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FrozenGate by Avery

Highly Disappointing Experience With Wicked

What a bunch of idiots. Glad Paypal got you your money back.

THEY made the mistake with the address, why can't THEY contact UPS and solve the problem? I can't see it being hard for them to pick up a telephone and ring up UPS to explain the issue. It shouldn't fall on the customer (who provided their info accurately) to correct their mistakes and have to play run-around with UPS.
 





He ordered a $500 laser, they sent it to the wrong address despite the correct one being provided. Instead of correcting the situation, they told him to contact UPS himself and try to get his package from them. UPS destroyed the package because it got sent back to WL as it had an address that doesn't exist on it and WL refused it. They wouldn't correct the situation, so he had to make a claim against them with Paypal. After making the claim, Paypal forced them to send him a new laser to the correct address.

Whats funny is that WL would refuse a returned package from UPS containing a $500 laser because of a $100 fee. Seems foolish on their part to let UPS keep (and destroy) something so valuable over a small (compared to the laser's cost) fee. Serves them right... Not only did they lose a $500 laser due to their own stupidity, they had to send another one anyways.
 
Fire Starter said:
He ordered a $500 laser, they sent it to the wrong address despite the correct one being provided. Instead of correcting the situation, they told him to contact UPS himself and try to get his package from them. UPS destroyed the package because it got sent back to WL as it had an address that doesn't exist on it and WL refused it. They wouldn't correct the situation, so he had to make a claim against them with Paypal. After making the claim, Paypal forced them to send him a new laser to the correct address.

Whats funny is that WL would refuse a returned package from UPS containing a $500 laser because of a $100 fee. Seems foolish on their part to let UPS keep (and destroy) something so valuable over a small (compared to the laser's cost) fee. Serves them right... Not only did they lose a $500 laser due to their own stupidity, they had to send another one anyways.
Click to expand...

Thank you. It just goes to show the kinds of morons running that place.

I hope you're reading this FireStorm.
 
My understanding with UPS is that the recipient can't make any address change, they will only allow the shipper to whom "contracted" with UPS to deliver the package on their behalf, and thus they are the only one UPS will allow to alter an address.

I had something similar happen years ago and UPS told me they could not accept the address correction from me, rather it must come from the shipper.
I explained to UPS what happen and was told they understand, but technically the package is still "owned" by the shipper/vendor until delivered to the address specified on the label. Make sense because the Vendor is the one that actual paid UPS to ship the package. Sure you paid the Vendor, but the Vendor is the one that directly paid UPS and not you.

The shipper/vendor was a bone-head and never followed it up with UPS and it got returned to them and then the Vendor tried to charge my credit card, shipping two ways + a re-stock fee for their mistake. Guess what the credit card company did.....refusal & charge-back of the entire transactions.

This is why insurance paid for by you the customer is a Joke, if the package is lost/damaged whatever, while the Vendor will *try* and tell you it's your problem because you didn't pay extra for insurance; it's not what the law says. Simply contact your credit card and provide them with the documentation and that charge to your account is gone.

Now if your shipping something yourself to someone, Yes by all means insurance it, because then you are the shipper and if somethings happens then you could be out the $$; but not the other way around.

Fox News Consumer Lawyer even did a spot on TV not long ago about this, and said flat out DON'T waste your money on paying extra for insurance on Ebay and any where else for that matter. It's one of the biggest misunderstandings and rip offs on the Internet these days.

So sum if up, sounds like WL was trying to get you to cancel your charge-back which then let's them off the hook and you then are out the money.......don't blame you one bit; I would never have done that either.

They made it sound like they didn't trust that you would cancel the dispute once they re-shipped the Laser, nice you trusted them with your money. Now as a customer though, they don't trust you. Very stupid of them, because after it got re-sent and signed & delivered to you, WL could easily have PayPal then throw out your claim; which I don't think would have even been necessary then.

As for the $100 return fee they refused to pay UPS, while it may seem foolish of them; to WL it's not really a $500 Laser anymore, it's a $100 liability, because it's China and while they happily charge us big $$$, I bet the return fee was more than WL really had "invested" in the Laser in the first place; thus the refusal.

Thanks for sharing, sadly doesn't look like too much has changed then.
 
Last edited:
electron said:
My understanding with UPS is that the recipient can't make any address change, they will only allow the shipper to whom "contracted" with UPS to deliver the package on their behalf, and thus they are the only one UPS will allow to alter an address.

I had something similar happen years ago and UPS told me they could not accept the address correction from me, rather it must come from the shipper.
I explained to UPS what happen and was told they understand, but technically the package is still "owned" by the shipper/vendor until delivered to the address specified on the label. Make sense because the Vendor is the one that actual paid UPS to ship the package. Sure you paid the Vendor, but the Vendor is the one that directly paid UPS and not you.

The shipper/vendor was a bone-head and never followed it up with UPS and it got returned to them and then the Vendor tried to charge my credit card, shipping two ways + a re-stock fee for their mistake. Guess what the credit card company did.....refusal & charge-back of the entire transactions.

This is why insurance paid for by you the customer is a Joke, if the package is lost/damaged whatever, while the Vendor will *try* and tell you it's your problem because you didn't pay extra for insurance; it's not what the law says. Simply contact your credit card and provide them with the documentation and that charge to your account is gone.

Now if your shipping something yourself to someone, Yes by all means insurance it, because then you are the shipper and if somethings happens then you could be out the $$; but not the other way around.

Fox News Consumer Lawyer even did a spot on TV not long ago about this, and said flat out DON'T waste your money on paying extra for insurance on Ebay and any where else for that matter. It's one of the biggest misunderstandings and rip offs on the Internet these days.

So sum if up, sounds like WL was trying to get you to cancel your charge-back which then let's them off the hook and you then are out the money.......don't blame you one bit; I would never have done that either.

They made it sound like they didn't trust that you would cancel the dispute once they re-shipped the Laser, nice you trusted them with your money. Now as a customer though, they don't trust you. Very stupid of them, because after it got re-sent and signed & delivered to you, WL could easily have PayPal then throw out your claim; which I don't think would have even been necessary then.

As for the $100 return fee they refused to pay UPS, while it may seem foolish of them; to WL it's not really a $500 Laser anymore, it's a $100 liability, because it's China and while they happily charge us big $$$, I bet the return fee was more than WL really had "invested" in the Laser in the first place; thus the refusal.

Thanks for sharing, sadly doesn't look like too much has changed then.
Click to expand...

tl;dr.

Seriously, I'm not trying to be offensive so please do not take this the wrong way. We don't need a wall of text, just the gist of it.

Fire Starter did an excellent job in reducing your previous wall of text to something more user friendly.
 
I've no idea what your talking about, I don't see anything I wrote that get reduced. If your unable to follow anything longer that a sentence or two or lose interest; do what I do....move on and don't read it. I stand behind the post, you can't just condense the whole world, too many facts get left out, and believe me I could have typed more :).

Peace
 
electron said:
I've no idea what your talking about, I don't see anything I wrote that get reduced. If your unable to follow anything longer that a sentence or two or lose interest; do what I do....move on and don't read it. I stand behind the post, you can't just condense the whole world, too many facts get left out, and believe me I could have typed more :).

Peace
Click to expand...

Yeah my bad, I feel stupid now lol.

I was so traumatized from the previous wall of text, I didn't even bother to compare names I just assumed you were shadowfox86. I guess you know the old saying, assumption is the mother of all f*ckups :)

Again, sorry.
 
electron said:
My understanding with UPS is that the recipient can't make any address change, they will only allow the shipper to whom "contracted" with UPS to deliver the package on their behalf, and thus they are the only one UPS will allow to alter an address.

I had something similar happen years ago and UPS told me they could not accept the address correction from me, rather it must come from the shipper.
I explained to UPS what happen and was told they understand, but technically the package is still "owned" by the shipper/vendor until delivered to the address specified on the label. Make sense because the Vendor is the one that actual paid UPS to ship the package. Sure you paid the Vendor, but the Vendor is the one that directly paid UPS and not you.

The shipper/vendor was a bone-head and never followed it up with UPS and it got returned to them and then the Vendor tried to charge my credit card, shipping two ways + a re-stock fee for their mistake. Guess what the credit card company did.....refusal & charge-back of the entire transactions.

This is why insurance paid for by you the customer is a Joke, if the package is lost/damaged whatever, while the Vendor will *try* and tell you it's your problem because you didn't pay extra for insurance; it's not what the law says. Simply contact your credit card and provide them with the documentation and that charge to your account is gone.

Now if your shipping something yourself to someone, Yes by all means insurance it, because then you are the shipper and if somethings happens then you could be out the $$; but not the other way around.

Fox News Consumer Lawyer even did a spot on TV not long ago about this, and said flat out DON'T waste your money on paying extra for insurance on Ebay and any where else for that matter. It's one of the biggest misunderstandings and rip offs on the Internet these days.

So sum if up, sounds like WL was trying to get you to cancel your charge-back which then let's them off the hook and you then are out the money.......don't blame you one bit; I would never have done that either.

They made it sound like they didn't trust that you would cancel the dispute once they re-shipped the Laser, nice you trusted them with your money. Now as a customer though, they don't trust you. Very stupid of them, because after it got re-sent and signed & delivered to you, WL could easily have PayPal then throw out your claim; which I don't think would have even been necessary then.

As for the $100 return fee they refused to pay UPS, while it may seem foolish of them; to WL it's not really a $500 Laser anymore, it's a $100 liability, because it's China and while they happily charge us big $$$, I bet the return fee was more than WL really had "invested" in the Laser in the first place; thus the refusal.

Thanks for sharing, sadly doesn't look like too much has changed then.
Click to expand...

Hi Joe,
I'll have give you a call and talk soon, but I wanted to comment on the insurance thing as I had a go in a year or so ago with MC/Visa on this subject. What you say is true, unless there is a disclaimer in the sales/shipping policies stating otherwise.
This is one of the reasons we have the statement on our polices page that we are not responsible for any loss or damage if the customer chose not to purchase insurance on the shipment. MC/Visa also said that the policy page stating the terms and conditions of the sale have to be setup so that the customer must click a checkbox stating that they agree to these conditions before checkout is allowed.
If the website doesn't have this listed in their policies page and no agreement box needs to be checked off to complete the deal, then you're good to go about not needing insurance.

And yes, with DHL. fedex and UPS, it's the shipper who must make any changes to the delivery address, otherwise anyone who had the tracking number and knew who the package was being shipped to could call them up and have the package diverted to wherever they wanted.

Take care Joe, I'll try and call you this weekend or on Monday morning.
 
Hello Jack, I have a routine Dentist appointment this coming Monday morning, but I should be home by noon time; my time :) Good to hear from you, got lots of catching up to do with you.

-Joe
(sorry to OP for any thread jack)
 
Sorry about the tl;dr, was about to leave for work so i didnt get a chance to sum it up. For the most part, firestarter summed it up well.

Ordered a 500$ laser. never recieved any updates on it. i was told it was shipping "tomorrow" after i emailed them about it. 2 weeks later i still hadn't recieved any updates on it, so i emailed them again. they finally provided a tracking number afterwards. They really did sent out the laser on the "tomorrow" date, just to a wrong address and ups sent it back to them. Since i didn't get the tracking information until 2 weeks later, it was already out of my control. This is bad in WL's part, if they'd given me the number when they sent it (like i'd asked) then i could've called ups and had them change the address or whatnot. At this point, the laser was already on its way to china though.

After some hassle with WL and paypals dispute system, WL finally said "screw off, we'll take our losses" at which point paypal had put up with enough of their BS as well and ordered them to send me a laser, or return the money. at this point they finally sent the laser, in a very crappy box that fell apart literally the day after i recieved it. the laser works nice though :)

I figured after 4 years WL customer service would've improved, but it would appear that it hasn't.

Looking back, i wish i hadn't paid 500 bucks for it though lol. can get a 130mw for like less than half that nowadays... oh well.
 
RBS worldpay automatically refunds the payment in 30 days if they don't ship. That's how i got my money back. Also, check your PM firestarter.
 
Fire Starter said:
Honestly, the only thing that hasn't been terrible about Wicked is the laser itself. No disappointment there... It works, has no problems, and hopefully will continue to work for years to come.

The problems were with the waiting, the lies, the shitty shipping method, etc. :p
Click to expand...
maybe years ago when they weren't getting very many orders and they had more time to create quality products. But now they're so rushed they just made everything as fast as they could, the insides of the Arctic look terrible.
 
Still no responses after several emails. Wicked just keeps on screwing up over and over.

Anyone know how much a chargeback will cost them?
 
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