Pioneer 12X Blu-Ray-- BDR-205

daguin · Oct 22, 2009

ZRTMWA said:
Wow!!! The first data from the 12x!!! It appears to go a few mW higher than the 8x. I'm still wondering and waiting to know what will happen once you push it farther. Thanks Dave.

Extending the slope, it would reach 600mW at ~400mA and 700mW at ~460mA. That is quite a step up in current from the 8X!

We need somebody to make the slopes visible to be able to compare them.

Peace,
dave

pseudolobster · Oct 22, 2009

Here's a simple graph.. I'm not really good with excel, so I couldn't figure out how to plot the vf on any reasonable scale...

LuxIgnis · Oct 22, 2009

Good data, but wasn't the 8x diode tested with Aixiz acrylic lenses vs the 12x with the 405-G1?

I guess both of them should be tested with the very same lenses in order to have a rough idea of the relative power.

Even two lenses of the same type would yeald a bit different results, same thing for two different drivers.

The the driver and the lenses should be the "control", and only the diode should change in order to have a scientifically relevant comparison.

pseudolobster · Oct 22, 2009

Oh, and here's the comparison graph... Very telling.

EDIT: I corrected myself later on, but if anyone's using this graph as a 1-for-1 comparison, take note the 8x was tested with an aixiz acrylic lens, whereas the 12x was tested with a 405-G1 AR coated glass lens... The 8x line should be a good 25% higher. See later on in the thread for some more comprehensive graphs by IgorT.

Crazy Jay · Oct 22, 2009

Dave this is so cool. The power output is almost as you predicted it would be.

pseudolobster · Oct 22, 2009

I'll let Igor do the rest of the graphs... I can't find the data for the recent torture tests, my graph is based on the original 8x data from the first diode tested (and as mentioned before, I'm pretty sure that was with an aixiz acrylic)... Still, even if you factor out 25% of that power, it has a steeper slope and no signs of any kinks or dropoffs... Lookin good!!

LuxIgnis · Oct 22, 2009

I wish that data was real, but how can you compare apples and oranges?
8x with acrylic vs 12x with Jrob's 405-g-1 glass lens?

I am puzzled by your optimism.

It is possible that these 12x have some selected 8x diodes.

from the 8x thread , it seems that with the Jrob lens the 8x reached 512mw at 365ma vs 519mw at 350 for the 12x.

that's more like it.

LuxIgnis · Oct 22, 2009

If the lense used is reflective, like the uncoated aixiz, it would explain the different slope.
The more light you shine at it, the more it is reflected back.
Can't Dave do a side by side comparison with same lenses, same driver and same power supply?
That would be awsome data.

mfo · Oct 22, 2009

LuxIgnis said:
I wish that data was real, but how can you compare apples and oranges?
8x with acrylic vs 12x with Jrob's 405-g-1 glass lens?

I am puzzled by your optimism.

It is possible that these 12x have some selected 8x diodes.

from the 8x thread , it seems that with the Jrob lens the 8x reached 512mw at 365ma vs 519mw at 350 for the 12x.

that's more like it.

I thought you couldn't use an acrylic above 6x due to the fact that it'll degrade?

Anyhow, this laser is awesome Dave. Thank you for sharing the results with us.

LuxIgnis · Oct 22, 2009

The graph is telling exactly one thing: if you add 28% from the Jrob lens, the diodes are nearly identical, that means the differences are not statistically relevant.

The slopes look different because 128% of 100mw is 128mw, but 128% of 400mw is 512mw, so at 100mw the two lines of the graph would diverge by 28mw on the vertical axis, and at 400mw they would diverge by 112mw.
I would say that there is roughly a 1% difference in the two diodes tested. Considering the different driver ( the electronic components probably have a 5% variance) and considering that diodes are not exactly the same (as seen with phr diodes).... I let you come up with a conclusion.

Tech_Junkie · Oct 22, 2009

LuxIgnis said:
Can't Dave do a side by side comparison with same lenses, same driver and same power supply?
That would be awsome data.

Give him a little time...will ya? Geez..

Why dont you fork out the money and buy one too. Then we would have 2 to compare. That would be awesome data.

jayrob · Oct 22, 2009

daguin said:
Who wants some data?

I use a Rkcstr driver so the lowest current is ~57mA. The test was done with a 405-G-1 lens (from Jayrob)

Pioneer BDR-205BK (12X) blu-ray

mA - mW - VF
57 --- 48 -- 4.1
100 - 125 - 4.49
150 - 198 - 4.95
200 - 281 - 5.24
250 - 356 - 5.48
300 - 443 - 5.64
350 - 519 - 5.76

That's all the farther I pushed it (utill maybe we know more?). Maybe someone with more computer savvy than me can graph this and then set a comparison to the 8X graphs

http://laserpointerforums.com/f51/pioneer-8x-blu-ray-bdr-203-a-36790-3.html

http://laserpointerforums.com/f38/8x-diode-murder-fund-43993-16.html

Peace,
dave

Cool Dave!

It does seem to be a little 'Hotter' than any BDR-203 diode. (except for that one 'freak' at the top of FrancoRob's compilation graph by Arernared) Even just looking at the 300mA mark, it seems like a nice 'Hot' diode.

FrancoRob's compilation graph for comparison:
http://laserpointerforums.com/f38/8x-br-diodes-42806.html

Plus, the forward voltage seems a little lower too...

Hopefully this means that it is a different diode, and not just a 'freak'. You seem to always get 'freak' diodes... :crackup:

The differences are not by a whole lot though. :thinking:

LuxIgnis · Oct 22, 2009

to techjunkie,
what exactly have I said wrong?
Are you pissed because you can't read a graph, or because you were hoping to get a better diode than the 8x?.
I am also looking closely and was hoping for a 800mw diode, but I am realistic. It's the same exact diode, I am just trying to help out so people don't burn too many of these before they finally realyze that it's the same diode.
I also am about to buy a 8x and I was undecided between the 8x and the 12x, but the data is clear, where is the 40-50% increase in output that one would expect from a drive that is capable of writing 50% faster?
So far I see a 1.something percentage point increase, and would hate to see a perfectly good diode die an untimely death.
Even if it gets pushed to 600mw or 700mw it will be a 8x diode doing it, not more, not less.

LuxIgnis · Oct 22, 2009

jayrob said:
Cool Dave!

It does seem to be 'Hotter' than any BDR-203 diode. (except for that one 'freak' at the top of FrancoRob's compilation graph by Arernared) Even just looking at the 300mA mark, it seems like a really 'Hot' diode.

FrancoRob's compilation graph for comparison:
http://laserpointerforums.com/f38/8x-br-diodes-42806.html

Plus, the forward voltage seems a little lower too...

Hopefully this means that it is a different diode, and not just a 'freak'. You seem to always get 'freak' diodes... :crackup:

Exactly, I reckon that these are "hotter" diodes. Probably selected by machines for the 12x production run.
It probably is hotter but that doesn't guarantee it won't die from its own optical output.
What's the highest mw a 8x has gotten to so far?

jayrob · Oct 22, 2009

Check out FrancoRob's compilation graph of all known 8X owners on LPF than I linked...

It looks like the top one listed is the highest power, but it seems 'freakishly' over and above any of the others.

daguin · Oct 22, 2009

pseudolobster said:
Oh, and here's the comparison graph... Very telling.

If that data for the BDR-203 was taken from the 8X thread, those readings were taken with an aiXiz acrylic. We need to compare them to the graph in the "mudrer" thread

http://laserpointerforums.com/f38/8x-diode-murder-fund-43993-16.html

Peace,
dave

**EDIT** I forgot about FrancoRob's graph of the 8X's. It is much better!

**EDIT** P.S. On FrancoRob's graph there are three putting out over 500mW. However, all of those are at 360mA or higher

Pioneer 12X Blu-Ray-- BDR-205

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