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RedCowboy

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You are a liar.

VCDL has organized a LOBBY DAY where they talk to representatives and if antifa shows up it will be antifa who gets violent.

antifa has a history of violence

VCDL has never been violent


Here's pics from the VCDL LOBBY DAY in 2017, does it look violent ?

If antifa brings violence people will defend themselves and antifa is expected to show up dressed like VCDL supporters and instigate something, cameras will be recording and those responsible will be held accountable.



I'm not going to post a bunch of antifa pics, anyone can google antifa and see who's been violent.
 
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paul1598419

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There are many out of state gun fanatics who have been asking for people to show up in Richmond armed on the 20th of this month. Last year one group had chartered 3 buses to bring people in. This year they have 23 buses called for and likely more to come. The photo of UN trucks that were manufactured in Virginia and being shipped out to overseas that had been used by gun fanatics in 2016 with the caption, "they are coming for your guns" has resurfaced with the same photos. There was a 2 hour meeting with the governor and law enforcement recently to discuss all the possible ramifications of the 1/20/20 event in Richmond. Militias from Georgia to Nevada have become involved in getting armed members to Richmond on the 20th. No one is taking this lightly, it would seem.
 

RedCowboy

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I can understand how citizens would feel compelled to lash out at the excessively overreaching laws proposed in Virginia by the new dem majority legislature but the VCDL ( Virginia Citizens Defense League ) LOBBY DAY is not about anything but legal assembly and is not intended to be violent or intimidating, VCDL had already asked all supporters to leave their long guns at home so as not to make anyone uncomfortable but people are concerned about the real violent groups such as ANTIFA and milita groups have offered to provide security.

Here is what VCDL said : https://docs.google.com/document/d/1HNetTtLzfzcshbdTcQBv6eOxzN-qXOd21uPGuedFDGM/edit


Monday, January 20, is VCDL's Lobby Day. It is not VCDL's Protest Day.
There is a distinct difference between the two.

Lobby Day is about, well, lobbying - sending a message to the General Assembly and to the Governor, Attorney General, and the Lt. Governor. That message is simple: no more gun control that in any way, shape, or form negatively affects law-abiding gun owners. Bills that go after criminals or bills that are beneficial to gun owners are fine.

While there have been some verbal threats by the Democrat leadership to push major gun control down the throats of Virginia's gun owners and some very bad bills already filed to back up that threat, NOTHING has happened yet and won't until after January 8. And perhaps it won't happen at all, if we press hard enough.

The sanctuary movement, with its absolutely massive turnouts of gun owners, is sending a deafening message to lawmakers ahead of Lobby Day. On top of that, we now believe the size of the crowd on Lobby Day could be absolutely incredible, possibly historic, if gun owners from around the state follow through and attend as we believe they will. You will absolutely want to be a part of this!

Militias
Various militia groups from Virginia and nearby states have graciously volunteered to provide security. With a large Capitol, Richmond, and State police presence, not to mention enough citizens armed with handguns to take over a modern mid-sized country, we have the security base covered nicely. That said, we welcome our militia brothers and sisters to be part of making the day a success! Some militia groups are looking to take canned food donations during Lobby Day and deliver them to a Richmond Food Bank.

Long Guns

If you are asking how you can help with VCDL's mission, carrying long guns at Lobby Day is not helpful - it is a distraction. VCDL's important messages inevitably get lost as the press rushes to get pictures of anyone carrying an AR or AK. The stories then become about the rifle, not VCDL's agenda. You can set your watch by it. Long guns are not easy to carry in a crowd, either. VCDL needs its voice heard loud and clear in order to able to stop the onslaught of gun-control bills.

------------------------

VCDL Lobby Day is a peaceful event about gun rights and NOTHING ELSE

We are NOT there to have arguments with the other side. They lobby, we lobby, and never the two shall meet. Just ignore them.

And we are not there to push any other agenda. Our total focus is on protecting our right to keep and bear arms. Period. This is not about flags, statues, history, etc. Just guns.

If you somehow find yourself being harassed by the other side, don't engage them. They could well be baiting you and recording what you do for propaganda purposes. If necessary, go find a police officer and let them take care of the person causing the disturbance. Otherwise, just ignore them and go about your business.

VCDL has a great relationship with the Capitol Police, the Richmond Police, the Virginia State Police, and most other law enforcement agencies in the Commonwealth. We welcome their presence and are glad they are there to keep everything peaceful, while we work on the job at hand.

This should be a great event, with freedom-loving Americans from all walks of life standing should-to-should to protect our most precious civil right - the right of self-defense. See you there!
 
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paul1598419

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The Washington Post had an article about RTCs, or "Right To Carry" states. It was backed up with comprehensive studies done from 2009 through 2014 and showed that the trend in these states as more people carry firearms in public the assaults by firearms and murders by them increase. They were all weighted to not include drug cases as these tend to skew the results. I really wanted to post that article here, but haven't been able, likely because the Post is trying to increase their subscriptions.

From what I have been able to find on the Democratic agenda concerning firearms in Virginia is not going to affect anyone's guns that are already in anyone's possession. They do have a mandate from the voters there to repeal allowing sales of bump stocks and the AR/AK rifles that are used with them along with high capacity magazines and silencers. Virginia's lax gun laws have made it the place where people in other states get these guns and this is especially true of DC. Another measure they intend to take is limiting the number of guns you can buy in one month to just one. This is to address Virginia's role in being the supply chain for weapons in neighboring states. I don't live there so I don't have a dog in that fight, but these are the same measures I support in my state.

It sounds pretty shady to say that outside militias will be providing security there as it is none of anyone else's business what voters in Virginia voted for or want from their legislators. It sounds very much like a way to try to intimidate the legislators in Virginia. Lets hope it doesn't turn violent. You can never tell how anyone is going to act in situations such as these. I know in the past that groups have been successfully sued over their involvement at events like this. I would hope that people in other states would leave Virginia to Virginians.
 

RedCowboy

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Suicide is not gun violence but it's 2/3 of the gun deaths that liberals count.

States with stronger gun restrictions often have the most violent cities from what I read, but there is creative math out there and a lot of misinformation.

Bump stocks are already banned nationwide, it's moot, there banned and all that people owned were order destroyed.

AR's and civilian AK's are just like so many common rifles, they are NOT full auto, not select fire, they fire I shot per pull and have cosmetic features like military rifles, but they aren't.

People should not have to ask permission to exercise a constitutional right.

Red flag law are being written wrong. If a person is a danger to themselves or others then the person should be taken into custody and if decided after due process that they really are disturbed then take their property, these will be corrected because at current they are violating civil rights.

Virginias proposed bills will effect 80-90% of common use guns that people already own, the bills are very loosely worded, I have read them all.

Good people should not be restricted, a universal background check and firearms registration should prevent disturbed persons from obtaining firearms, nothing more would be needed, but government can't be trusted so that's not an option that people can accept and that's the real problem, everything else is a patch to fix a symptom of that problem and politicians exploit the symptoms of that problem to get in power, Bloomberg, Soros and the crooks they buy and sell are the real problem.

So how to balance handicapping bad people without crippling good people with self defense needs ? That seems to be where were at and one side says we have to accept bad things happen because the benefit outweighs the risk and the others say the risk outweighs the need, but it is also a constitutional right and I say amend the constitution or stop the infringements and address our nations mental health issues, school security issues, basically do the real common sense things 1st before blaming the bulk of the people for the insane acts of a few.
 
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Alaskan

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Alex, I should have added, Soleimani viewed both ISIS and the U.S. as the enemy, he cooperated with the U.S. until ISIS was pushed down, then back to business as usual with Death to America, especially with the added pressure from POTUS.
 

Hap

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I was not okay with Obama’s decision with the drones.

-Alex
 

paul1598419

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The studies I sited did not include suicides. They only looked at crimes committed with firearms in RTCs from 2009 through 2014. These were all assaults and murders. They listed the standard deviations and statistical weighting and showed an alarming trend of increases in these specific crimes where people carried more firearms in public. It seems only logical that this would happen where you allow most anyone to carry firearms in public. I know that many people have read more rights into the second amendment that have been articulated by the SC. I won''t be able to change made up minds on this issue. Just trying to add perspective to that side of this debate.
 

RedCowboy

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Everything I have read says the opposite but today you can find a study or an article that says left or right, up or down about every issue.
It's like they say there's less gun crime in Australia now that they don't have any guns, but people who live there say otherwise and the situation is actually quite bad, I know I posted the video before about how unsafe people are there today. You remember badboybilly's pics of the government officials rooting through his home to take away his hobby lasers and he's probably in jail now, that's where it goes......well we all know what happened in Germany during WWII after Hitler took the guns and no I don't think that could ever happen in America but I get surprised about things all the time, anyway here's some more perspective.

 

paul1598419

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The difference is REAL scientific studies done by people who are familiar with such statistical comparisons with PhD's in math. Anyone can assert anecdotal/"what I observed" information, but that really carries no weight as they never look at the total picture. Just parts that make their particular agendas. That is why scientists do these types of studies in the first place. To find the truth. The studies weren't done by anyone with an agenda. They only wanted to learn the truth behind the factual differences between two totally different interpretations of what is actually going on. To try to conflate this with Nazi Germany is, to put it mildly, anecdotal at best.
 

RedCowboy

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I have seen studies that lay it out either way but the liberal studies include suicide as gun crime which it's not.

Then when we say Chichago has strong gun control and high crime and then you say it's the neighbor states loose laws fault.

Look if we got rid of cars there would be less auto accidents but we need cars.

If we got rid of guns there would be less gun deaths but we need guns, you may disagree.

If we got rid of cops there would be less police shootings..........

but we need cops right, what if we need a cop but the closest one is busy and it's going to be 15 minutes ? That's forever when someone is breaking in.

How about it's not always somebody's else fault ?

How about we outlaw the crime and not the implement.

How about we stop using mental illness as an excuse for any horrible act and punish the act harshly enough that others won't dare do it ? Or do we gear everything down to the lowest common denominator based on the most insane individuals ?
 

RedCowboy

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Why do democrats politicians want open boarders.................because 70% of Hispanic immigrants vote democrat ( for their first decade as an American ) and 80% of African Americans vote democrat.
This is why they say Trump will be the last republican President until our new Americans become wealthy capitalist which is happening pretty fast..........hard working, God fearing..........Hispanic Americans " MAY" sway things democratic in the years ahead but long term I think not, I live in a mostly African American area but have worked with a lot of Hispanic Americans and I know many who want to keep what they earn and many are gun owners, they are also great people and loyal friends who believe it or not are against illegals just walking in, it's amazing how fast people assimilate.

 
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paul1598419

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You haven't seen any scientific studies that show no relation between RTCs and gun assaults and murders. They don't exist. You are likely talking about anecdotal evidence which is really just opinions. We have tried deterrence before many times and it leads to more mass incarcerations of minorities. $hit, I remember when they locked people up for life for possession of small amounts of marijuana. They have been locking up minors as young as 13 for life without the possibility of parole for murder. It's time to look at other options.

As far as Latinos becoming the major factor in republican elections they aren't pulled in with one issue like no gun control. If you think the majority of minorities will elect republicans on this issue you are naive. I wonder why you didn't include the 2016 election in your results? Actually, I know why. Just 8% of blacks voted for Trump. It won't be any higher in 2020. Latinos hate him even more.
 

RedCowboy

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I have seen many studies and some liberal propaganda.

You may not want to punish criminals or enforce drug laws but disarming America is not the answer to anything, it's not going to happen and it's coming to a head, good citizens are tired of getting blamed for the acts of deranged criminals and there are many of us and we are sticking together, it's already reached a point in some states where people simply don't obey the local unconstitutional laws and in Virginia I expect jury nullification to play a role because this is not just a hand full of gun nuts as you had claimed but a substantial number of patriotic citizens from all walks of life come together to defend our rights now under attack by radical dems who don't respect our constitution.

I care about every gun owning citizen in Virginia and across the nation, we are all in this together, black, white, Hispanic, Asian, man, woman, LGBTQ, young, old............every gun owner is my family member and I care and will do all I can to support them.

The election result I took from a page online to show how whites have voted overall, I did not construct it and I did not know about the 8% of African Americans voting for Trump, I expect it will be higher this time and I did not say that only 1 issue would sway an entire segment of voters but it will sway some especially as the attacks on our rights has become so radical and people like Beto have revealed one of the true intents of the liberal agenda, when presidential candidates threaten the use of force against good citizens who have not committed any crime that gets attention and it will sway some voters as well it should, it also hardens the resolve of us all.

p.s. I am against the ridiculous life sentences for drug offences and I think anyone found in violation of drug laws should be given help, not jail but that does not mean gang bangers shooting each other over territory is in any way the fault of good citizens exercising their constitutional rights, the mere concept that all citizens should be restricted on account of criminals is absurd.
 
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paul1598419

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There have been over 2 dozen candidates running for the nomination in the Democratic party. Taking the views of one of them and saying this reveals what all Democrats want is just political propaganda. It is quite Trumpian of you to say these things. Gun legislation is coming. You can bet on it. Even 64% of republicans are in favor of closing background check loopholes.

I find the giving life sentences for murder without the possibility of parole to 13 year old's to be very excessive. The reason is that human brains are in development all the way through the teen years and a 13 year old doesn't have the ability to understand differences in the seriousness of all their actions like an adult would. This has been made possible by prosecuting them as adults, though they clearly are not. To say that they should never be released under any circumstances because the SC won't allow them to be put to death shows a total lack of understanding of the child's brain. Other opinion may differ, but if you had any psychology in your background this would be more easily understood.

It is only because of state deficits in southern states that the war on drugs has taken this unusual turn away from incarceration. It literally costs too much to hold someone until they die for possession. If that weren't the case I expect the right would still be banging on about the war on drugs. It has ALWAYS been my view that drug possession and use should not be criminal offenses. The drug that causes the most damage to people is still legal.....alcohol. As long as one is free and over 21 they will always be able to buy alcohol. That is hypocrisy.
 




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