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Laser dot not perfect even with brand new lens

DTR

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That spray I like to call the bat wings is from the edges of the bar shaped raw output which is being cut off by the three element lens and reflect off the inner housing. It is not abnormal for that type of lens. See these links I found with a quick search.

https://laserpointerforums.com/f65/there-something-wrong-my-beam-spot-59400.html#post1006518
https://laserpointerforums.com/f65/445nm-lens-comparisons-51456-23.html#post757826

This is an Osram diode. Almost certainly a PLTB450B. It is also damaged from some type of abuse like overheating possibly from running the unit too long, being powerd by a driver that is giving nasty transients when power cycling and/or running it with too high a current. The damage to the dye can be identified by light bleeding from the main lasing bar.

 

WizardG

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Cool, but how does any of this help me? Ranting about the quality of my laser or my obvious lack of knowledge when it comes to lenses does not help me regarding my question. I am a software developer, not a laser/optics specialist. I never called the host a solid piece of aluminum, it is very obviously hollow and assembled out of different pieces and some of those pieces might be hollow as well. All I was saying is that the laser is made from metal and doesn't easily fall apart. No matter what question I have and what forum I post it in, people always start ranting about completely irrelevant things instead of answering the actual question. Why is that?

You probably missunderstood me regarding the wavelength of the laser. I said "it is very easy to tell the difference" to prove to you that it is a 445nm laser, not to hate on you for not being able to see it on the picture.

By the way, I did see the multiquote function but I already had most of my answers posted at that time so I decided to keep those posts like they are and use multiquote the next time instead.
Completely irrelevant things? Not so. The build quality of a laser is comprised of many things, some of which look to be quite relevant to the complaint you have with your laser. In particular, a quality laser will be precisely machined such that the center of the beam from the diode is aligned with the center of the lens, the diode is mounted so that the beam is perpendicular to the plane of the optics, and the optics themselves (and the barrel they're mounted in) are of high quality. From your photos it doesn't look like the output of your diode is centered on the lens, causing clipping and splash. Some of the splash could be eliminated by coating the inside of the lens barrel with a black coating to absorb the stray light but this isn't the easiest modification to do on a 3 element lens. And the centering of the beam to the lens can only be corrected by using a higher quality host.

We're not trying to hurt your feelings by pointing out that those gatling style lasers are of very poor quality. We're trying to save you some $$ by telling you not to spend any more on that laser. If you want a really nice quality beam and you don't need to burn things try a single mode laser.
 

RB astro

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Cool, but how does any of this help me?

No matter what question I have and what forum I post it in, people always start ranting about completely irrelevant things instead of answering the actual question. Why is that?

By the way, I did see the multiquote function but I already had most of my answers posted at that time so I decided to keep those posts like they are and use multiquote the next time instead.
Paul and others are trying to help.
They are very knowledgeable in this field.
Forums are difficult to express emotion and voice inflection in text.
People usually find it easier to get along with others/noobs if respect is shown.

Is there a problem here?

RB
 

paul1598419

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I paid about 50$ for it + 10$ for 6 batteries and a simple charger + EU adapter + another 6$ for a three layer glass lens. I could have gotten it a bit cheaper by buying it with everything included in a case but I decided to buy every part separately to increase the chance that it goes through customs.

For some reason I already knew that this was going to be one of the first answers but come on, it's not THAT bad considering the output power and the fact that it is a solid metal build. It certainly isn't high quality but it's also no cheap plastic crap. I've had it for quite a while now and so far it is working just fine (despite the problem I described in this thread).
Cool, but how does any of this help me? Ranting about the quality of my laser or my obvious lack of knowledge when it comes to lenses does not help me regarding my question. I am a software developer, not a laser/optics specialist. I never called the host a solid piece of aluminum, it is very obviously hollow and assembled out of different pieces and some of those pieces might be hollow as well. All I was saying is that the laser is made from metal and doesn't easily fall apart. No matter what question I have and what forum I post it in, people always start ranting about completely irrelevant things instead of answering the actual question. Why is that?

You probably missunderstood me regarding the wavelength of the laser. I said "it is very easy to tell the difference" to prove to you that it is a 445nm laser, not to hate on you for not being able to see it on the picture.

By the way, I did see the multiquote function but I already had most of my answers posted at that time so I decided to keep those posts like they are and use multiquote the next time instead.
As you can see I WAS answering what you said about this laser. The point about using the multi-quote was because multiple posts are highly frowned on here and I was trying to help you by not having someone else negatively rep you as has obviously been done now. I have not been rude to you. In fact, I have given up my time to try to help you. Won't be making that mistake again.
 

Encap

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Cool, but how does any of this help me? No matter what question I have and what forum I post it in, people always start ranting about completely irrelevant things instead of answering the actual question. Why is that?

Bottom line : That laser is what it is. The dot is never going to be "perfect" is not possible with a multimode 445nm diode thus there is no one definite absolute answer to your question.
It is not that kind of a problem and nobody has it in their hands to investigate and try different things ---in any case, that will have to be up to you to do if you wish to pursue it.
If you can send it back for repair or replacement asking for a better example under a warranty that would be best choice other than get a refund if possible and buy a better quality laser.
if you want a high quality laser see: https://www.jetlasers.org/

Members have been and are attempting to help you by means of coming up with educated guesses and suggesting what might be done to help correct the problem so that it is more acceptable knowing there is no "perfect dot" possible with that laser.
Is a question of how much time and money you want to spend chasing that problem and if it can be resolved to a more acceptable result using that laser host/assembly. It is going to as much or more than the entire laser costs in parts + time to do.

1. buy another good 3 element lens and/or a single element G2 leans and try them in your laser assembly making sure alignment is as good as it can be and so on.
2. change the diode - get a good quality new PLTB-450B diode and a perhaps a good driver to go with it.
Both can be purchased fro DTR's shop here: https://sites.google.com/site/dtrlpf/home/diodes/osram-pltb450b-1-6w-450nm
3. make the inside front part of the housing and the inside of the focus knob and lens barrel non-reflective flat black eliminating any reflections and see if that helps.

Complaining about the members trying to give you some advice, help and support is out of order.
What should everyone have said?
"You are SOL -don't bother with it buy another better quality laser. Aus einem Ackergaul kann man kein Rennpferd machen/Aus einem Kieselstein kann man keinen Diamanten schleifen"
Would that have been better?
 
Last edited:

WizardG

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Chris, another reason people can be a little short when asking questions such as yours is that they're so freaking tired of answering the same question. There are limits to the patience of members here. "How do I make my cheap laser awesome" is one of the oldest questions here and it has been asked in many, many ways. 'How do I pot mod my GLP into a death-star planet burster?', 'how can I make my laser burn things a mile away?'.

No multimode laser will give you a perfect dot. And by far, the fastest and cheapest way for you to have a laser with a nice clean beam would be to buy a different laser. You may not like that answer, but that doesn't make that answer wrong. There is a great deal of truth in the old axiom 'you get what you pay for'.
 

deadshadow

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this diode is definitely a PLTB450B as for the weird output on the left side this is normal and how a PLTB450B raw output should look like.as for the completely clean output you looking for its not gonna happen with those multimode diodes except if you mask the output
 
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DTR

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The dye reflection is a dead giveaway for at least the manafacturer. It tends to be pretty distinct from manufacturer to manufacture and pretty uniform to most the diodes they offer. To better show what I mean by the damage I mean the light that is bleeding out of the main lasing line. See this a lot on NUB/NUG pulls from China that have been fried during extraction from getting them way too hot. The dye can actually come loose and reseat itself off center a tad.

 
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Chris32

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that spray i like to call the bat wings is from the edges of the bar shaped raw output which is being cut off by the three element lens and reflect off the inner housing. It is not abnormal for that type of lens. See these links i found with a quick search.

https://laserpointerforums.com/f65/there-something-wrong-my-beam-spot-59400.html#post1006518
https://laserpointerforums.com/f65/445nm-lens-comparisons-51456-23.html#post757826

this is an osram diode. Almost certainly a pltb450b. It is also damaged from some type of abuse like overheating possibly from running the unit too long, being powerd by a driver that is giving nasty transients when power cycling and/or running it with too high a current. The damage to the dye can be identified by light bleeding from the main lasing bar.

Good to know it is caused by the lens, I thought it would be because of it already since I did not have this problem with other lenses before. However, I accidentally damaged the old lens so I'll probably keep using this one for now, it isn't that much of a deal compared to the completely broken/scratched original lens that came with it. Thanks!

completely irrelevant things? Not so. The build quality of a laser is comprised of many things, some of which look to be quite relevant to the complaint you have with your laser. In particular, a quality laser will be precisely machined such that the center of the beam from the diode is aligned with the center of the lens, the diode is mounted so that the beam is perpendicular to the plane of the optics, and the optics themselves (and the barrel they're mounted in) are of high quality. From your photos it doesn't look like the output of your diode is centered on the lens, causing clipping and splash. Some of the splash could be eliminated by coating the inside of the lens barrel with a black coating to absorb the stray light but this isn't the easiest modification to do on a 3 element lens. And the centering of the beam to the lens can only be corrected by using a higher quality host.

We're not trying to hurt your feelings by pointing out that those gatling style lasers are of very poor quality. We're trying to save you some $$ by telling you not to spend any more on that laser. If you want a really nice quality beam and you don't need to burn things try a single mode laser.
I understand what you mean but I don't understand why some people here focus so much on talking about the quality of the laser instead of answering my actual question.

I originally asked about a problem with the output of my laser, hoping that someone can explain me how it is caused and if there is any easy way to fix it. I am completely aware of the quality of my laser and I was already aware of it when I bought it. I only own this thing as basically a toy (if you can call something that dangerous a toy) and most of the time it is really just decoration in my room because I do not use it very often. I never wanted any expensive high quality laser with a really nice and bright beam and I will not spend any more money on it.

paul and others are trying to help.
They are very knowledgeable in this field.
Forums are difficult to express emotion and voice inflection in text.
People usually find it easier to get along with others/noobs if respect is shown.

is there a problem here?

rb
What do you mean? I do not see a problem here except that people are continuously missunderstanding what I'm trying to say and keep interpreting things into my words that have absolutely nothing to do with my actual intentions :(

as you can see i was answering what you said about this laser. The point about using the multi-quote was because multiple posts are highly frowned on here and i was trying to help you by not having someone else negatively rep you as has obviously been done now. I have not been rude to you. In fact, i have given up my time to try to help you. Won't be making that mistake again.
Sorry for that then, you have not told me the reason behind what you said so I missunderstood that. Anyway, why are multiple posts so "highly frowned" on here? I did not even do this on purpose, yet I receive all this hate just for doing that. Jesus Christ, I am just a human being and not a machine, I make mistakes!

bottom line : That laser is what it is. The dot is never going to be "perfect" is not possible with a multimode 445nm diode thus there is no one definite absolute answer to your question.
It is not that kind of a problem and nobody has it in their hands to investigate and try different things ---in any case, that will have to be up to you to do if you wish to pursue it.
If you can send it back for repair or replacement asking for a better example under a warranty that would be best choice other than get a refund if possible and buy a better quality laser.
If you want a high quality laser see: https://www.jetlasers.org/

members have been and are attempting to help you by means of coming up with educated guesses and suggesting what might be done to help correct the problem so that it is more acceptable knowing there is no "perfect dot" possible with that laser.
Is a question of how much time and money you want to spend chasing that problem and if it can be resolved to a more acceptable result using that laser host/assembly. It is going to as much or more than the entire laser costs in parts + time to do.

1. Buy another good 3 element lens and/or a single element g2 leans and try them in your laser assembly making sure alignment is as good as it can be and so on.
2. Change the diode - get a good quality new pltb-450b diode and a perhaps a good driver to go with it.
Both can be purchased fro dtr's shop here: https://sites.google.com/site/dtrlpf/home/diodes/osram-pltb450b-1-6w-450nm
3. Make the inside front part of the housing and the inside of the focus knob and lens barrel non-reflective flat black eliminating any reflections and see if that helps.

Complaining about the members trying to give you some advice, help and support is out of order.
What should everyone have said?
"you are sol -don't bother with it buy another better quality laser. Aus einem ackergaul kann man kein rennpferd machen/aus einem kieselstein kann man keinen diamanten schleifen"
would that have been better?
I appreciate every help I get here but when I ask a specific question and as answer I basically get a wall of text saying "YOUR LASER SUCKS" then how does that help me in any way? I know this already, I know where it is made, I know what it's made of and I know what quality it is! I have done a lot of research about different types of lasers, manufacturers and all sorts of topics related to lasers before I bought this thing and I do not need anyone pointing out its quality to me again and again. Maybe I was overreacting in that answer, sorry for that, but hopefully you can understand this from my point of view.

Thank you for the tips/ideas on how to fix the problem! It feels tempting to try making it black to eleminate reflections but I'm afraid of destroying something when doing that. Do you think that is a good idea and have people done it successfully before?

chris, another reason people can be a little short when asking questions such as yours is that they're so freaking tired of answering the same question. There are limits to the patience of members here. "how do i make my cheap laser awesome" is one of the oldest questions here and it has been asked in many, many ways. 'how do i pot mod my glp into a death-star planet burster?', 'how can i make my laser burn things a mile away?'.

No multimode laser will give you a perfect dot. And by far, the fastest and cheapest way for you to have a laser with a nice clean beam would be to buy a different laser. You may not like that answer, but that doesn't make that answer wrong. There is a great deal of truth in the old axiom 'you get what you pay for'.
I completely understand what you mean. I am a forum moderator myself for almost half a decade and there are also a few questions that I am answering again and again almost every single day because people don't bother searching on their own before asking.

My problem here is simply that you completely missunderstand why I created this thread. I am NOT asking "how do i make my cheap laser awesome" and I am also NOT trying to make my laser better than it could technically ever be. I know that it can be better than this because when I got it this issue did not exist. The reason why I made this thread is just because I did not know what causes the problem and if there is a way to fix it without spending a lot of money. I am completely fine with keeping it like this if there is no such way.

this diode is definitely a pltb450b as for the weird output on the left side this is normal and how a pltb450b raw output should look like.as for the completely clean output you looking for its not gonna happen with those multimode diodes except if you mask the output
Thanks and no, I am not looking for a completely clean output. I just wanted to know if there is a way to get rid of these "bat wings" as someone else called them.
 
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deadshadow

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The dye reflection is a dead giveaway for at least the manafacturer. It tends to be pretty distinct from manufacturer to manufacture and pretty uniform to most the diodes they offer. To better show what I mean by the damage I mean the light that is bleeding out of the main lasing line. See this a lot on NUB/NUG pulls from China that have been fried during extraction from getting them way too hot. The dye can actually come loose and reseat itself off center a tad.


well maybe you are right about the nub/nug diodes but this is totally normal for the the osram pltb450,i just fired my pltb450 build running on 1,2-1,3A that works great and this is the raw output,it also have small lines that camera doesn't pick it well.i have tested 3 osram pltb450 brand new diodes in the past and all had this weird pattern.


edit:the 1st image look to have a rounder output than mine,could it still have the lens on it? or you mean the problem is the extra scattered light on the sides of the emittion?
 

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paul1598419

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Sorry for that then, you have not told me the reason behind what you said so I missunderstood that. Anyway, why are multiple posts so "highly frowned" on here? I did not even do this on purpose, yet I receive all this hate just for doing that. Jesus Christ, I am just a human being and not a machine, I make mistakes!.
From what I could see, you weren't negatively repped for multi-posting, but for lashing out at me for my statements. We all try to treat each other with respect here, so lashing out will get you slammed faster than anything else. Especially when members are here trying to help you. Just forget about it and if you fit in here, you will get positive reps soon enough.
 




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