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POLL: BAN high power laser sales to the general public?

Should global sales of class 4 laser pointers be banned to the public ?


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Tech_Junkie

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Valid point, however what if it were possible to decrease those incidents even further and at no harm to any of the other (non-asshole) groups of laser users? Would that warrant your acceptance?

You pointed out the same thing I did in my response (although you detailed it a bit nicer :p) about how it's not a serious issue yet. The thing is, and I believe this to be the concern of the OP, that as technology advances so will the aspect of danger associated with it. It's difficult to say whether or not it will even become a problem of any significance (I certainly don't know the future :(), however operating on the assumption that it does...

I'll also take this time to re-iterate that I don't really believe any additional legislation needs to be passed at this time just because the problems it would most likely cause for the technicians, scientists, and even hobbyists outweigh the benefit it would provide.
We were actually both typing the at the same time. Great minds think a like.

I think the first part of your argument is a fantasy. You will never keep the wold without laser incidence. Not at this point anyway.

I used to work at a kids camp in the mountains. Being a very small population, they only had 2 volunteer police men. I asked one of them one day how can 2 people cover the vast area where the town was located. He told me that the world has roughly 8% a$$holes no matter where you go. They had such a small population, if something happened, they already knew who the a$$holes were.

Same situation applies here. There will always be that 8% no matter where you go, and there is nothing you can do about that. Unfortunately there are so many people, they are hard to keep track of.
 



Razako

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Personally I see the laser as a new age weapon that would be well suited in a criminals hands.

Example, two guys walk into a bank and rob it. Not only could they disable the CCTV, blind the witnesses who could no longer aid in a police sketch. Make their way out of the bank blinding anyone who is in their path. Proceed to the get away car, and blind or temp blind any pursuing police.

How would one give chase when you cant see anything?? Cop car behind you? ZAP. The laser does not even have to cause permanent damage. You could realistically disable an entire squad of pursuing cops in a matter of minutes.

Even the FLIR system on a police heli is susceptible to IR and could probably be damaged rendering the police equip useless.

This is a whole new ball game in my opinion, and high power lasers working hand in hand with guns and criminals, lasers are going to prove themselves to be a nasty tool in the wrong hands.

I doubt there is any way to control such events from taking place. But these things will happen at some point or another.


Come to think about it, all it will take is a movie with a similar plot to such a robbery and the copycats will follow.
....retarded....
NO...Just No.....
 
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Razako

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OK DO I SERIOUSLY NEED TO BE THE VOICE OF REASON FOR THE 10th TIME? I've already commented on this about 10x in the arctic threads and it's getting old.

1-A simple 200mw green is basically gonna be brighter than the arctic and would be worse when it comes to flashblinding people without damaging their eyes. IE the retarded robbery example.
2-There's already 200mw reds for $38 shipped and so far nobody has been hurt by them.
3-Anyone who tries robbing a bank with an arctic is retarded and will most likely end up shot by the cops.
4-Against planes and cars on the highway a readily available 200mw green is just as bad if not worse.
5-QUIT BEING SO DAMN PARANOID! What if some nutcase brings an ak47 into the mall and kills you in his rampage? What if a drunk driver kills you? What if you get a hamburger infected with Salmonella at McDonalds? What if a meteorite falls from the sky and hits you in the head? You're probably a million times more likely to die in a car crash than have someone attack you with an arctic.

Life isn't perfectly safe. Any attempts at making it so will just lead to a nanny-state like Australia where they ban everything under the sun.
 

Tech_Junkie

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These are all paranoid, retarded threads. I can blind you with a P7 flash light, are they all banned? Stop all this stupid ranting, and do some research so you know what you are talking about.
 

Razako

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These are all paranoid, retarded threads. I can blind you with a P7 flash light, are they all banned? Stop all this stupid ranting, and do some research so you know what you are talking about.
Seriously lol. I have a 3500 lumen HID flashlight that would do the job of blinding pursuing cars just as well as a laser. Also there's the fact that any cheapo green could already do that. I'm tempted to start mass -repping all of these people just for posting panicky garbage without even trying to think logically.
 

Tabish

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You Sir, just earned a +rep. I also haven't figured out why he thinks he'd be allowed to keep his lasers just because he built them himself either. The government only plays favorites like that when you manage to grease the right palms, which I doubt he'd have the capital to do. If high powered lasers got banned, YOURS would be on the banned list as well Tabish.
Big difference between building one and buying it on impulse due to a youtube video (when it comes to knowing the dangers involved)

PS: You guys need to quit taking it personally and quit the flaming...
I honestly don't even care. Just wanted to see the "reactions" and opinions of others.
Agree or disagree... Simple as that. Post your vote or GTFO
 
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Razako

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Big difference between building one and buying it on impulse due to a youtube video (when it comes to knowing the dangers involved)
Yeah and what if a kid sees one of those youtube videos showing COOL high voltage arcs from a Microwave oven transformer and then he takes apart an old microwave to try it and kills himself? What about those youtube vids showing "bottlebombs"? Easy and cheap fragmentation grenades that any idiot with an IQ over 80 could make from an old glass bottle and some tinfoil.
 

Tabish

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Yeah and what if a kid sees one of those youtube videos showing COOL high voltage arcs from a Microwave oven transformer and then he takes apart an old microwave to try it and kills himself? What about those youtube vids showing "bottlebombs"? Easy and cheap fragmentation grenades that any idiot with an IQ over 80 could make from an old glass bottle and some tinfoil.
I dun care...See post above.
 

Tech_Junkie

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PS: You guys need to quit taking it personally and quit the flaming...
I honestly don't even care. Just wanted to see the "reactions" and opinions of others.
Agree or disagree... Simple as that. Post your vote or GTFO
Its because this keeps coming up. Its been discussed a ton of times. All this does if fuel paranoia. This thread should have never been started.
 

Tabish

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So the conclusion:

33.3% of people who voted feel Class4 lasers (not just 1W, the class itself) being sold as pointers/lightsabers etc for fairly cheap are a danger and require further regulation if not a ban.

There, case closed.

Feel free to close this or let it die. No further posts needed.
 

SupermanFTM

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We were actually both typing the at the same time. Great minds think a like.

I think the first part of your argument is a fantasy. You will never keep the wold without laser incidence. Not at this point anyway.

I used to work at a kids camp in the mountains. Being a very small population, they only had 2 volunteer police men. I asked one of them one day how can 2 people cover the vast area where the town was located. He told me that the world has roughly 8% a$$holes no matter where you go. They had such a small population, if something happened, they already knew who the a$$holes were.

Same situation applies here. There will always be that 8% no matter where you go, and there is nothing you can do about that. Unfortunately there are so many people, they are hard to keep track of.
Very true about the "a$$holes" :p

I also agree that you can not keep the world incident free, be it from lasers or anything else (once again, woooo social darwinism!), HOWEVER I believe I stated in a previous post that enacting new laws would be for the purpose of lowering those incidents not removing them completely. I think you will agree that if something is harder to get at, you are less likely to get it and then proceed to cause harm or destruction. I know that wasn't a very strong statement, but take cars as an example. You must have a license and be over a certain age to drive one in the United States. It is rare, proportionally, that you find some one who does not meet these criteria driving. If these requirements did not exist, would more young people not drive? I certainly would have when I was younger, and hopefully I wouldn't have crashed, however it is statistically far more likely for young drivers to get into accidents. Having said that, isn't it both good and acceptable that we have those requirements for driving?

Like I said, I'm definitely not for banning lasers, but there are other alternatives that might help with whatever situation may (in a hypothetical world or otherwise) arise.

Oh, and as far as the government banning completed items but not the items that make them up... I fail to see how that is unlikely? I already used the gun example where I stated that it is indeed legal to build your own gun even if the gun itself is not legal (ex. mini-gun), but what about fertilizer bombs? Napalm? These things are more extreme, I grant you, however it is easy to get the pieces you need to build them... not so much to buy the completed item. Our government in the US often regulates things this way as it has seemed to help in the past and it keeps them from being pestered from those who would revolt if they issued a full-on "ban".

EDIT: To clarify, this wasn't all directed to TJ, I agree with a lot of what you're saying xD
Also, I definitely finished posting this after Tabish posted to let this thread die.
Also also, I know it's a hyperbole pyro, but certainly and obviously lasers and bicycles are in entirely different categories. The government doesn't use bicycles in hostile territory.

... but wouldn't it be awesome if they did and sent in those 8% of assholes to detonate mines rather than using a laser?! I mean, who would mess with a country that sacrificed its unwanted via bicycle on explosive action?! Wait a second...




EDITEDIT: Before that last comment offends anyone... I mean for it to be taken as a joke - it was certainly written as one. Hopefully you get a good giggle out of it.
 
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aryntha

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I'd really not be for a ban, so much as a very 'cursory' permit, sort of like they do on the GMRS radio bands here.

I'm a ham radio operator and, honestly, even having to pass a test doesn't keep idiots away. But the difference is, after getting licensed, the idiot knows they're an idiot; those who would simply be ignorant, generally are well behaved.

Nothing crazy, just something you've read and signed saying that you *know* that lasers like that can hurt people. I'm not really for a 'ban'; they never seem to really solve anything except for complicating the process when legitimate people want to get things for legitimate reasons.

A lot of laser "incidents" likely happen because the owner has no idea they're even dangerous. A "ban" won't change that. A little education (not very much, even) - will.
 

redhook

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Got a link?? Google returns nada. I know its a big thing for planes and yes it has caused issues. Have you read why laws were put into effect in .AU?
The Google is weak with this one. You should try using better search terms like "driver blinded laser".

Court story: Courtnews.co.nz | News from Christchurch courts

http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1G1-60158954.html

Benson ambulance driver blinded by laser beam (From Oxford Mail)

more victims are blinded by laser thugs. - Free Online Library
 

Razako

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I'd really not be for a ban, so much as a very 'cursory' permit, sort of like they do on the GMRS radio bands here.

I'm a ham radio operator and, honestly, even having to pass a test doesn't keep idiots away. But the difference is, after getting licensed, the idiot knows they're an idiot; those who would simply be ignorant, generally are well behaved.

Nothing crazy, just something you've read and signed saying that you *know* that lasers like that can hurt people. I'm not really for a 'ban'; they never seem to really solve anything except for complicating the process when legitimate people want to get things for legitimate reasons.

A lot of laser "incidents" likely happen because the owner has no idea they're even dangerous. A "ban" won't change that. A little education (not very much, even) - will.
The problem with permits is that the government will want a valid reason WHY you need a 500+mw laser pointer. What valid reasons are there for having a pointer of that power? I can't think of too many. Reasons like "it's cool" and "for fun" wouldn't count.
 

Tech_Junkie

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Very true about the "a$$holes" :p

I also agree that you can not keep the world incident free, be it from lasers or anything else (once again, woooo social darwinism!), HOWEVER I believe I stated in a previous post that enacting new laws would be for the purpose of lowering those incidents not removing them completely. I think you will agree that if something is harder to get at, you are less likely to get it and then proceed to cause harm or destruction. I know that wasn't a very strong statement, but take cars as an example. You must have a license and be over a certain age to drive one in the United States. It is rare, proportionally, that you find some one who does not meet these criteria driving. If these requirements did not exist, would more young people not drive? I certainly would have when I was younger, and hopefully I wouldn't have crashed, however it is statistically far more likely for young drivers to get into accidents. Having said that, isn't it both good and acceptable that we have those requirements for driving?

Like I said, I'm definitely not for banning lasers, but there are other alternatives that might help with whatever situation may (in a hypothetical world or otherwise) arise.

Oh, and as far as the government banning completed items but not the items that make them up... I fail to see how that is unlikely? I already used the gun example where I stated that it is indeed legal to build your own gun even if the gun itself is not legal (ex. mini-gun), but what about fertilizer bombs? Napalm? These things are more extreme, I grant you, however it is easy to get the pieces you need to build them... not so much to buy the completed item. Our government in the US often regulates things this way as it has seemed to help in the past and it keeps them from being pestered from those who would revolt if they issued a full-on "ban".

EDIT: To clarify, this wasn't all directed to TJ, I agree with a lot of what you're saying xD
Also, I definitely finished posting this after Tabish posted to let this thread die.
Also also, I know it's a hyperbole pyro, but certainly and obviously lasers and bicycles are in entirely different categories. The government doesn't use bicycles in hostile territory.

... but wouldn't it be awesome if they did and sent in those 8% of assholes to detonate mines rather than using a laser?! I mean, who would mess with a country that sacrificed its unwanted via bicycle on explosive action?! Wait a second...




EDITEDIT: Before that last comment offends anyone... I mean for it to be taken as a joke - it was certainly written as one. Hopefully you get a good giggle out of it.
LMAO I'm the wrong person to debate this. I had 6 cars before the age of 18 and never got my license till I was 19. My mom taught me to drive at 12 because she had a bad heart, and wanted me to know in case she had trouble. After that I was her Chauffeur. I also had a dozen or more motorcycles, and never got my license. The first day I got my red slip (paper you get before your actual licenses arrives) was the day I got pulled over for drag racing.

How I got here was because I found DX, and lasers. Then I found out they would not ship them to my country (US), This made me actively search because I could not have one LOL. I had to have one at that point. So I cant agree with any law, because there is always a way around it. And if you want something bad enough, you will get it.

But anyway, we are still kicking a dead horse here, so I will end my rant.
 
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