Getting sick of the lazerer.com pseduo-SPAM

[rhd]

@rhd,

I have made one of the reviews that you have posted in this thread, and I've said it once, and this is the second time I say the same:

I bought the laser in question to the sale price on the web, NOT a penny more or a penny less.

I have NOT asked any discount or anything else.

I did this honest review because I wanted to do it, so that people know a little better
the lasers that sell this new company and make an idea before they buy, or not.

I have NOT had ANY benefit of any kind making this review, and I do NOT want to have.

There are still people who want to help without anything in return, I hope this time it is clear.

You may have a good ethic about your reviews, and I commend you for it.

But I guarantee you that many of the dozens of reviews that a simple search here pulls up, were not written with that same ethic in mind - especially the reviews that take, heading for heading, the format suggested BY lazerer.

 

[piferal]

You may have a good ethic about your reviews, and I commend you for it.

But I guarantee you that many of the dozens of reviews that a simple search here pulls up, were not written with that same ethic in mind - especially the reviews that take, heading for heading, the format suggested BY lazerer.

Ok, but as I see, unfortunately, there are so much suspicion by few members, I will not make reviews any more.

Yes, I know, maybe you don't care about that, ok, just wanted to say this.

 

[rhd]

Ok, but as I see, unfortunately, there are so much suspicion by few members, I will not make reviews any more.

Yes, I know, maybe you don't care about that, ok, just wanted to say this.

I think the suspicion is warranted. Take a look at this review:
http://laserpointerforums.com/f52/reveiw-rifle445-lazerer-65942.html
It follows Lazerer's suggested format to the letter. Lazerer's suggestion:

The Pros: [ All about the Pros on the item goes here. The quality, the package, shipping time, the power of the laser etc... You may mention our Power Certificate service here as well. ]

The Cons: [ All about the Cons on the item goes here. All about the Pros on the item goes here. The quality, the package, shipping time, the power of the laser etc... ]

Overall: [ Any additional things you want to tell ]

That review duplicates the Lazerer framework right down to placing mention of their Power Certificate service in the "Pros" category as requested.

Lazerer is buying at least some of their reviews with incentives. I recognize that this is liable to cause some animosity to be focussed in my direction from all the members here who have written legitimate unbiased reviews and feel that I am attacking their credibility. Please understand that I'm not. I am certain that many of the Lazerer reviews are legitimate and untainted. But I am equally certain that many of them are not.

 

[piferal]

I think the suspicion is warranted. Take a look at this review:
http://laserpointerforums.com/f52/reveiw-rifle445-lazerer-65942.html
It follows Lazerer's suggested format to the letter. Lazerer's suggestion:



That review duplicates the Lazerer framework right down to placing mention of their Power Certificate service in the "Pros" category as requested.

Lazerer is buying at least some of their reviews with incentives. I recognize that this is liable to cause some animosity to be focussed in my direction from all the members here who have written legitimate unbiased reviews and feel that I am attacking their credibility. Please understand that I'm not. I am certain that many of the Lazerer reviews are legitimate and untainted. But I am equally certain that many of them are not.

Whatever you want, but do not put me in the same boat.

I would not let me buy for $5, $10.., or by a laser, or anything else.

I do it because I want to do it, and to help other forum members to chose, period.

@Pontiacg5, I can't "be bought like that", this is my hobby, I don't do it for money, I have ethics, and I'm honest.

And whether to help the other members, I have to be under suspicion, this is the last time, NO more reviews, as I said before.

End.

 

[InfinitusEquitas]

Oh, lol - I totally spaced on the reason you were taking offense :crackup:

IE = InfinitusEquitas - gotcha!

Not my intended usage here

I was hoping not, but since the abbreviation is used all the time... well you can see where I was coming from

But I guarantee you that many of the dozens of reviews that a simple search here pulls up, were not written with that same ethic in mind - especially the reviews that take, heading for heading, the format suggested BY lazerer.

Question: Is a review of a free piece of crap, if honest, any less valid than a review of a paid for piece of crap?

Both reviews would show that it is still a piece of crap...

I think the suspicion is warranted. Take a look at this review:
http://laserpointerforums.com/f52/reveiw-rifle445-lazerer-65942.html
It follows Lazerer's suggested format to the letter. Lazerer's suggestion:

That review duplicates the Lazerer framework right down to placing mention of their Power Certificate service in the "Pros" category as requested.

Lazerer is buying at least some of their reviews with incentives. I recognize that this is liable to cause some animosity to be focussed in my direction from all the members here who have written legitimate unbiased reviews and feel that I am attacking their credibility. Please understand that I'm not. I am certain that many of the Lazerer reviews are legitimate and untainted. But I am equally certain that many of them are not.

I see your point, but there is nothing wrong with the framework IMO. I would approach a review in the same format regardless. It's the way I personally prefer a review to be formatted.

Besides, every single review on that laser has been consistent... and actually led to more honesty since lazerer started selling them as 800mW instead of the originally claimed 1W and dropped the price on them.

Also IMO offering a small incentive for an unbiased review is good marketing, nothing more.

If on the other hand someone is given a free laser, with the express agreement that they write a positive review... well that's a different story.

Bottom line is I think you'll see the reviews and general commentary die down as time passes.

 

[jakeGT]

They offered me the 10mW 473 for $200, marked down from $289

But even if I took the deal, I would be making a review that was unbiased. I would still point out pro's and con's

 

[rhd]

They offered me the 10mW 473 for $200, marked down from $289

But even if I took the deal, I would be making a review that was unbiased. I would still point out pro's and con's

They made me this offer also. I also turned it down.

I think many people underestimate the difficulties associated with being unbiased when there is a monetary interaction. The difficulty is a lot more subtle than something as simplistic as being "bought" for a positive review.

At a very basic level, if you're paying $200 instead of $300 for an item, your emotional reaction to the item is different. Your expectations and your resulting level of satisfaction are very different when different amounts of money have been allocated to the product. This is the case even when the logical side of your brain knows that you should evaluate the product based on a higher retail price.

That's just one example of many. There are numerous reasons why a monetary incentive is generally seen as at odds with the tendering of an unbiased review, even when the reviewer is consciously attempting not to let the incentive bias their review. This isn't a ground-breaking proposition. There are well-established ethics that professionals adhere to when reviewing products. A common example of such is the practice of taking "review units" that must be returned after a review is completed.

At the very least, a reviewer should disclaim if their product was compensated or discounted as a result of their writing the review. Then the reader can give this factor whatever weight they deem appropriate.

 

[Pontiacg5]

They offered me the 10mW 473 for $200, marked down from $289

But even if I took the deal, I would be making a review that was unbiased. I would still point out pro's and con's

And you should state in that review that you received the laser at a pretty good discount even if you intend to post an unbiased review or not.

RHD summed up the exact reason that the info on the discount should be disclosed...

 

[lasersbee]

I think the suspicion is warranted. Take a look at this review:
http://laserpointerforums.com/f52/reveiw-rifle445-lazerer-65942.html
It follows Lazerer's suggested format to the letter. Lazerer's suggestion:



That review duplicates the Lazerer framework right down to placing mention of their Power Certificate service in the "Pros" category as requested.

Lazerer is buying at least some of their reviews with incentives. I recognize that this is liable to cause some animosity to be focussed in my direction from all the members here who have written legitimate unbiased reviews and feel that I am attacking their credibility. Please understand that I'm not. I am certain that many of the Lazerer reviews are legitimate and untainted. But I am equally certain that many of them are not.

I just read that review again... He shows the Pros and cons of that
Laser. He also stated the demeanor of the seller and I concur on
both fronts.. I too have dealt with the seller..

He did not sugar coat the review... Some first time reviewers are
not experienced in laying out a review.. Because he chose to lay
his review out in that Format doesn't make the review biased...
dishonest or wrong...

There is a simple solution to your need to know....
If you want to know if a reviewer received compensation for his
review....
WHY DON'T YOU ASK THEM ALL IN THEIR REVIEW THREADS..
instead of pointing your accusing finger at all of them..

What is it exactly that pi$$es you off that much with this seller
of good up to spec Lasers... I can't see what is so wrong...
It's not like the seller is compensating customers under the table..
as he could easily have done without telling anyone...

The seller has been honest and upfront with the Forum community..

Two years ago I was selling the LaserBee II on the Forum. Any LPF
member would get a 10% discount refund off the retail price off our
website.. This was know up front.
By your accounting that would make all the reviews about those LPMs
biased and untrustworthy because I compensated the buyer...

Is it a Canadian thing...:thinking:
Nah... can't be that... I'm Canadian and I have no problems with it...

Maybe I'll write a biased positive review since I did not receive
any compensation...


Jerry

 

[Pontiacg5]

Two years ago I was selling the LaserBee II on the Forum. Any LPF
member would get a 10% discount refund off the retail price off our
website.. This was know up front.
By your accounting that would make all the reviews about those LPMs
biased and untrustworthy because I compensated the buyer...

Really Jerry? Is that the best you can come up with? Either you are a complete idiot and can't see how that relates to this at all or you are trying to argue for the sake of arguing.

Think about it for a minute, did you require a review for that 10% compensation? No? Then how is that point at all relevant to this?

Maybe I'll write a biased positive review since I did not receive any compensation...

Then it's not a biased review.

I'll quote this again, from RHD's previous post.

At a very basic level, if you're paying $200 instead of $300 for an item, your emotional reaction to the item is different. Your expectations and your resulting level of satisfaction are very different when different amounts of money have been allocated to the product. This is the case even when the logical side of your brain knows that you should evaluate the product based on a higher retail price.

 

[lasersbee]

Really Jerry? Is that the best you can come up with? Either you are a complete idiot and can't see how that relates to this at all or you are trying to argue for the sake of arguing.

Speaking of idiots....Nice Troll fail....:crackup::crackup:

Jerry

 

[XiteR]

I want to share my thoughts on this topic & i guess Jerry said it all.
In other words I agree with Jerry. The review had both Up/Down aspects of the laser and i respect the member coz I've seen other good posts from him.

If this going to increase the amount of lasers reviewed then thats a good thing, because that means:

1- The company is happy with the quality & service they are providing to there customers and that they are sure that any review will help them (the company are sure that the review will be positive because they are doing things right not because they are giving a 5% back).
2- Members here can benefit from those reviews.

In the end... if the company that is giving discount/refund to the customer is a Good, Trustworthy then thats a good thing .

Again... Those are only my thoughts (i could be wrong).

Thx

-Ali

 

[rhd]

Jerry, take a look at the line where I said:

"At the very least, a reviewer should disclaim if their product was compensated or discounted as a result of their writing the review. Then the reader can give this factor whatever weight they deem appropriate."

Then you said:

It's not like the seller is compensating customers under the table.. as he could easily have done without telling anyone...

You agree with me! Details of any compensation should be upfront, cards on the table, fully disclosed. I can't tell you how happy this makes me that we're finally seeing eye to eye on something!

It's very rare that I can truly say both you and I are on the same wavelength. I often feel like my comments are 532, whilst yours are the leaky 808. (all over the place, sort of transparent, not entirely coherent, and basically better off filtered out)

 

[Pontiacg5]

It's very rare that I can truly say both you and I are on the same wavelength. I often feel like my comments are 532, whilst yours are the leaky 808. (all over the place, sort of transparent, not entirely coherent, and basically better off filtered out)

Jerry has no idea where his opinion is. I used to think he was just an ass but I'm starting to see that he is just not all there. The fact that he can't type a complete sentence without adding 2 to 6 periods is also highly amusing. I think of this family guy clip every time I read something he posts.

 

[lasersbee]

You agree with me! Details of any compensation should be upfront, cards on the table, fully disclosed. I can't tell you how happy this makes me that we're finally seeing eye to eye on something!

It's very rare that I can truly say both you and I are on the same wavelength. I often feel like my comments are 532, whilst yours are the leaky 808. (all over the place, sort of transparent, not entirely coherent, and basically better off filtered out)

You are either trying to be sarcastic or just trying to
confuse me....:crackup:

The seller stated that he will give a discount for a review
of a fully paid for Laser...
He did not stipulate "only positive reviews"...
The details were up front before any reviews were posted..

I know he offered it.... the Reviewers know he offered it...
the Forum members that read it know he offered it and you
know he offered it....

Where was it hidden or not disclosed.. :thinking:

Just because a reviewer didn't Paste it again on the 1st Post
of a review in big Red Letters changes nothing.... we all know...

I still see nothing wrong in his sales approach... he.. himself
is not spamming the Forum...


Jerry

 

[lasersbee]

Jerry has no idea where his opinion is. I used to think he was just an ass but I'm starting to see that he is just not all there. The fact that he can't type a complete sentence without adding 2 to 6 periods is also highly amusing. I think of this family guy clip every time I read something he posts.

Another Troll attempt...
So sad...:cryyy:

Jerry