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Politics and General Debates Thread

Hap

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*Shakenawake, don’t you know the rule of being a democrat is to sit down, and shut the fuck up and vote for whoever the DNC puts in front of our faces?*

*Sarcasm over* LOL:LOL:

-Alex
 



RedCowboy

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More government and less freedom is not the answer to anything.
Nobody is dying for lack of medical care, there are plenty of free community clinics and help for those who can't pay and every city has an indigent hospital, in Atlanta there is Grady where the uninsured can get any medical procedure needed, you may have to wait until it's needed but you will not die.

Still Bernie Sanders actually cares about people, some of his ideas are outrageous but I can see why people like him, but you won't get him because the dems and Billionaire Bloomberg will cheat everyone and Bernie Sanders just like they did last time, I bet we see a brokered convention.
 

Shakenawake

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Yeah Hap, I love how they think they can subvert the will of the voters when choosing a candidate then suddenly want our vote to count when picking between establishment stooges. I've been shamed for voting Jill by many dems.

Sure red there are efforts to provide medical care to the poor, and I appreciate them very much, but at least 30,000 people die every year due to not having access so they aren't reaching everyone, and shouldn't be expected to be able to. This is a disagreement with libertarians that I have. They would rather leave all functions of charity to organizations like the church. The problem with that is the church cant help everyone and can discriminate against nonbelievers or gays etc. Recently the trump administration relaxed restrictions on such organizations who receive federal dollars to provide help, and now allows them to discriminate against some of the groups I mentioned. So they can use my tax dollars, the tax dollars of an atheist, to discriminate against other atheists.

I wont be voting for that racist, authoritarian, war crime justifying goon Bloomberg if he somehow steals it from Bernie, but honestly I think that tool Pete is the bigger threat. How he and amy have surged as much as they have is a mystery to me. Glad to see Biden tanking. Guess him telling people to vote for someone else and telling creepy irrelevant stories didnt work out so well. Bless pete and amy for splitting the "centrist" vote. Oddly, a majority of Biden supporters have said Bernie is their second choice even though amy and pete are much closer ideologically. It's almost like people vote for personalities and not policies. How bizarre

Aslo red, a policy bloomberg is known for, stop and frisk, (a clear violation of our 4th amendment right) is a policy that trump supported, if you recall the debate with HRC. I suspect trump was right when he said HRC supported it too but wouldnt say so for political reasons. Given her "superpredator" b.s. and her admission of holding "public positions" and "private positions"

 
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RedCowboy

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Yes many do vote based on personalities more than just policy as policy can change on a whim and that's because all politicians are liars and what they say is not believable unless their personality is ( more trustworthy/likeable ) and not contrived or outright blatantly synthetic.

Bernie may be a socialist nut but he believes what he says and will say the same thing tomorrow.

Trump may be a buffoon but he wears his heart on his sleeve and is actually more transparent than most.......now Barry was a smooth talking SOB but a liar all the same, that's why people liked him so much, his BS was not so obvious to everyone and many people just want to believe the BS enough to feel good and live their lives, but anyone who can see the forest through the trees knows better.
 

Shakenawake

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To a degree I agree with that red.

Another thing i find bizarre is Tulsi's popularity among republicans, given that ideologically she is closest to Bernie
 

RedCowboy

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She's a military gal and seems to say it as she means it, I think she's trustworthy but I can't accept her 2nd amendment policy, other than that I like her, but she's not really in the running for some reason........you would think being a woman would help.......I think Butt-edge-edge is completely untrustworthy but the SJW's want to show their not 5exist more than they dislike his personality, he looks sneaky, always looking up with his head turned down, like he just shit on the carpet but you haven't found it yet.

Dems are salivating for Bloomturds money so they are split between him and Butt-edge-edge but the people want Bernie and all the Butt-edge -edge SJW's would likely support Bernie........well most, but the dems don't want Bernie and will find a way to cheat him, likely a brokered convention, I just don't see Butt-edge-edge or Bloomturd winning, the real question is will the people's voices count and is Bernie too radical, my money is on Trump ATM but I do like crazy Bernie better than Butt-edge-edge or Bloomturd, I think Bernie would have to compromise a lot if elected, If I had to choose a dem it would be Bernie.
 
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Shakenawake

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Yeah I guess it's the military thing. Not sure about her position on the 2nd, I havent seen much from her campaign on the subject. I know Bernie supports a " assault weapons" ban, one of the areas of disagreement I have with him. I disagree with Tulsi on her BDS vote and prefer bernie's healthcare plan to hers, but hers is better than liz warren's IMO. Tulsi picked up a lot of the Yang Gang. She has said shes going all the way to the convention but shes polling at like 2% sadly. I'm afraid she will do some damage to her future political career but we'll see. I personally hope Bernie picks her for VP

Yeah Pete is a rat for sure. How his connection to the company that had the vote counting app is allowed is mind blowing to me. I assume you meant SJWs supporting him because he is gay. Yeah I hate identity politics. Some so called lefties dont like Bernie because he is an old white guy, and recently liz warren implied he is sexist. What a joke. I wish bernie would stop calling biden and liz his friends. They're clearly not
 
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Alaskan

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OK, lets move to something more threatening than the radical left, from what I see they won't be able to do what they want anyway....

China might though:

 

paul1598419

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To the comments that people have enough access to health care....that is a ridiculous comment. Many poor people die daily from not having access to health care. I have been lucky as I have always had good health care coverage because it was always offered everywhere I ever worked, but that is hardly the case for poor persons and minorities especially. There are even prejudices in medicine among medical colleges where blacks are said to not feel pain to the same extent as people of European origins or that they have thicker skin. These have actually been taught to medical students and continue in some universities.
 

RedCowboy

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To the comments that people have enough access to health care....that is a ridiculous comment. Many poor people die daily from not having access to health care. I have been lucky as I have always had good health care coverage because it was always offered everywhere I ever worked, but that is hardly the case for poor persons and minorities especially. There are even prejudices in medicine among medical colleges where blacks are said to not feel pain to the same extent as people of European origins or that they have thicker skin. These have actually been taught to medical students and continue in some universities.
There are programs both state and private to give the indigent free medicine and besides all the free clinics and community clinics and charity medical services anyone can walk into any hospital and they have to be stabilized, that's the law, if they need immediate surgery they will get it without one red cent but if their condition can be stabilized then they have to wait in some cases, it's any hospital that accepts Medicare/Medicaid by law has to treat any patient even those without Medicare/Medicaid MUST BE STABILIZED and don't make up any BS because I know, I am not wealthy and I don't have med ins. so don't tell me people are dying for lack of money, people die for lack of getting off their ass and taking care of themselves, granted having ins. makes things much more convenient but people do not have to die without med ins. that's complete bullshit.

There had been times in my life when I had to go to a charity clinic and yes you have to wait in a long line sometimes but just wait and see how the lines are if we get universal healthcare, in England people can wait 12 hours to be seen and months to get a surgery, you think there's enough money in our national budget to take on universal healthcare ? We would have to double everyone's income tax and add significantly to our national debt. on top of what we already spend and there will be rationing, the quality of care will suffer and no you won't be able to keep your current doctor, you won't have the choices you have today and you won't have the alternatives if you don't like what you are told you get/have to do.

I forgot who said it and the exact quote but it's something like : Social healthcare is the velvet glove that the beast of tyranny willingly slips it's eager hand into and takes control.
No I don't trust our elected lawmakers and I don't want to give them more control, Trump has cut drug prices I have seen that
myself and more can be done to control medical costs without going to single payer.


 
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Snecho

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While your 2 syllable 5 letter retort may seem creative in your own simple mind, allow me to challenge you to strive for..........ohh maybe a complete thought.......dare I dream a complete sentence.........and don't sell yourself short, you can do it, you can expand you thoughts beyond mere childish prattle.........if not then feel free to reply with " Oh Yea " or " your mama " and I will understand.
It's not my ambition to challenge the challenged beyond their ability. ;)
What the heck Red? :oops: Perhaps it is the heated nature of this thread, but what sort of anger caused you to write something so mean? I wrote that as a response after looking at the Politics thread for the first time, not to anyone in particular. You would think I murdered your family or something.

Look, you even gave Astro and Peter a free pass to piggyback off that, who apparently hate my guts for some apparent reason :cry:

But if I offended you for any reason I do apologize.
 
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RedCowboy

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Just wanted to motivate you although you did post short " instigating " replies in several threads that night when you posted this, I thought maybe you were looking to start some playful banter so I played........was I too rough, did I hurt your itty bitty fewlings ? You did post in over half a dozen threads in a row and I read it all so............you poked and I poked back, in good spirits but I do see you and I did read all you posted, you were seemingly instigating but I took it in a playful manner and meant my reply in the same way.
 

paul1598419

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Yes, if you are dying and can make it into a hospital you will be "stabilized" before you are forcibly released. That doesn't mean that the poor have access to medical coverage, though. And the standard of stabilization is quite low, so you are no longer in imminent danger of death. This does not mean you might not die very soon afterwards. Just because hospitals are required to stabilize everyone before releasing them or even transferring them to another facility does not mean they are treated for any disease process that is occurring within them. Just stable enough to make it out the door.

In the end this country will have to recognize health care as a basic human right just like it is in many western countries already. And eliminating the insurance companies will have a great influence over the costs of health care for all. It is coming whether you like it personally or not. Though I have never met a person who hated their Medicare and wished it were overseen by a for-profit company.
 
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Alaskan

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More about the China threat:

 
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RedCowboy

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Yes, if you are dying and can make it into a hospital you will be "stabilized" before you are forcibly released. That doesn't mean that the poor have access to medical coverage, though. And the standard of stabilization is quite low, so you are no longer in imminent danger of death. This does not mean you might not die very soon afterwards. Just because hospitals are required to stabilize everyone before releasing them or even transferring them to another facility does not mean they are treated for any disease process that is occurring within them. Just stable enough to make it out the door.

In the end this country will have to recognize health care as a basic human right just like it is in many western countries already. And eliminating the insurance companies will have a great influence over the costs of health care for all. It is coming whether you like it personally or not. Though I have never met a person who hated their Medicare and wished it were overseen by a for-profit company.
Grady hospital treats the uninsured poor all the time and people are not dying, they have a cancer treatment center for the uninsured who can't pay so it's much more than just stabilization.

Providing those who can't afford health ins. with healthcare is one thing...........but forcing everyone into a government run healthcare program at twice their tax rate is another, government is not my God, government is my employee.
 

Alaskan

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There is a reason Paul has health care on the top of his list, because it's fricken expensive and I believe he is for the most part, retired now. When I get there, I probably will have the same outlook, but still working and so far, no health care expenses to speak of.
 




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