Welcome to Laser Pointer Forums - discuss green laser pointers, blue laser pointers, and all types of lasers

Buy Site Supporter Role (remove some ads) | LPF Donations

Links below open in new window

FrozenGate by Avery

Sodium metal

Unfortunately Sigma Aldrich and similar companies will only sell most products to institutions and companies, and they often require detailed verification of your status, so it isn't like you can put up a website and claim you have a business going. I looked into the t-amyl from them and they won't even ship to a residential address, even if you belong to a registered company.

EDIT: Was doing some more research on the sodium hydroxide electrolysis synth and Nurdrage reports that if the molten salt is allowed to exceed 318C it will dissolve the sodium metal into the salt. So it is advised that heat is applied to the salt to get it molten and then as it resolidifies apply current to the electrodes and use the resistive heating to maintain the molten state.
 
Last edited:





Sigurthr said:
Unfortunately Sigma Aldrich and similar companies will only sell most products to institutions and companies, and they often require detailed verification of your status, so it isn't like you can put up a website and claim you have a business going. I looked into the t-amyl from them and they won't even ship to a residential address, even if you belong to a registered company.
Click to expand...

Yup... that's what I thought. Lots of things are just not available anymore because of Homeland security and the growing Meth/drug lab epidemic.
I can look in S.Korea if you want. We have some supply stores that might carry it.
Making Korean copies of American pharmaceuticals is a multibillion industry here so.
How much you want if I can find some?
 
If the price isn't absurd, then 25-100ml would suffice quite well for a long time, given that Nurdrage used 0.1ml increments and typically used 0.5-2ml per batch iirc. Obviously, if you find that it is like $5 for 100ml, I'll gladly accept more, haha. I just can't afford to spend more than about $20 on the tertiary alcohol if I'm going to make it cost effective. Given that I also have to find suitable KOH and Mg turnings/powder.
 
Sigurthr said:
If the price isn't absurd, then 25-100ml would suffice quite well for a long time, given that Nurdrage used 0.1ml increments and typically used 0.5-2ml per batch iirc. Obviously, if you find that it is like $5 for 100ml, I'll gladly accept more, haha. I just can't afford to spend more than about $20 on the tertiary alcohol if I'm going to make it cost effective. Given that I also have to find suitable KOH and Mg turnings/powder.
Click to expand...

The Magnesium is the easy part to get, that's for sure. Magnesium (100%) metal (with a tiny steel core) is used as the anode in hot water heaters.

anode-rod-magnesium.jpg


You could easily make turnings from that. Also Magnesium can be found as
a fire starter brick.

Potassium Hydroxide (Caustic Potash) should be fairly easy to get ahold of.
in fact it's used commonly to crack Biodiesel during production. 5lbs for ~$5.00

Amazon.com: Potassium Hydroxide Flakes Koh, 2 Lbs. (Buy 5 get $5 off): Automotive
 
Last edited:
Seoul_lasers said:
Liquid at room temperature? WOW!! I'd thought this was a "soft" solid..
Sure enough you're right.
This alloy was originally used for a prototype Neutron reactor in the 1960's.
I think no Nuclear Physicist in their right mind is going to be near a device
with NaK as the coolant... just saying..
Sure enough several very large disasters with this coolant led to the program being scrapped.

What I think is even more amazing is that this alloy is being used as a coolant in sealed PC CPU coolers.. yup you heard correctly.

Danamics LMX Superleggera Cooler Review.
Danamics LMX Superleggera Cooler Review. Page 2 - X-bit labs


No way anyone is going to make NaK without a completely inert (Argon) atmosphere.
Oh and if you think you're going to use teflon around it, think again. NaK apparently attacks Teflon easily.
Click to expand...

Wow in CPU Coolers those engineers must have been on some good stuff! Just Crazy :crackup:

I would make NaK in mineral oil or some high density solvent like nurdrage uses it needs only 63°C for K and 98°C for Na to melt :beer:

Sigurthr said:
Unfortunately Sigma Aldrich and similar companies will only sell most products to institutions and companies, and they often require detailed verification of your status, so it isn't like you can put up a website and claim you have a business going. I looked into the t-amyl from them and they won't even ship to a residential address, even if you belong to a registered company.

EDIT: Was doing some more research on the sodium hydroxide electrolysis synth and Nurdrage reports that if the molten salt is allowed to exceed 318C it will dissolve the sodium metal into the salt. So it is advised that heat is applied to the salt to get it molten and then as it resolidifies apply current to the electrodes and use the resistive heating to maintain the molten state.
Click to expand...

I get my chemicals over a friend who works in an institute (Fr***hofer) where I completed a traineeship but here are also some sellers who sell sigma aldrich chemicals to private persons they usually have a term like "if you need other chemicals please ask" on their website I don't which online sellers do this in your country but it's worth a look. Theres simply no way to get liquid crystals or stuff for oleds on ebay or so.
Sometimes I also ask my chemics teacher ;)

A tertiär alcohol shouldn't be hard to get I mean most of them are not connected with anything illegal

Tertiary Alcohol Synthesis Problem - YouTube

synthesis needs even more stuff:(
 
Well, I took the plunge. I figured if I can spend the amount the minimum order of potassium (5g) costs or less and get all of the materials to at least yield an equivalent amount then it is worth the investment. So, if I break 5g of K with only 15ml of t-amyl alcohol (Nurdrage used only 2ml to get several grams) I'll be quite happy. I will have PLENTY of KOH, Mg powder, and paraffin oil for additional attempts, and hopefully S_L can source some more tertiary amyl. I did find some t-butyl on Amazon at $30/litre, but it didn't look too reputable (3rd party seller w/ no feedback).

I much like the idea of only 200C paraffin oil over >300C molten hydroxide, heh.

Besides, I'd love to make a potassium vapor lamp! That's my end goal for the K I synth.
 
Good luck Sig ! :D ,

I've started to get stuff together for my molten hydroxide cell and designing it :D
 
Last edited:
Thanks! Very nice, Twirly! Good luck to you too! We'll both need it.

I may pick up a small Na sample from the same seller you used as the only other sources I know are way more expensive. If I manage to successfully synth potassium I may whip up an induction heater and grab an argon bottle and try for an ampoule of NaK!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
If I had an inert glove box I'd do it. Last I checked Cs is worth more than gold!

Not sure how you seal an ampoule in an Ar atmosphere though.... Lol.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Seoul_lasers said:
Asking someone to syth Caesium are you !!!
Not likely without an Argon atmosphere.

:can:
Click to expand...

No of course not this is HIGHLY DANGEROUS

I was just dreaming loudly;)

I always wanted an ampule of Cs but its so freaking expensive :/

It's so beautiful! --> beauty cesium

[cesium production]... In the same way, the aluminate, carbonate, or hydroxide may be reduced by magnesium.
Click to expand...

Source: http://web.archive.org/web/20070207015229/http://pubs.usgs.gov/of/2004/1432/2004-1432.pdf

maybe I'll try it with one or two grams of CsOH in a controlled environment


Edit: There's also a Cs laser which is highly efficient http://spie.org/x8759.xml
 
Last edited:
A quality argon box renders Cs handling no more dangerous than handling Na in open air. The problem is... having an argon box and sufficient purging system!

I've often dreamed of a DIY alkali vapor laser. Given the low melting temperatures and relatively good volatility (especially Sodium) it should yield itself well to discharge tubes, be they of the luminous or laser type. I'd LOVE a Na vapor laser and often wonder if a yellow HeNe (or Brewster tube) couldn't be repurposed into a Na laser. If I ever get a suitable vacuum setup I'd love to try it.

To add to the list of common things I can't buy locally; unscented / pure mineral oil (liquid paraffin, "baby" oil). Time to hit up Amazon... I need more solder anyway (also can't buy eutectic solder locally).
 
shokkunlasers said:
No of course not this is HIGHLY DANGEROUS

I was just dreaming loudly;)

I always wanted an ampule of Cs but its so freaking expensive :/

It's so beautiful! --> beauty cesium



Source: http://web.archive.org/web/20070207015229/http://pubs.usgs.gov/of/2004/1432/2004-1432.pdf

maybe I'll try it with one or two grams of CsOH in a controlled environment


Edit: There's also a Cs laser which is highly efficient Cesium laser for military and civilian applications | SPIE Newsroom: SPIE
Click to expand...

Yes, but you're making me itchy wanting to try a Cs Synthesis. Though I am scared to try. :thinking:

Dr.evil is alive and well here.
 
Testing Cs synth with very small quantities should be relatively safe. I remember seeing a video of 250mg of Cs being dropped into water via breaking an ampoule and letting it fall in a tub of water. It was VERY mild, just a poof, really. Trying it with such a small yield will let you know how volatile the process is.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.





Back
Top