Bad Experience with SwimminSurfer256

[rhd]

Then what you're saying is that if you sold a laptop but every component was "tested" but only for 1 minute, then its okay? You're saying you dont have to see if the full usage of the graphics card will burn it out? swim never tested the laser that long.. you say its not his fault because he never tested it for an hour to see if anything would burn out?

What is "full usage" of the graphics card? What does "full usage" imply?

 

[zdarkazn]

You didn't ask how long it was tested for. In fact Swimm said he tested it for around 15 minutes a month. Why is it so hard for you to understand, there is no set "lasers must be tested ON for this long before they are ok" time.

This is not e-bay or amazon. There are no set rules for every listing. Since you did not ask "has the laser been tested for 1 hour+? Will you warranty it for 7 days?" Trying to demand that stuff after the fact because "ebay does it" is not a valid argument.

And as far as the laptop testing thing? Yeah, checking to make sure it works as it should is plenty, I'm not going to run benchmarks or stress tests or anything to make sure unless I have some reason to think something is about to fail. The same is true for the argon, 15-30 minutes a month testing is plenty. If Swimm had no reason to think the thing was about to break then that is plenty of testing. Since you didn't ask for any further testing before you bought it you are out of luck in my eyes.

Look at what was used to pay..paypal is basically ebay. I never said ebay covered items for 7 days. ebay covers for items SNAD. Paypal is owned by ebay. Paypal DOES cover items SNAD. You call checking to make sure one thing works is okay? Seriously, its people like you that make buyers afraid of buying anything online.. you rip unaware buyers off for not testing everything and claim it as used. Back to the laser..if you buy a laptop off of a laptop forum such as the xoticpc one, and the laptop dies after an hour, the seller is at fault, even though he tested it for hours at a time.. Whats the difference between that and this? They're both electronics, they both ran for a while before dying. And for this laser..it was never even tested up to 45 minutes..

 

[zdarkazn]

What is "full usage" of the graphics card? What does "full usage" imply?

Full usage is when you check the gpu usage and its at its max, which is usually different for every graphics card..It would also show the temperature of the gpu, the speed, etc..which isnt that hard to test. I dont get why a seller would require a buyer to pay to have that tested..

 

[rhd]

You're saying you dont have to see if the full usage of the graphics card will burn it out? swim never tested the laser that long.. you say its not his fault because he never tested it for an hour to see if anything would burn out?

Full usage is when you check the gpu usage and its at its max, which is usually different for every graphics card..It would also show the temperature of the gpu, the speed, etc..which isnt that hard to test. I dont get why a seller would require a buyer to pay to have that tested..

Well then yes, that IS what I'm saying (I'm surprised that I agree). But no, that's definitely not something I would be testing if I sold a laptop. I wouldn't be running GPU speed or temperature benchmarks on the video card before selling a used laptop that I wasn't warrantying. There's no way on earth I would ever even think to test that.

If a buyer said "hey, I want your laptop, but I need the graphics card to be able to do XYZ, can you run this particular test for me", then I'd say "sure". But I never would have preemptively run a specific test like that.

(...) the laptop dies after an hour, the seller is at fault, even though he tested it for hours at a time.

I don't think that's the case. I don't think the seller is liable.

- So you sell a laptop under the agreed condition that there is "no warranty, and no returns" but also with the condition that you'll guarantee that the laptop works "upon arrive".

- The laptop works upon arrival.

- But then it dies an hour later, from a new ailment that wasn't present upon arrival, nor earlier at the time of sale.

I think the story is over then, no? If the problem wasn't present at the time of sale, nor at the time of arrival, but only manifested afterwards, then how can you say any of the conditions of the transaction were violated?

 

[zdarkazn]

Well then yes, that IS what I'm saying (I'm surprised that I agree). But no, that's definitely not something I would be testing if I sold a laptop. I wouldn't be running GPU speed or temperature benchmarks on the video card before selling a used laptop that I wasn't warrantying. There's no way on earth I would ever even think to test that.

If a buyer said "hey, I want your laptop, but I need the graphics card to be able to do XYZ, can you run this particular test for me", then I'd say "sure". But I never would have preemptively run a specific test like that.



I don't think that's the case. So you sell a laptop under the agreed condition that there is "no warranty, and no returns" but also with the condition that you'll guarantee that the laptop works "upon arrive".

The laptop works upon arrival.

But then it dies an hour later, from a new ailment that wasn't present upon arrival.

I think the story is over.

Its still your fault..you sold them the laptop that wasnt tested completely. Lets try another example..how about a ps3? You sell one thats you only turn on for 10 minutes and say it works. Buyer gets it, uses it, and the ps3 gets the yellow ring. That IS your fault for not testing it to see if it has yellow ring..

 

[Pontiacg5]

Look at what was used to pay..paypal is basically ebay. I never said ebay covered items for 7 days. ebay covers for items SNAD. Paypal is owned by ebay. Paypal DOES cover items SNAD. You call checking to make sure one thing works is okay? Seriously, its people like you that make buyers afraid of buying anything online.. you rip unaware buyers off for not testing everything and claim it as used. Back to the laser..if you buy a laptop off of a laptop forum such as the xoticpc one, and the laptop dies after an hour, the seller is at fault, even though he tested it for hours at a time.. Whats the difference between that and this? They're both electronics, they both ran for a while before dying. And for this laser..it was never even tested up to 45 minutes..

Paypal is not e-bay, quit drawing conclusions that aren't there to justify your argument. E-bay is an online auction site, paypal is a fancy online bank. They are not the same no matter who owns who. There is only ONE thing to check with an argon laser, does it lase? What else is there to check?? The laser was also not SNAD, it is an argon laser that worked perfectly fine for 45 minutes. That is a considerable period of time, if it was a few seconds or a few minutes I might agree with you...

I have no problem selling stuff online, ask any of the people I've sold things to here. My problem is people like you who know deep down that it's not the sellers fault but they try to stick it to the seller anyway since they think they can. It's people like you that make people nervous about selling things online, the unscrupulous buyer that is becoming more and more prevalent.

An argon laser is not a laptop, I don't know why you keep using that analogy but it's a crappy one. An argon laser is a pretty stupid device, chaces are it works or it doesn't. There is no sure fire way to test an argon laser and have it tell you everything is OK like a laptop GPU. Also, chances are a laptop is not pulled used from some old discontinued medical equipment like all of these argon lasers.

 

[Guyfromhe]

Its still your fault..you sold them the laptop that wasnt tested completely. Lets try another example..how about a ps3? You sell one thats you only turn on for 10 minutes and say it works. Buyer gets it, uses it, and the ps3 gets the yellow ring. That IS your fault for not testing it to see if it has yellow ring..

What if you had used that PS3 for years and you had just played it for 4 hours prior to sending it to them and they just happened to get the yellow ring... would you loose your money AND your PS3 and be happy with it or would you be whining the opposite case?

 

[rhd]

Its still your fault..you sold them the laptop that wasnt tested completely. Lets try another example..how about a ps3? You sell one thats you only turn on for 10 minutes and say it works. Buyer gets it, uses it, and the ps3 gets the yellow ring. That IS your fault for not testing it to see if it has yellow ring..

I can't really relate to that - I don't play video games or know what a yellow ring is.

But I suppose if the yellow ring is something bad, and it's something that existed on my end before I sold the item, then yes, I'm at fault.

But that's not an analogy that fits. In your example, the "yellow ring" flaw existed before the sale. In the Argon's case, whatever is broken, wasn't broken before the sale.

 

[zdarkazn]

Paypal is not e-bay, quit drawing conclusions that aren't there to justify your argument. E-bay is an online auction site, paypal is a fancy online bank. They are not the same no matter who owns who. There is only ONE thing to check with an argon laser, does it lase? What else is there to check?? The laser was also not SNAD, it is an argon laser that worked perfectly fine for 45 minutes. That is a considerable period of time, if it was a few seconds or a few minutes I might agree with you...

I have no problem selling stuff online, ask any of the people I've sold things to here. My problem is people like you who know deep down that it's not the sellers fault but they try to stick it to the seller anyway since they think they can. It's people like you that make people nervous about selling things online, the unscrupulous buyer that is becoming more and more prevalent.

An argon laser is not a laptop, I don't know why you keep using that analogy but it's a crappy one. An argon laser is a pretty stupid device, chaces are it works or it doesn't. There is no sure fire way to test an argon laser and have it tell you everything is OK like a laptop GPU. Also, chances are a laptop is not pulled used from some old discontinued medical equipment like all of these argon lasers.

Get out of here...paypal and ebay have the same item SNAD policies. I have no problem SELLING AND BUYING stuff online because i know if the buyer says a hard drive failed, i would refund them for that. As for buying stuff, i know that if theres a problem with it the seller would refund me..up until now. YOU on the other hand, you make it difficult for buyers to buy online because all you want to do is make money fast and rip buyers off so all you want to do is test an item for 5 minutes, says it works and then sell it fast to unaware buyers. You're trying to use this forum to back you up on your sold items huh? Stick an untested electronic on ebay or amazon and sell it and i can bet you that if it has a problem within an hour YOU will be at fault. Its NOT just ebay. Only sellers like you are nervous about selling items because you're afraid the aware buyers will be able to exploit your way to rip them off for things that you claim as being used.

 

[Guyfromhe]

I can't really relate to that - I don't play video games or know what a yellow ring is.

It's an indicator of hardware failure. Sometimes it can be triggered by heat, other times it can be pretty much anything.. If the seller knew it was broken though than that is for sure not right. Swimmin didn't know about an impending failure of this laser and there was no way he could predict it.

EDIT: also why would a seller cover you on a used dead hard drive when the manufacturer won't? (aside from DOA)

 

[zdarkazn]

What if you had used that PS3 for years and you had just played it for 4 hours prior to sending it to them and they just happened to get the yellow ring... would you loose your money AND your PS3 and be happy with it or would you be whining the opposite case?

I would be willing to have them send it back for a full refund or even do a partial. Like i said, ive dealt with these things before. @ person that commented about ebay feedback. WHO CARES ABOUT FEEDBACK, any seller can make a new account and it'll have 100% feedback after a few sales.

I can't really relate to that - I don't play video games or know what a yellow ring is.

But I suppose if the yellow ring is something bad, and it's something that existed on my end before I sold the item, then yes, I'm at fault.

But that's not an analogy that fits. In your example, the "yellow ring" flaw existed before the sale. In the Argon's case, whatever is broken, wasn't broken before the sale.

Yellow ring never existed before the sale, it happened after the buyer got it. The seller is at fault..thats how online sales work... Now what about the hard drive inside a ps3 then? What if it failed after the buyer got it because you never loaded anything onto it? Thats YOUR fault, not the buyers.

 

[Pontiacg5]

Get out of here...paypal and ebay have the same item SNAD policies. I have no problem SELLING AND BUYING stuff online because i know if the buyer says a hard drive failed, i would refund them for that. As for buying stuff, i know that if theres a problem with it the seller would refund me..up until now. YOU on the other hand, you make it difficult for buyers to buy online because all you want to do is make money fast and rip buyers off so all you want to do is test an item for 5 minutes, says it works and then sell it fast to unaware buyers. You're trying to use this forum to back you up on your sold items huh? Stick an untested electronic on ebay or amazon and sell it and i can bet you that if it has a problem within an hour YOU will be at fault. Its NOT just ebay. Only sellers like you are nervous about selling items because you're afraid the aware buyers will be able to exploit your way to rip them off for things that you claim as being used.

Whatever, you clearly don't listen to reason. I guess the fact that I've been selling stuff on this forum for almost 5 years now without one bad deal makes me a bad seller trying to rip everyone off

Swimm, I hope you don't refund this guy a penny but that's just me :beer:

I can see you clearly don't care about a reputation or anything, I mean I guess you can always just make a new account and make a few sales. Exactly what I expected from someone with your mindset.

 

[zdarkazn]

It's an indicator of hardware failure. Sometimes it can be triggered by heat, other times it can be pretty much anything.. If the seller knew it was broken though than that is for sure not right. Swimmin didn't know about an impending failure of this laser and there was no way he could predict it.

EDIT: also why would a seller cover you on a used dead hard drive when the manufacturer won't? (aside from DOA)

The seller covers because they're the one that sold the item and listed it as a working laptop. The laptop did not work when used correctly..so they seller covers..

 

[Guyfromhe]

The seller covers because they're the one that sold the item and listed it as a working laptop. The laptop did not work when used correctly..so they seller covers..

It worked and then it died.
Anyway whatever. Let Paypal decide since this is clearly going nowhere.

Good luck to both of you.

 

[zdarkazn]

Whatever, you clearly don't listen to reason. I guess the fact that I've been selling stuff on this forum for almost 5 years now without one bad deal makes me a bad seller trying to rip everyone off

Swimm, I hope you don't refund this guy a penny but that's just me :beer:

I can see you clearly don't care about a reputation or anything, I mean I guess you can always just make a new account and make a few sales. Exactly what I expected from someone with your mindset.

Trying to use the forum to your advantage? Take all your untested crap to ebay and amazon and sell it there. You'll get lots of negative feedbacks and most likely have your account frozen. Your 5 years on the forum is NOTHING compared to my 4 years on ebay + amazon + working for a customer returns warehouse. YOUR mindset is stuck on this forum and what you've learned here. You've learned that you can sell unaware buyers items that you dont test fully and claim to work..

 

[zdarkazn]

It worked and then it died.
Anyway whatever. Let Paypal decide since this is clearly going nowhere.

Good luck to both of you.

Sure...