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I payed 450$ and got this from DL.

paul1598419

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Definitely email him about your concerns. Tell him you won't accept an under spec unit and it would save a lot of trouble if he plans on shipping one under spec to just refund your money. You don't have to be rude, but let him know your concerns.
 

Benm

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If a product is defective, returning it with shipping cost for the vendor, would be perfectly normal. They are responsible for both product quality and shipping method, so if it is damaged in shipping that's the vendors problem: they should have packaged it better or used a better shipping service.

And yes, severe damage can occur in shipping due to all kinds of factors, sometimes packages arrived so mangled that even a flight data recorder would be malfunctional after the process :)

In any case, if the vendor isn't helpful, ebay does not resolve it properly either, it could be good if you paid with a credit card for that ebay transaction.

It depends on what credit card you have, but for example on mine i get a 4 month insurance on what i buy, pretty much against any form of damage, theft or loss unless intentional or by gross neglect.

So if i do buy something with that card and in breaks in transit, i could just ask them for a chargeback and they'd figure it out with ebay and ultimately the vendor etc, none of which is my problem unless i'm proven to be wrong and have caused the damage or loss myself.
 

Nexgen

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If a product is defective, returning it with shipping cost for the vendor, would be perfectly normal. They are responsible for both product quality and shipping method, so if it is damaged in shipping that's the vendors problem: they should have packaged it better or used a better shipping service.

And yes, severe damage can occur in shipping due to all kinds of factors, sometimes packages arrived so mangled that even a flight data recorder would be malfunctional after the process :)

In any case, if the vendor isn't helpful, ebay does not resolve it properly either, it could be good if you paid with a credit card for that ebay transaction.

It depends on what credit card you have, but for example on mine i get a 4 month insurance on what i buy, pretty much against any form of damage, theft or loss unless intentional or by gross neglect.

So if i do buy something with that card and in breaks in transit, i could just ask them for a chargeback and they'd figure it out with ebay and ultimately the vendor etc, none of which is my problem unless i'm proven to be wrong and have caused the damage or loss myself.
First of all this was PayPal transaction, so I can open a dispute at any time.
I paid for return shipping, I hope for “Adam’s” responsibility about this.
On Monday I will e-mail him again and ask if he can pick me a right unit.
Because if I get underspec unit I will ask for chargeback.

Eh.
 

Benm

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Return shipping charges are usually to be paid for by the vendor if the product arrived defective. As a client you will be required to pay for them if the vendor as a returns policy where you can return an item simply because you are not satisfied with it for any reason, but it is not technically defective.

In reality returning an item will probably require you to front the postage for that, unless they use something like DHL pickup to come get it from your house address at the expense of the vendor.

But they should refund any postal costs you have made to return the item to get a refund or replacement within reason - i.e. not using an overly expensive service like a specialist courrier service to return the item.
 

Seoul_lasers

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I can’t open a dispute, there’s an empty screen on PayPal if I’m trying to do so.
Actually, I'd go a step further and call their hotline (which is in the Philippines)
open a claim via phone and have them email you the claim number.

Paypal will wait 3 weeks before jumping on them and charging the business.
 

lasersbee

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My laser is now shipped back, we negotiated to send a new unit. If it will be under spec I will request a refund.

Shipping was 20$ tho. But they don’t care. They must cover the shipping because it’s they fault that they shipped this crap to me.
I hope that you bought Shipping Tracking
and Shipping Insurance for the package you
sent back....:undecided:
Sending it back now makes you responsible
for the package.

Jerry
 
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Nexgen

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I hope that you bought Shipping Tracking
and Shipping Insurance for the package you
sent back....:undecided:
Sending it back now makes you responsible
for the package.

Jerry
Thanks Jerry that you noticed that.

It’s international tracked. No worries here.

I have sent another email to Adam, now waiting for response. I’ve told him that I don’t want to waste money and time, dealing with underspec units. If I will receive underspec laser, I will definitely complain again. I will win this “war”

For me, I’m fine now, trying to think less about that. I hope.

I will order a Hyperion Cuprum, just for that case. Also interested in my other’s Spartan 532 200mw results.

Edit: He ignored my email, where I tried to ask to control unit before shipment.
 
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Hap

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While difficult, the 589 process should have become perfected since it's beginning(a few years ago now). Gosh, of course I'm not saying to expect 532 like stability, but a TEM00 dot most of the time, above average sold as power output and somewhat good stability shouldn't be much to expect now.

A 589 that goes from 100mW to 5mW in a matter of 1 min with a crazy dot definitely points to a problem.

Anyone else think so?

-Alex
 

Nexgen

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While difficult, the 589 process should have become perfected since it's beginning(a few years ago now). Gosh, of course I'm not saying to expect 532 like stability, but a TEM00 dot most of the time, above average sold as power output and somewhat good stability shouldn't be much to expect now.

A 589 that goes from 100mW to 5mW in a matter of 1 min with a crazy dot definitely points to a problem.

Anyone else think so?

-Alex
Maybe it’s because of employees that are working there? They make misaligned optics inside module? This is causing that?
 

Benm

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I hope that you bought Shipping Tracking
and Shipping Insurance for the package you
sent back....:undecided:
Sending it back now makes you responsible
for the package.
That may depend quite a bit on jurisdiction, and be very complicated in international transactions.

In the EU for example, the vendor is responsible to arrange and/or pay for a return shipping method that satisfies their need when a product arrives defective. Depending on the value they can say 'just toss it in the mail' or 'we will have a courier pick it up'.

For more valuable items they'll often want to use registered and tracked mailing options, but if it's something cheap (say $25 worth) just tossing in in the general mail without tracking could be more economical.

Surely consumers can use this to scam companies claiming something is defective, stating they have returned it but actually just kept a working unit. You could get away with that stating you returned a pair of $25 jeans because they did not fit or something like that, but for a $450 item the vendor would ask for better arrangements.

Though thinking of that: many of the online clothes stores actually have service that pick the parcel up at your house. That's just part of their logistics system - once parcels have been delivered the vans need to return to the depots anyway, so why not use them to collect returns :D
 

ZRaffleticket

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While difficult, the 589 process should have become perfected since it's beginning(a few years ago now). Gosh, of course I'm not saying to expect 532 like stability, but a TEM00 dot most of the time, above average sold as power output and somewhat good stability shouldn't be much to expect now.

A 589 that goes from 100mW to 5mW in a matter of 1 min with a crazy dot definitely points to a problem.

Anyone else think so?

-Alex
But this isn't the case for his unit, his starts low and stays low with horrible output. In his case, I think that there's a good chance it got bumped the wrong way during shipping either to DL or to the OP. Either way, it's on DL.

Maybe it’s because of employees that are working there? They make misaligned optics inside module? This is causing that?
Keep in mind it's not DL building these, they are resellers for CNI.

I don't think CNI would be sending one of their few resellers (maybe even primary?) for the III-M units their reject pile. Edit: Not of the distributors in general -- Just the ones that re-sell the PGL-III-M units. I don't know of any other one than DL for these.

In the case of your unit, I'm betting the assembly holding the optics in place got a hard bump which knocked things out of where they were originally. But without tearing the module apart, it's tough to tell if anything is physically damaged or just misaligned, if it was a manufacture defect or something that happened in transit.
 
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Hap

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But this isn't the case for his unit, his starts low and stays low with horrible output. In his case, I think that there's a good chance it got bumped the wrong way during shipping either to DL or to the OP. Either way, it's on DL.



Keep in mind it's not DL building these, they are resellers for CNI.

I don't think CNI would be sending one of their few resellers (maybe even primary?) for the III-M units their reject pile.

In the case of your unit, I'm betting the assembly holding the optics in place got a hard bump which knocked things out of where they were originally. But without tearing the module apart, it's tough to tell if anything is physically damaged or just misaligned, if it was a manufacture defect or something that happened in transit.
^Good point.

Without a proper tear down it's impossible to tell what really happened, and the best we can do, is go off of what we know may be the most likely cause regarding the situation the laser was in. Either way, DL is working with you to fix the situation so that's all that matters! :beer:

-Alex
 

diachi

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Keep in mind it's not DL building these, they are resellers for CNI.

I don't think CNI would be sending one of their few resellers (maybe even primary?) for the III-M units their reject pile.
Few resellers? DL a primary reseller? Maybe for this specific product, but they have plenty of other distributors.

You can find a list here:

Contact CNI
 

Encap

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Few resellers? DL a primary reseller? Maybe for this specific product, but they have plenty of other distributors.

You can find a list here:

Contact CNI
exactly--Dragon Lasers is not even one of the "Distributors" of which the are 20 --23 if you are counting companies the have separate locations in several Countries ---worldwide---they are a small time reseller within China.
 

ZRaffleticket

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I meant for the III-M units, or the "Spartan" series. I know they have tons of distributors for their lab units. Sorry for the confusion, I'll clear that up in my post above. I just find it hard to believe they'd send off crap units to one of the only places that seems to be taking them...
 
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Hap

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I meant for the III-M units, or the "Spartan" series. I know they have tons of distributors for their lab units. Sorry for the confusion, I'll clear that up in my post above. I just find it hard to believe they'd send off crap units to one of the only places that seems to be taking them...
I don’t know if this may be any indication but DL’s prices are low, actually, much lower then buying straight from CNI on most models. Maybe there’s a reason for that?

I’ve bought a few units from DL and they were all okay, but I don’t know if I’d buy another 589 from them.

-Alex
 




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