laser prison

[qumefox]

Nope. Not a pilot.. yet. But friends with one.. He's even here on this forum, and has been lased while in the air.. and funny enough.. says it's enough to screw up your night adjustment too... instrument lights or not...

http://laserpointerforums.com/f53/lasers-aircraft-52672.html#post736973

But let me get this right... Your on the side that thinks illuminating aircraft is fine and acceptable? That's certainly what it seems like..

Also, since you seem to be calling us out.. how about I do the same.. How about ponying up some proof YOU know what you're talking about and aren't just trolling?

 

[Coherent Light]

Nope. Not a pilot.. yet. But friends with one.. He's even here on this forum, and has been lased while in the air..

http://laserpointerforums.com/f53/lasers-aircraft-52672.html#post736973

But let me get this right... Your on the side that thinks illuminating aircraft is fine and acceptable? That's certainly what it seems like..

Also, since you seem to be calling us out.. how about I do the same.. How about ponying up some proof YOU know what you're talking about and aren't just trolling?

Here Here....Put Up or Shut Up.

Everyone Pony up with Your package.

Coherent:

 

[Toaster]

Im not saying its acceptable, what i am saying is that its over dramatized. there is no reason it should cause a crash.

I do not believe it is a good idea but I also believe it's not worth 4 years in prison for.

I dont really know how you expect me to give you proof.. :/

Oh and the read it was a good one. No where in the story did he say that it caused him to lose control of the plane.

 

[Thengine]

You might be right in a way.. If a laser has 1.5 mrad divergence, the laser dot would be about 10 m^2 in size after 800 feet, and thus reducing a 100mW laser to the point where only 0.0007 mW enters the eye which is about 0.7 mm^2.

However, no one should EVER aim a laser at a plane/heli anyways, there is always a risk..

You are right, the eye (pupil) is 7mm wide at night and 4mm wide during the day.

So a 100mw laser with a divergence of 1.5mrads =

800 ft = 243 Meters
divergence of 1.5mm per Meter * 243 Meters = Diameter of:
1.5mm + 1.5*243 = 367 mm diameter of the dot at 800 ft.
Area of dot in Meters = Pie * .367 ^2 = .423 square meters. I am not sure about your math, I think that this is the correct formula/answer for the area at 800ft.

The area of a fully dilated pupil is Pie * .007 M ^2 = .000154 M^2
so the percentage of 100mw entering each individual eye is .000154 / .423 = .036 PERCENT

.00036 * 100mw = .036 mw
That means that .036 mw is entering each eye at 800ft, through the cockpit, at a moving target. A worse case scenario of .05 seconds exposure is being severely generous and I would think overestimates the ability of a handheld laser to be kept on target at that distance. Its a lot worse then what Grix said (at .0007 mw,) but that sounds an awful lot like a night light to me.

I would consider this mathmatical proof that there is little to no danger from a theoretical $45 laser at the stated distances. It would most likely show up as a flashlight (.423 m^2 area) on the outside of the aircraft. Get a little closer like take off and landing and you have a totally different story. I think thats where the true teeth of the law belongs. Only someone with malicious intent (terrorist) would point a laser at a pilot focusing on the runway.

This was all assuming worse case scenario of an amazing 100mw 1.5rad laser. The article stated a range of 5 miles, does anyone know the standard mw of a 5 Mile laser?

P.S. I personally would still put this guy in jail, just not for 4 months. There is only so much soap you can drop before you become mal-adjusted for life.

 

[rikgrimsby]

must be some thing about kids in the uk

heres another one and this is this week

Laser pen yob jailed - The Star

 

[Toaster]

Most planes dont fly that low (800 ft.) try 1200-1500

 

[Thengine]

must be some thing about kids in the uk

heres another one and this is this week

Laser pen yob jailed - The Star

Thats a really neat story, it seems to be following a pattern. Police helicopter pilots (without passengers) are always "temporarily blinded." Notice that the Jet pilot didn't have any problems reported? They don't want to scare the people that fly, and yet I find that the Jet being closest (on takeoff and landing) to the ground is the most likely candidate for actual "temporarily blindness." I think this prosecution falls under the category "contempt of cop."

Damn.. 6 months.. 180 days.. thats A LOT of soap to drop. I hope this guy learns to put his soap on a rope.

 

[kiyoukan]

I am going to see if i can preform an experiment.
in a month i am going to visit some family and one of my family members owns a 2 person Helicopter and i asked him if he would not mind if i lased him (his wife does), He said sure so i am going to give his co-piolt some glasses and hit him with +1 watt of 445nm
200mw of green
And if its done my 1W of red setup.
This will all be from my scanner so i will also hit him with all three on at once.
But from what he tells me that he been hit by super bright spotlights and still be able to fly just with a bit more caution.
So we will see how he can fly with over 2W of laser.
Also he understands the risk of the light but he seems cocky and his co-pilot will again have goggles and be able to take control of the craft in case.
But i want to try to see with a few different experiments on how this works.
Any advice on maneuvers i should try or he should?
Also i might have a water plane a friend on my lake owns but he dose not fly at night so it might be harder.
But even still i would be more scared of a spotlight than i would a laser i was in a boat on a lake when someone from land thought it would be funny to light us up, it literally felt HOT we were about 100ft off shore a laser i can look away from but a spotlight engulfs.
I mean spotlights were used to blind pilots are light them up for AA gunners they fill the cabin where a laser can only make a spot not very effective.

 

[Thengine]

This pilot is a tard. Humility is key to staying alive when flying. He has no idea what 1W of laser power means and I think you really should talk to him again and let him know the NOHD numbers and what they mean.

If you are both still serious about this little experiment then I suggest he fly at 200 ft AGL towards you in an open area like a field or a lake. His copilot must have have goggles on and be flying instruments, which means using the gyro and the horizon it provides instead of looking outside (attitude indicator)... looking outside is dangerous now regardless of whether or not he has goggles on. You need to have a tripod with a large stick or pole on top with laser attached to the long stick, this will allow for minute adjustments of the laser and allow more time in his eyes. Just like pointing a rifle, use both hands to gently move the aim.

Once he is dazzled or worse has permanent eye damage, let him know that it was his cockiness/stupidity that led to his inability to pass flight physicals in the future. Please remember that halving the distance to your target gives roughly 4 times the irradiance, and vice versa. It is important to note the NOHD and not stray too far inside that envelope.

There is no need of a plane, a helicopter will be able to provide all possible attitudes that you might want to test.

 

[kiyoukan]

I will only go to the full power if nothing happens at the lower power levels.
I would never start off with 2+w of laser.
i am going to star with my green 200mw and depending on what happens decide if the stronger one are needed but i doubt it. from what he tells me there would be no need for any dangerous maneuvers to get away from a single point light just a slight turn.
From what he said i will do my best to quote.
"Maybe a young pilot might get caught of guard and jerk the copter hard but even still they can take this to a point, if they cant deal with a distraction they should never risk putting the craft in the air heck with seeming how these are becoming more common make a test of it to see if they are ready"

 

[Thengine]

Well not everyone has 1W of laser pointing at them at less then 300ft. I agree that average pointers are somewhat worthless in the threat department but up close and personal with 1W of laser sounds scary. Do some math, do it again.. and then explain what you have learned to the pilot.

Safety first

 

[kiyoukan]

at close range yes but i plan on doing it at normal elevations for a fly helicopter.i first want to start with him way off in the distance and have him coming towards the green light.
A 200mw green i think is a slightly more common hand held power.
Also people have forgot to take into account how much power does the windshield take off the laser.
I dont have a lpf to test but if someone has both a helicopter and a lpm it would be interesting to find out.

 

[Toke]

Have you considered starting with the helicopter standing on the ground?

You could set up the laser and then walk over to take some beamshots showing how much the canopy spread the light. I suspect the whole canopy turns green and practicaly opaque.

It would be safer, easier, and you would not have to rely on the pilots opinion only.

 

[kiyoukan]

Yes but its the angle i am more concerned with and how it enters. from ground its a different story that would be like two HC pointing lasers at each other at or near eye level.

 

[Toke]

Well, I would still start on the ground, it is possible to unfocus the laser and hold it below the canopy.
For all I know it could be a lot worse than a right angle. The light could be traveling inside the glass/plastic making it all opaque, instead of just a small patch?

 

[kiyoukan]

its possible but i doubt it, the glass is designed not to do that and to be anti glare, i could be wrong but from what i have read they are.