Flaminpyro ''Jeff'' M.I.A. ???

ElektroFreak said:

To me, the worst part is that Jeff has contributed a good bit of useful information and tools to our community. TJ has been a member here for a long time, and while not the most technically minded individual he's contributed here and there in other ways.. he's got a nose for detecting questionable individuals that I've yet to see beat.

The forum would be a lesser place without either one of them. In fact, it pains me whenever people that I perceive to be inherently good at heart just can't get along. I know it's been said before, but you guys really should just put each other on your ignore lists at least until emotions cool down. Right now it's a tit for tat game.

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Thank You for this Post.:beer:

It is Exactly what I was Trying to say and then some.

Iam not good with Words but you nailed it.

These are Great members. They all have there place.


I think and feel that when other member get involved it just re flames the fire. It might not be intentional or it might be. But i think no one should get involved in the future as it creates More problems.

I think When Others start to put there opinion on it, it just makes people take sides and even influence others that would not have gotten involved to get involved and pick sides.

I think Welcome back threads only cause more problems. I think PMing the member if you care so much to open a thread is better.

I can tell you what though TJ is a Very Nice Person. He is Very Caring and does alot for this Forum. He tells it how it is and does not lie. I promise you this.

Jeff is also Great He has done alot for this forum as well. He is also Good at heart.

In My eyes these 2 are Great Memebers and both could work it out and maybe even be like the use to be to each other.:wave:

I know they can do it.

I wish for them to get along.:can:


IE, TJ & FP are all Members that I respect very much and hate to see this as i know deep inside they are good at heart and would like to OK with each other again. I knows this for sure. I see it in them.

rhd said:

some new member with 12 rep

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:yabbem:

^^ lol dont take it to heart Mr Graphics Interchange Format.

Im sure he didnt mean you :beer:

I really dont get why we keep banning one or the other or both every time some of us fight like little children, Leave the posts up. Let them go at it, trust me, given a few weeks the kids get tired, they make up, and its all good. Every time you pull them apart mid fight they just find the next opportunity to start it up again. Never f**king worked in grade school, the hell makes the admins think it'll work now...

I'm under the full impression at this point that the admins in this matter are just as responsible for the situation. Especially when everything is deleted so no one can judge for themselves whats going on. To us, it looks like 2 people banned for no reason with no explanation. If the bans aren't equal, it looks like someone has favor. If the admins don't agree with leaving the evidence behind to justify their actions, then how the hell do we hold them accountable for BAD choices...or know when they were made.

I for one do not want to donate or exist in a community where the admins run around with impunity, appearing to choose sides, and neglecting the community in the favor or stopping a simple squabble between two well respected members of the community.

God forbid we exist in a community where no one can even speak their mind with out being beaten by the ban hammer. Peace.

Well said....

Actually...I agree :beer:

Let them fight it out....dont delete posts..let everyone see whats said, then people can read, and make thier own minds up.

Granted if their trolling someones thread it should be stopped.

IE's problem is illustrated starting here (with additional link included)

http://laserpointerforums.com/f61/rant-71964-7.html#post1058991

In IE's accusations about me, he actually did a pretty good explanation of how the moderators in this forum work
He just got wrong the idea that I only do it for TJ
Ask around,
That format for handling conflict is how I go about it with most everyone

We delete the fights because not only do they clutter up and sidetrack threads,
but as other members read the fights, they feel compelled to jump in with their
2 cents and the drama continues and grows.

You can see that process right here in this thread

This can even happen long after the fight is cooled down, which just serves to start it up again

We lock threads to simply force the participants to either cool it or take it to another thread
(which shows a refusal to allow it to cool down)

If you have not been around long enough to remember the "ban poll wars"
then you do not understand how far out of hand these fights can get

It gets to the point where members start campaigning via PM's to win more members
over to their side of the argument, to try to get another member kicked out of the forum
Needless to say, these campaigns NEVER present all the info nor present that info in an unbiased manner
Those campaigns are most often filled with one-sided and patently wrong information
These "ban poll wars" are the reason you have moderators here at all

The fights and sniping associated with members taking sides in a "ban poll war" stop the fluid interchange of ideas, science, and commerce
It doesn't "free up" communication.
It stifles it

Another reason we delete and lock is that most members do NOT have all the information that we have
It would be beyond wasteful for the mods to have to inform anyone who was interested about everything that they knew
or have to explain our actions to members who disagree with us

At some point, you have to decide to trust your mods or not
We were not chosen haphazardly
Nor do we work alone
We communicate regularly about problems in the forum
We do not work capriciously, unilaterally, or arbitrarily

We are more often guilty of letting veteran members "speak their minds" too long
We WANT all of the members (but especially the veterans) to work out their
differences so that we do NOT have to step in to stop something

This is cold, but there are other laser focused forums on the net.
Try taking your "let them fight it out" suggestions to one of them
LPF is the most lenient and free exchange of ideas, related to lasers, available today

If this format is too restrictive to you, please feel free to start your own forum
Others have
If you do, please invite me to join as a regular member
I love watching people figure out how much work successfully running one of these actually is

Is it perfect? No
Does it work? Yes
The forum continues to be strong and is still growing

Peace,
dave

All this trolling has to stop! We have to create some sort of solution to let people fight there differences elsewhere in a group chat or something. Like dave stated mods have to draw a line somewhere but if you lock threads where trolling begins they will go on in another thread.. So locking and banning won't provide the solution between members (Absolutely no problem with this protocol!) but it's not a definite solution..

If no solution will be provided vets WILL leave the forum! This can get ugly you guys

And men i don't want to see that happen :undecided:

Just how i think about it and i didn't intend to offend anyone with this post lol just to make it clear :shhh:

greetings,,

while i consider IE a friend he has been taking the forum WAY WAY too seriously constantly trolling dave and TJ about trolling....:wtf:

he has been here a year not much longer than me and he is trying to troll a MOD that has been here IIRC for 5 years.... and in a little over a year is a top poster...

IE im not trolling you i like you thats why your on my friend list BUT you needed a time out you were TAKING this WAY overboard and i hope when you come back you relax a little :beer:

edit 4 years for dave not 5..

I've been here a while and I have seen and been part of the
"Poll wars" fiascos back then...

I too was a victim of the back room vigilante syndrome and the
trolling towards me (that I stupidly bit) that got me banned in
the past.

Nowadays...with the Mods on the Forum I don't get pulled into
any of those Trolls because it is easy to Report the Trolling Post
(yes... there's a button for that) or any disruptive Post for that
matter which goes back to a Mod.

If that fails... any member can contact the Admin directly...

I wasn't too much in favor of having the Mods since we were a
self governing Forum back then but I've seen the many Fights
and disruptions decline drastically since the Mods were installed.

I find the Forum is much more laid back than it was before the
Mods...

There will always be a new guy that thinks he's immune because
of one reason or another and will test the limits until he gets
banned...

Some members come back and figure it out immediately and others
need to be banned multiple times before it clicks in..

BTW... the Forum belongs to Avery.... If he decides to Ban 50%
of the Forum tomorrow because it's Thursday and Thursdays pi$$
him off there is nothing any member of this Forum can do legally
or otherwise to stop him.....

I think we are all lucky he does like Thursdays...


Jerry

all of this said, and my years here watching in the backround, i know only that it is better to lock a thread and let people see it for themselves, then to erase every trace of it from having existed. with out this old information, people will never be able to get all of the information for themselves.

I guess I would have to ask you what you base that belief on?

Have you done some sort of systematic comparison of issue resolution in fights left exposed compared to deleted fights?

Part of my point was that even with the thread exposed, members will NOT have all the information that we have

In addition, the fight is left for people to still take sides on or to act on in other places

Members should NOT have ALL the information for themselves
I guarantee, you that you have no idea how many PM's and emails are exchanged relative to what you see in the threads
That's why we have mod's.
It is not left to the realm of public debate

Peace,
dave

**EDIT** -- For example, on the 13th, I was dealing with three separate personality clash issues.
On that day I received 41 PM's and 8 emails
(just from members of this forum -- ALL thinking that their particular issue was central to the health of the forum)
Where do you think I should post that information?

*Facepalm*

If you check my rep now I have Yobresal trolling with me.

This sh*t has got to stop. Once again I'm trying to pull out of it, and others are trying to pull me back in, and continue the whole drama show.

I really could care less about the points. Its just yet another example of people that wont let it go. I'm not going to take the bait, but I just want to show you why this drama doesn't end. Even after all that has been said about moving forward, and multiple bannings, people still want to keep the gears going.

Is there anyone else who wants to troll the troll? Get it out now please so we can all move forward.

Tech_Junkie said:

*Facepalm*

If you check my rep now I have Yobresal trolling with me.

This sh*t has got to stop. Once again I'm trying to pull out of it, and others are trying to pull me back in, and continue the whole drama show.

I really could care less about the points. Its just yet another example of people that wont let it go. I'm not going to take the bait, but I just want to show you why this drama doesn't end. Even after all that has been said about moving forward, and multiple bannings, people still want to keep the gears going.

Is there anyone else who wants to troll the troll? Get it out now please so we can all move forward.

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can i schedule a troling sesh? do you have a specific forum in mind? i can do vet section, general, other etc im pretty flexible

pm me so we can find a time to have an epic troll/flame argument. :crackup: :crackup:

:beer:

EDIT of course you dont care about points you have one of the highest reps on the forum

Repz dont make the man, the man makes the man. :beer:

so anyone de-repping you cause they dont like your personality at this point now is a troll?
is that why Flamin was banned again?