I have done it, I have the power!

qumefox · Aug 29, 2010

wannaburn said:
Ill be opening my 4th box after im done with the last few in my tray.

Ok i'll be quiet.

I just see people jump on their high horse all the time over an opinion with no real experience to back it up. Which is why I asked before thinking about taking a side.

Though since I haven't seen any posts or -rep on pontiacg5 saying the diodes are crap and don't buy from him.. I can only assume no harm came from his little 'experiment'.

On the subject of GB's.. I think the mitsu 635's are a bad comparison. For one, $40 isn't nearly as painful to 'eat' as $210. Second, that GB is for raw diodes. These are already mounted wired, heatsinked and are being powered at a rate casio says they'll last for 20k hours at. Someone playing with the 635's would involve them doing a lot more to the diodes that would likely kill them than Pontiacg5 just sitting the casio diode block to one side.

Would I have done this with something paid for by other peoples money? Probably not. Do I think he did it thinking there was a possibility of harming any of the diodes? Probably not. I also don't think there really was much danger either. The actual diodes were far enough away and behind enough optics that any back reflections to diode windows would be tenths of mw's, if that, and airflow over the optics side of the block is very minimal, so I see it unlikely much, if any particulate made its way in there, and any that did would be no different from normal dust.

Probably wasn't a smart thing to be doing with other people's money, but I think the chance of it actually causing any damage is <.001%

Pontiacg5 · Aug 29, 2010

Whatever man, you are still the only one who has a problem with this. In fact most of the posts in this thread were by people that were a part of this group buy, and I don't see any negative comments from them.

The plain and simple fact is these diodes were not exposed to anything other than what Casio deemed safe for them. Why would Casio implement a thermal protection circuit if damage was done to the diodes before they were shut off? That is the most retarded thing I've ever heard of, what in the world would be the point of that?

The smoke was pushed away from the diodes by three of those very same fans that you say "will push themselves across a table." So you are telling me that a particle of smoke will not only fight the force of three of those fans, but that very same particle will make its way through the sealed knife edge array and then through the diode's lens which also sits right on top of the can of the diode? Yes, I can see that happening

If you didn't notice the first videos were incredibly short. I then moved to a well ventilated area outside after I got requests for a part 2.

The only reason I did this was because I was worried about the integrity of the diodes after the first projector showed up like this.

Putting that knife edge array on the front of the diode assembly spread the outputs out far enough that I could run the projector and check to see that the diodes were all still working. I noticed that there was a strong focal point and decided to see what it could do and share the results here. I in no means built a super diode array for my pleasure, I was just testing the diodes to make sure they wouldn't pop after 10 seconds.

All of your points have been proven invalid, yet you continue to try to dirty my name. You came in this thread with a grudge against me trying to make me look bad ( I know that's the case from your PM's to me, you think I'm a "ZERO experience nOOb") You are still the only one who seems to think these diodes were abused, so either everyone else in this thread is a noob or you are.

qumefox · Aug 29, 2010

Lol. You got a projector with a bad DMD driver. Least that doesn't affect the light source any. That problem was common in older sony DLP tv's too, btw and i've had to replace more than a few light engines because of it.

DrSid · Aug 29, 2010

Hey .. you practically tested the diodes right ?

Anyway .. what is this knife edge array ?

JLSE · Aug 29, 2010

Pontiacg5 said:
>Why would Casio implement a thermal protection circuit if damage was done to the diodes before they were shut off? That is the most retarded thing I've ever heard of, what in the world would be the point of that?

*I did not say 'it would', my question was did you test before and after.
Still unanswered of course because you have not.

>The smoke was pushed away from the diodes by three of those very same fans that you say "will push themselves across a table." So you are telling me that a particle of smoke will not only fight the force of three of those fans, but that very same particle will make its way through the sealed knife edge array and then through the diode's lens

*The smoke generated is also sucked in by the fans and blown across the array in your vid.
The particles are small enough to make it to the LD facets, and POSSIBLY deposit on them.
Not get inside the diode and on the die..

>If you didn't notice the first videos were incredibly short.

*There are almost 10 mins of video in an indoor setup in a single video. Just because you didnt film it, does not mean you didnt spend a few hours doing this.

>The only reason I did this was because I was worried about the integrity of the diodes after the first projector showed up like this.

*You didnt have to run the array out of econo mode at full output to test that, and burning plastics, pop cans, and placing highly reflective surfaces like a clear CD case flush in front of the array were not required to test these diodes. Most LD's are very sensitive to back reflection, placing the CD cover flat in front of the beam sends light BACK into the array and the LD's, hence the term back reflection. There have even been people on LPF that have had back reflection fry their LDs in a split second by hitting a semi reflective surface as you have done here. Raising the optical flux within the cavity when these diodes are running full out, im sure did its damage but again DEGRADATION is not something you took into account and tested for before and after..

>Putting that knife edge array on the front of the diode assembly spread the outputs out far enough that I could run the projector and check to see that the diodes were all still working.

* If they were already working, why would you have to test them AGAIN to see "if they were STILL working"? BTW, degradation is not noticeable unless you have tested before and after you ran them. Im assuming you have no data either way.

>All of your points have been proven invalid

*Invalid? because you said so?? :crackup: You claim the temp of the array
was cooler in the open air than running in its intended setup.. Id like to see
the temps you recorded here, and have 'proven'. Look at the datasheet
from Nichia which are suspected to be the sheets for these diodes...
http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&sourc...85HCBw&usg=AFQjCNEmDb4wKiPzI42-52y_L5l4I4dHDw

Absolute maximum ratings for temp 30c after which can begin
to degrade the diode. Are you sure you didnt hit 30? what was the temp? Your
throwing a lot of answers but no facts. Look at page 2, #3: absolute maximum ratings

"In order to prevent >excessive< damage, the LD must be operated below absolute maximum rating".
You have no clue and didnt seem to be paying attention to it in the vid, by even touching it.
Im guessing you felt comfortable with all the practice you got prior to shooting the video...

>You came in this thread with a grudge against me trying to make me look bad

*This is about the participants of your GB's, not about me nor your imaginary "grudge".
IMO you have done this by yourself, and again, with other peoples money.

>I know that's the case from your PM's to me, you think I'm a "ZERO experience nOOb") You are still the only one who seems to think these diodes were abused, so either everyone else in this thread is a noob or you are.

*LOL, no, I said you "noob'd" their LD's, and from the way you take criticism and
handle other peoples property, yes, IMO, it would appear you have "zero experience".

Another member pointed out the same issues, you -neg repped him, and threw some insults
I also point out some of the same things, and again, you take it personal, and get all butthurt, sending a -neg rep my way.

You have -neg repped a guy in another thread for asking if a laser was metered???
You seem to have trouble controlling your anger, and just answering simple questions.

Pontiacg5 · Aug 30, 2010

So now you are calling me a liar, good to know where this is all going.

I shall leave you with this

Because that is all you are doing, trolling and speculating.

JLSE · Aug 30, 2010

LOL, really good answer there. An easy way out from being held responsible
for your actions.

Speculating is what you have done by ASSUMING you have done nothing
and the inability to back it up with fact, or at least some data behind
your video and actions.

That sir is not trolling, your response is simply a Cop out.

Cop out - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

BTW, just out of curiosity, what type of warranty do you offer?

Pontiacg5 · Aug 30, 2010

Cop out of what? Everyone is happy with their diodes so far?

My previous statement stands.

I've just been told that Kiyoukan did the same thing on a live stream while he was dissecting his group buy projectors.

Lol, once again, you go sticking your nose where you know nothing.

More info, thanks to laserchat.

I suggest you quit inhaling toxic Kevlar smoke, its damaging your brain.

Prototype · Aug 30, 2010

wannaburn said:
You have -neg repped a guy in another thread for asking if a laser was metered???
You seem to have trouble controlling your anger, and just answering simple questions.

Just like to point out that the thread mentioned there had 'I don't own an lpm' in the OP, the other guy didn't read it apparently, because it was there, yet he asked anyways.

kiyoukan · Aug 30, 2010

Yes i did do a live stream of my projector. and then showed what happened when you keep them in the knife edge assembly and burn things.
Now i spent maybe all of 3 min burning things before i stopped.
They were all running from the projector.
You know you have to test them to make sure all 24 work.
I could see thing being a problem if someone did this for a long time or used it as a screen for a day before shipping but you should at least visually inspect each laser while its running to make sure that everything and every laser is working the same if you can see one is dimmer mark it and then make a note of it and try not to sell it.
i had one like that but after i had it in my box handheld it got alot brighter.
I think the run time is minimal when these tests are done. but it would suck to never power on and check and send out to find one of the lasers came doa.
So everyone step back and think about all the fun we are having and things are still nothing going bad, no one has had an issue and if you dont like the way someone treats there things there are other options but i am sure we have all been guilty burning with 24W of laser power.

JLSE · Aug 30, 2010

kiyoukan said:
Yes i did do a live stream of my projector. and then showed what happened when you keep them in the knife edge assembly and burn things.
Now i spent maybe all of 3 min burning things before i stopped.
They were all running from the projector.
You know you have to test them to make sure all 24 work.
I could see thing being a problem if someone did this for a long time or used it as a screen for a day before shipping but you should at least visually inspect each laser while its running to make sure that everything and every laser is working the same if you can see one is dimmer mark it and then make a note of it and try not to sell it.
i had one like that but after i had it in my box handheld it got alot brighter.
I think the run time is minimal when these tests are done. but it would suck to never power on and check and send out to find one of the lasers came doa.
So everyone step back and think about all the fun we are having and things are still nothing going bad, no one has had an issue and if you dont like the way someone treats there things there are other options but i am sure we have all been guilty burning with 24W of laser power.

As a long time seller who offers 1 year warranty with my products,
I whole heartedly agree. We have to test things to be sure all is good.
But there is a line where we go from testing to personal use.

To put it more simply, personal use on the other guys dime.

In a single video his personal use nets almost 10mins of "test" time,
performing tasks that are known to cause issues in LD's as stated
in many data sheets from nichia.. This includes back reflection and
heat, vs output.

I have not yet plugged any of my projectors and run the array outside.
I remove all 24 LD's and test them individually within acceptable
parameters which do not even boarder any of the known 'no-no's'

On top of this these are diodes that I paid for in full. I recently sold
one of my personal lasers, and in that ad STATED that it was used
even though there is only 20-30mins of runtime on it.

I stated used as it was operated for personal use. Even though
it was treated like a gem, never dropped and saw no back reflection.
I gave it a polish and new lens prior to sending to the buyer, it is
still used.

Pontiac is selling his LD's in a GB as NEW, exposing all 24 LD's at the
same time to conditions that are known to cause degradation to the
gain medium. But in his mind, these well known facts simply do not
apply to him nor his testing procedures.

Weather or not damage occurred, there is no way of telling. But the
principle to the matter is that he did this with other peoples property
without first confirming that all participants were okay with it.

This doesn't mean that the LD's will die immediately, nor does it mean
that any noticeable difference will be readily apparent. What it does
mean, is that any potential they may have had, maybe lost with no data
either way, confirming or disproving any of this.

It means that he took advantage of the situation, and rather than do
this at his own expense, he took other peoples money and without their
knowledge, made himself a cool lazor video. Of course people are hyped
to see more 24W videos, im all for it, but the question still remains...

Like I said in previous post, this was not my money and could care less.
But he is selling on a forum that people trustingly hand their money over
to receive a new item, not something that was dicked around with.

I will add a demo video to this thread of what happens when you place
even semi reflective surfaces in from of a powered up LD running at its
near absolute.

For the sake of further argument from mr pontiac, I will use a CD case clear
portion and sacrifice one of my own LDs to prove my point, and no this damaged
LD will never be called 'new' again.

Using others peoples property as your own in excess of what is necessary
to "test", is a blatant disregard and disrespectful to the buyers who participated.

If the buyers dont realize it, then it is only a matter of time til somebody does
and points it out.

Pontiacg5 · Aug 30, 2010

Do whatever you want. The fact still remains that I posted it publicly here and most of the buyers of those diodes commented their approval here.

You still didn't comment on the fact that Kiyoukan did the same thing to his diodes, yet you suggested others buy from him instead. That really makes a lot of sense.

So, Mr. Bluemeanie, I'm still looking foward to you answering questions posted here instead of posting insane specualtions.

dnar · Aug 30, 2010

This is an interesting thread in dire need of pruning...

kiyoukan · Aug 30, 2010

I would not say we did the "same" thing.
We did similar things yes, but not the same.
My tests are very short and was done once after that each projector was tested and then took apart. i never did any burning over 5 min.
i would turn on and burn then turn right off. but i got bored of it very fast i burned a total of 3 things with a good amount of wait time in between them.
Also if i recall correctly i did not use any fog, just the lasers.
I did it with one projector the second was turned on and made a nice beam out my window then took it apart. i think this is a different argument.
its like going to a car dealership and buying a new car to only found out the owner drove the car for a few days before you bought it but still sold it as new.
(Those miles came from driving it to the dealership...To bring the deal closer to you!)

JLSE · Aug 30, 2010

Pontiacg5 said:
You still didn't comment on the fact that Kiyoukan did the same thing to his diodes, yet you suggested others buy from him instead. That really makes a lot of sense.

Your still copping out.. You posted the youtube video in thread...

Only to continue to argue to death that in absolute, "no damage was done"
I will not waste my time with you any further, I did not post in this thread to
entertain your paranoia, but rather open potential buyers eyes to what you
do with other peoples property, and outright defend that behavior with a bunch
of talk and no facts.

I will be sure to post my video right here in this thread, maybe then my point
of argument will sink in.

You know to pull fast ones on people doesnt always involve
not shipping an item and taking money. There are many ways
to be irresponsible...

Food for thought.

Prototype · Aug 30, 2010

Gentlemen, to your corners!

I have done it, I have the power!

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