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Toke

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I hope 4 months will make him and other think about their actions.
 
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in my mind 4 months isnt long enough.... what if the poilt crashed into house ??? id say 3/5 years
 
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I am on the fence about this one. I am a helicopter pilot and past Army Aviator. Speaking from a purely scientific standpoint a $45 (50mw?) laser shining at me from the ground directly up isn't likely going to get near my eyes. It might hit the canopy and scare the shit out of me.. and then I am going to miss my hellfires or flechette 2.75 IN Rockets, but I don't see it dazzling me.

Captain Westwood told he court he had suddenly been dazzled by an intense green light that filled his cockpit.
"The overall effect was temporary blindness," he said. "I lost outside visual reference and could not see the instrumentation displayed on the aircraft.

Bottomley's pen had a range of five miles. When he first targeted Captain Westwood's helicopter the pilot was forced to take evasive action.
"It was a very dangerous manoevre but I had to do it to get myself out of that dazzle," he said.


A range of 5 miles doesn't seem like a very dangerous pointer to me in the least. I also don't understand the need for a "dangerous manoevre" to escape being lased.. I am not trying to play down the seriousness of what this moron was doing, but I don't think the pilot was ever in any real danger and it seemed like he hammed it up BIG time for the media. It would take a serious laser (I don't know how serious mw wise) on something that you could steadily direct at the aircraft for it to pose a real problem sight wise.

What do you vets think? If you were inside a car between 800ft and 1,200ft away and flying (hypothetical I know, we need flying cars already) overhead what power laser would it take to "dazzle you" so that you lose vision at night. Please take into account that your car is moving 100mph and its through a window and the beam is coming from almost directly below.
 
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in my mind 4 months isnt long enough.... what if the pilot crashed into house ??? id say 3/5 years
If a hand held laser can cause a crash, it's because the pilot was incompetent and shouldn't have been piloting an aircraft to begin with..
of course it's wrong to shine a laser at an aircraft, but don't say it's going to cause them to crash. If this were the case then everyone in iraq would be running around with green laser pointers.

I was once accused of "selling lasers that are used to make airplanes crash"

That's a gross exaggeration in every way.
 
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its bad... what if this guy had the arctic ?
......seriously?

it's not a pulse rifle. This isn't star wars, and i don't care how cool you guys think the arctic is, it really isn't THAT cool.

Plus, your assuming this guy's arctic would actually work if he had one :crackup:
 

Grix

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I am on the fence about this one. I am a helicopter pilot and past Army Aviator. Speaking from a purely scientific standpoint a $45 (50mw?) laser shining at me from the ground directly up isn't likely going to get near my eyes. It might hit the canopy and scare the shit out of me.. and then I am going to miss my hellfires or flechette 2.75 IN Rockets, but I don't see it dazzling me.

Captain Westwood told he court he had suddenly been dazzled by an intense green light that filled his cockpit.
"The overall effect was temporary blindness," he said. "I lost outside visual reference and could not see the instrumentation displayed on the aircraft.

Bottomley's pen had a range of five miles. When he first targeted Captain Westwood's helicopter the pilot was forced to take evasive action.
"It was a very dangerous manoevre but I had to do it to get myself out of that dazzle," he said.


A range of 5 miles doesn't seem like a very dangerous pointer to me in the least. I also don't understand the need for a "dangerous manoevre" to escape being lased.. I am not trying to play down the seriousness of what this moron was doing, but I don't think the pilot was ever in any real danger and it seemed like he hammed it up BIG time for the media. It would take a serious laser (I don't know how serious mw wise) on something that you could steadily direct at the aircraft for it to pose a real problem sight wise.

What do you vets think? If you were inside a car between 800ft and 1,200ft away and flying (hypothetical I know, we need flying cars already) overhead what power laser would it take to "dazzle you" so that you lose vision at night. Please take into account that your car is moving 100mph and its through a window and the beam is coming from almost directly below.
You might be right in a way.. If a laser has 1.5 mrad divergence, the laser dot would be about 10 m^2 in size after 800 feet, and thus reducing a 100mW laser to the point where only 0.0007 mW enters the eye which is about 0.7 mm^2.

However, no one should EVER aim a laser at a plane/heli anyways, there is always a risk..
 

AJ_Dual

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You might be right in a way.. If a laser has 1.5 mrad divergence, the laser dot would be about 10 m^2 in size after 800 feet, and thus reducing a 100mW laser to the point where only 0.0007 mW enters the eye which is about 0.7 mm^2.

However, no one should EVER aim a laser at a plane/heli anyways, there is always a risk..
It's true, the press and the authorities always seem to overstate the disruption/danger in these kinds of cases. The press for the purpose of sensationalizing the story, and pilots and authorities for the sake of emphasizing the safety aspects.

Factoring in the airline cases, unless the person with the laser was actually on the same bearing as the approach runway, and probably standing within the (run-out space?) with the various lights VASI systems etc. (inside the airport secure area/fence) the odds of the beam actually getting into the cockpit are very low.

I'm guessing in most of these cases, the pilots could see the light, and knew it was intentional, but unless it was a monster laser several hundred mW, and very close to airport property and well lined up with their final approach, it realistically probably wasn't the risk it was made out to be.

Helicopters have it worse though, their flight profiles are different, and they often have more windows and larger canopies, many designs with canopies under the nose by the pilot's feet, so they can observe the ground etc.

However, the one time an aircraft actually DOES crash, killing people on board, and on the ground, I won't blame the previous exaggerations in the reporting. I think it's overstated because if you were to "give an inch" and explain power levels, divergence, and the angle of illumination etc. making it "not that bad", then the IDIOTS will "take a mile" and just do it more.

So the no mercy, no exceptions, no quarter given style of both reporting and prosecution is probably the only rational way to handle it.
 
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I was doing some research on laser weapon systems. The ZM-87 Portable Laser Disturber seems to be used currently by various groups in the world:
This isn

It HAS done damage to a navy pilot who didn't know he was being lased because its an IR beam, except by the intense pain he felt. He was concurrently taken off flight status.
Strait of Juan de Fuca laser incident - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The evil part is the pulsed nature from Q-switching, its only a 15mw laser. I am glad laser as a means of warfare has been banned in most civilized countries, naturally China isn't one of those.

BLINDING LASER WEAPONS
This details some interesting facts about lasers as weapons.
 
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Dr_Evil

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Has anybody else noticed that the article is 2 years old? I'd like to know what happened to the guy. It'd be nice if he was still behind bars.
 

Toaster

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Ok just to clear things up, I have My pilots certificate and have been flying for many years.

First of all, Being lased from the ground, very little light will enter the cockpit, and the stuff that does, will hit the canopy. Not to mention from the distance minimums from the ground an airplane must fly. That pilot obviously blew up the story LARGLY for the media.

Also, If I was being "Lased" and I was momentarily blinded, It would by no means make me or any certified pilot crash. If a pilot was that unsure of himself, he shouldn't have been flying in the first place.

Lastly, What the hell was the maneuvers? Did he do a barrel roll? Maybe some snap spins? Really, this is largely blown out of proportions. He probably made a standard rate turn away from the source.

And to the guy who said he should have got four years. Thank GOD you are not in the government. You seem like the kind of guy that want people to go to jail for running a red light or speeding (Because they could've hurt someone). It is simply ridiculous, man. What if that car hit someone. Well it didn't did it? The laser DIDN'T cause a crash. If it did, I could understand a longer sentence.

What I am saying to you guys is don't believe everything you hear. Especially from the media. People write drama because people like it. You can not tell others what it is like until you experience it and definitly not tell what you think the punishment is. How about you put yourself in that guys shoes. After 4 months, I am SURE you would have learned your lesson. 4 years in jail would be ~1/20th of your life for one harmless mistake.

Think about it.
 
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BShanahan14rulz

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Go outside and look at the stars in a dark place for about 15 minutes. Then shine a dinky 5mm clear green LED in your face for a split second. (or your phone screen) What do you see? How long does it last before your vision is back to seeing night details?

Don't post the answer, I've done it before and I can imagine it scaring the crap outta me if I'm flying something as complex as a helicopter... I'm just sayin'...
 

qumefox

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Yes.. If your night-adjusted.. it wouldn't take much.. especially of 532, to temporary blind you for a few seconds, and, as stated, scare the crap out of you if your not expecting it.. And i'd honestly be more frightened the day pilots start expecting to be lased in flight....

Do people blow things out of proportion? Yes.
Will lasing an aircraft make it crash? If on approach at night near the ground... possibly but unlikely.
Will a few fractions of a mw screw up your night adapted vision? Hell yes. Try BShanahan's experiment if you think the answer is no..
Is lasing aircraft an utterly moronic thing to do? Definitely.
Does it warrant jail time? Definitely.
 

Toaster

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Go outside and look at the stars in a dark place for about 15 minutes. Then shine a dinky 5mm clear green LED in your face for a split second. (or your phone screen) What do you see? How long does it last before your vision is back to seeing night details?

Don't post the answer, I've done it before and I can imagine it scaring the crap outta me if I'm flying something as complex as a helicopter... I'm just sayin'...
This experiment is Null and void. A cockpit is NOT pitch black, there are MANY lights in there. Also, neither of you even operate an aircraft, so how can you even speak? In any dangerous situation a pilot adds power and climbs. Always always. Even with a landing, you can do a missed approach or a flyby as you non-flyers call them.

You guys are really trying to know what you are talking about when you don't have experience.
 




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