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[laser83]

It's easy to talk like a big man when your ass isn't on the line. You'd be pissing your pants if you were facing up to a $250,000 fine.

Yes, that's the problem with forums, this one isn't so bad. Look at other forums when someone asks for advice. He risks a 250K fine for this? That's what I was wondering what could the FDA do and how much would it cost him. I guessed a lawsuit but not that much.

To larger issue, I don't think so many random careless people should have access to high powered lasers. It may not be so bad that we have to make our builds, I'd have learned more and done more by now if I couldn't buy.

Mainly the mistake was starting a website selling competed lasers. Good luck though. If I were ditch everything you have laser related. Proof, they need proof. If they can't show you have the material there is no case. Unless you sold to an FDA agent. I can relate to losing your cool against the guy.

I"d see a lawyer ASAP but you need to see the right kind also don't forget. I'm sorry I don't know what the specialty of lawyers that cover these type of cases are called.

 

[silvercookie]

hopefully they will realize they are going to spend more money investigating the case then they will actually make off of fining you and just drop it.

good luck.

 

[Mohrenberg]

Hey just saw this at the post office

AHAHA thats priceless. i love it

 

[silvercookie]

This isn't directed at silvercookie directly, but I think he highlights something important: This isn't an attempt to make a profit off of the case. This is a public safety issue.

Like it or not, the FDA is here to protect people. The logic that they will only go after the big guys is flawed.

How does anyone here determine what their priorities are? Why would they only go after the high volume stores? A few days ago I posted links to the requirements in this thread. Has anyone read them top to bottom? Based on the feedback here, I highly doubt it.

Was the OP selling lasers that did not meet FDA requirements? I don't know - I never purchased on from him. If he was, then there isn't much room for interpretation.

<end rant>

no i understand, i was just saying that sometimes when companies try to accuse someone of plaguerism(sp?) or something small, they will just back down from the case after they realize how much investigation, lawyers,and court costs will be as opposed to how much they will make off it.

then again like you said it is the government and the have a "endless" supply of money and ball busting power.

hopefully someone higher than him will see how he is treating "customers" and just excuse them for this dan guy being a dick.


as far as people giving advice, unless you have a definite solution to the problem, or you know something that WILL work, dont post, cause it is just going to confuse him, and god forbid he accidentally says the wrong thing he is screwed.

frothy seems to be the most knowledgeable person, as well as Diode, cause it appears he has been in the game longer than some of us have been alive.

and no offense mohren, but it appears it was a good thing my friend didnt give me the money in time to buy your blu-ray laser, cause every laser sale will just be one more sale they will add to your list.

a guy over on 7sins forum got busted by the fda for selling mod chips and mod services for game systems as well as burned discs and dvd's and he got charged for every item he had in his posession.

 

[Mohrenberg]

time will tell what happens.....
i'll keep ya posted.

 

[bschott]

I'd like to respond to Frothy's post. Those of you who have been conversing with me I need to warn that I'm really going to step out of character and tell Frothy exactly what I think of his belittling post.

I think I'm going to move on. You can talk until you are blue in the face, yet every retard like this yahoo has to pipe in about how the man is oppressing those who violate the law.

Retarded Yahoo. That's a nice slap in the face, Frothy. I'm a new user and have been very respectful to everyone here on the forums since the first day I posted. I took weeks reviewing the stickies and reading posts before I even signed up or posted. I had a nice respect for your knowledge and read a lot of your posts.

As an +30 year old office equipment repairman I have been giving away FREE front-side mirrors, polygon mirrors w/motors, IR lasers, optics and other goodies simply because otherwise they will be thrown out and I felt I'd share these with people who can use them...no money required (you pay for your own shipping through whatever shipper you want). I've asked questions here and bought products from users and vendors suggestd by other users.

I take offense to your post and being called a 'yahoo', a 'retard', and you having the bad taste in putting words into my mouth.

I never said anything about how the 'man' is oppressing anyone. I read Matt's post that said HE was nice on the phone but Dan came off as an ass right off the bat and continued to threaten him even after it was apparent Matt was going to cooperate. See, I work with various government agencies nearly every day (fixing their copiers/faxes and such) and have realized there are two kinds of government employees. Those who don't flaunt their power and actually try to be helpful and those who indulge in their power and like to get their rocks off by intimidating others.

Considering Matt's encounter, I sympathized with him NOT belittle him. I belittled Dan for not giving Matt any respect and acting like a child given the 'hall monitor' assignment.

It's easy to talk like a big man when your ass isn't on the line.

You are right, my ass isn't on the line but if it was (and you don't know me at all so you really brought out a nice strawman argument) my attitude wouldn't change. Of course I don't, and have no plans to, sell any lasers so I won't be facing charges like Matt. I feel for the situation he is in though.

You'd be pissing your pants if you were facing up to a $250,000 fine.

No, I wouldn't. You want me to scan in the RIAA letter I have where they named me and were going to hit me with a hefty (seven digit) fine? I didn't "piss my pants" then and I wouldn't now. You simply get legal help and handle it. If you are breaking the law, you risk getting caught and need to be willing to face the fines/jail time. I sympathize with Matt and hope this doesn't happen but really, if you sell illegal high-powered lasers in the states, then you risk getting slapped by the FDA. Does that mean the FDA case worker has to come off as a power-mad asshole during this investigation? No.

This forum lately has been overrun with ignorance and I don't care to be around it. I guess the change over is about as good a point to make a clean break as any.

Here I'm going to stop being nice. Cry me a river and stop being an attention whore. If you leave then leave. I offered no advice to Matt, I'm not a lawyer. I only belittled the case worker which (from the sounds of it) already is acting as if he is going to go after Matt anyway, regardless of Matt's cooperation. I'm sorry you are on the way out but I am HARDLY the reason for that. I'm a scapegoat for other problems you have so don't even try to use me as your out. Be a man and own up to whatever else is bugging you but don't cop out. I won't let you degrade my name here or use me as an out. Leave for the real reasons, don't drag my name through the mud because you want others to still think highly of you after you leave. That's a very jerk thing to do.

For you laser professionals out there (you know who you are), I'll see you around the neighborhood.

I hope you have a change of heart, apologize, and rethink your decision to leave. I'd accept an apology and let by-gones be by-gones, forgetting this ever happened. Next move is up to you.

 

[Meatball]

I agree with caffeinetrip. The most we here can do for him is just show him our support. He doesn't need all of our crazy loopholes or suggestions for ways to get around it. He just needs to know that the dudes at LPF are here for him.

 

[chipdouglas]

i'm sure i am beating a dead horse right now. My bro is a lawyer and i showed him this entire thread. His advice is simple and straight forward, 1- talk to a lawyer, 2- you must walk on egg shells around this dan hewitt guy.

michael.

 

[bschott]

I have no legal advice for Matt, just support. If you open up a paypal account or something for your legal fund (lots of folks that get caught pirating via Torrents and such do this), I'll happily donate as I'm sure a few others would too.

 

[lasersbee]

Hey Frothy... tell me your J/K... I'd rather read your posts than some of the
newer AssHat's nonsense here... I try to take it with a grain of salt..

BTW Frothy... I have control of my mouse and can skip over any post I want...
I HAVE TOTAL CONTROL...

@Matt... I feel for you..
at least shut everything down.. NOW...and get some legal advice..


Jerry

 

[bschott]

And there is an ignore feature that he could have used instead of going off like that...

A simple apology and him and I can put this behind us.

 

[Mr_Lazo]

Sweet fancy Moses on a cracker!

I hope things don't turn out badly for you, Matt. We'll certainly miss your offers, though.

Keep us up to date on what develops with this, as I'm sure there are a lot of people who could possibly find themselves in a similar situation.

Perhaps it would be a good idea for anyone following this thread to make any necessary changes to their own operations to make sure they're in compliance before they, too, get some unwanted attention from the FDA. Stuff like changing one's domain name so it won't show up immedately when a search is done for "red-flag" terms, or only selling modules that have a "from the factory" output of <5mW with a very strong warning that "these lasers should not have their output increased by adjusting the pot 1/2 turn clockwise..."

I just wonder how high-profile companies like Wicked Lasers manage to produce high powered lasers without features like activation keys and manage to stay in business. Can anyone explain that one to me? They're in the States, right?

And, Frothy, don't let ignorance in general get to you. You do your best to educate us troglodytes, and it actually does get through. Seeing that kind of willful opacity should be more of an indicator that we need more people who actually know what they're talking about, not less.

 

[Deadly]

I think it would be in Matt's best interests if we stop criticizing the FDA and Dan Hewitt on these forums. The last thing we want to do is make the problem worse or provide motivation for the government to prosecute. The message we need to send is that we are responsible hobbyists with respect for federal laws. Dan's job is to monitor the safety of products and protect consumers. We may not agree with the laws but they are designed to protect people.

 

[bschott]

I think it would be in Matt's best interests if we stop criticizing the FDA and Dan Hewitt on these forums. The last thing we want to do is make the problem worse or provide motivation for the government to prosecute. The message we need to send is that we are responsible hobbyists with respect for federal laws. Dan's job is to monitor the safety of products and protect consumers. We may not agree with the laws but they are designed to protect people.

True, Dan's job is to do that, however he is not acting professional nor living up to the office that he is occupying, according to what Matt said of his phone encounter with Dan, even after showing that he (matt) was openly willing to comply. The laws are there and Matt broke them, and now Dan is investigating this wrongdoing, however Dan's approach is wrong. Considering the daily contact I have with guys and gals like Dan, he MAY have had an off day, but more likely he really enjoys the power he has and sounds like a jerk. We can respect the laws, we don't have to kowtow to the 'enforcers'. Dan is just a man and if he DOES give Matt problems, Matt has the right to ask for a new investigator be assigned to his case by going to Dan's manager/supervisor (whatever Dan's title is, there is someone higher than him.)

If they actually do that, well that is up in the air. Dan, however, can not go after Matt simply because I or some other users on this forum disprove of his tactics. He has to base his case on evidence and if the FDA *is* cracking down as others have stated, Matt may be in for a ride and nothing we say here is going to improve or decrease his chances of getting off.

 

[MarioMaster]

Wicked Lasers is based in China. They can drop their pants and moon the FDA all they want. Worst that can happen to them is having their packages caught on the way into the country.

 

[bschott]

Wicked Lasers is based in China. They can drop their pants and moon the FDA all they want. Worst that can happen to them is having their packages caught on the way into the country.

O-Like is from Canada but receive their product from China, correct?