this case, it is obvious your story was never meant to be taken seriously.
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Old 11-25-2014, 08:11 AM #48
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Default Re: Self-Defense ~ Bear with me for a moment!

I have a question maybe for people in countries as strict as ours. (pepper spray, bb guns and everything else of similar orientation) are illegal here. So can anyone shine some light on things we could use to deter people. I live in a pretty shady part of melbourne. (had people looking through our window at night whilst their car was on and running out the front) That was 3am i ran out with a breaker bar and they legged it. I was going to build a tazer but i can see that ending badly as amps can kill if not set up right. I did also consider laser pointers. But to be honest it seems pointless.
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