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Old 08-11-2010, 01:47 AM #17
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Default Re: Please post info on WL "+ 18650 1300mAh -" cells

I also have some of the Soshine 2800ma 18650's and I simply love them, they are not your cheap Chinese 18650's, as you know they cost ~ $26 for a pack of 2 and are worth the extra cost. They put out high amperage and last a long time powering-up Lasers and LED flashlights alike.

I use the Soshine in my 4Sevens Maelstrom G5 which won't take flat tops at all and yet really requires a high Amperage battery because of it putting out a true 350lm OTF.

If you take a look on CPF you'll see they have tested out very well. With that being said though they are really a little too long to be used properly I believe in the Arctic. If you carefully screw the Arctic's battery cap on not fully it will work fine, but I won't make a habit of screwing it down tight, as who knows what might happen to the spring if nothing else, over time.

So since the stock battery is really junk, I'm using one of my AW 2600 Flat Top 18650 in it which are fully protected, and you can fully screw down the battery cap with no issues or worries. These are highly rated batteries too that you can find a ton of test data on them. You'll find many members using them with high powered Lasers on here.

These batteries also are not cheap up to now ~ $20 Each, very recently I have seen them start to finally drop some in price $15 Each, still not cheap and certainly not expensive considering how long they last.

They again won't work in everything because of the flat top, I have 2 DIY hosts that also won't work with flat top 18650's; so you really must know your device before deciding which is best for your particular use.

I would also gladly use the Soshine or AW's in my RPL's, but a protected battery is not recommend for that Laser because it has it's own protective circuit in it. So for that Laser I use the LG 2800 which has the flat top and is not protected and can also be "pricey".

I think it's best to keep a variety of the quality ones I mentioned above on hand if you can, then you can avoid problems with the battery not fitting, or is there a problem with the Laser or really just a simple battery issue.

Grab yourself an AW for the Arctic and you'll get years of use out of it, if treated properly. Getting an extra charger too also is beneficial, get those from DX though and not from WL.


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Old 08-11-2010, 08:10 PM #18
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Default Re: Please post info on WL "+ 18650 1300mAh -" cells

It's been a while since I last posted something, but I just received my Arctic (couldn't resist getting one although at one point I lost all hope to eventually receive anything)...

The battery is a green 1300mAh one, and I was curious about it as well so that's how I ended up here I took a few low-quality pics with my phone, as I'm too lazy to take out the big guns:







And here is a comparison shot with both an old (2200mAh) and a new (2600mAh) AW cells:



Both are protected, and significantly longer than the green one. It is not obvious in the picture, but the 2600 one is actually the longest, even without a button. I didn't try any of those in the Arctic yet, since it seems somewhat low-quality overall and I didn't want to risk damaging the switch because of the size difference.

I won't go into any more details since I don't want to see this thread deleted, keeping on-topic about the batteries only.

Hope this helps in identification -- I also think it may be an IMR, especially since the manual states so when it mentions the battery ("insert one li-ion type 18650 IMR rechargeable battery")...

Best regards!
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Old 08-11-2010, 09:42 PM #19
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Default Re: Please post info on WL "+ 18650 1300mAh -" cells

The color of samsung, the vent cap of a Sanyo, vent spacer color of a sony, and what looks like a metal plate on top of the positive cap. I have no friggin clue, but the pictures make me want to know even more!

MGC8, thanks very much for the pictures!

Last edited by BShanahan14rulz; 06-28-2011 at 03:43 PM.
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Old 08-12-2010, 06:11 AM #20
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Default Re: Please post info on WL "+ 18650 1300mAh -" cells

mgc8;

There is no reason to use a 1300mah #18650 battery in the Arctic.

The low-capacity #18650 batteries are designed for much heavier amp draws than the Arctic would need.

Judging from your picture, it appears to be a chinese clone.

IMO, Arctic users should use a quality "name-brand" U.L. tested cell,
to get longer operating times; with better safety.

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Old 08-12-2010, 03:17 PM #21
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Default Re: Please post info on WL "+ 18650 1300mAh -" cells

Yeah, many name-brand cells are perfectly happy with 4A loads. Some of us have other devices that may benefit us to have >4A discharge ability. Me, I'm just trying to rescue cells before people throw them away.
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Old 08-18-2010, 02:02 PM #22
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Default Re: Please post info on WL "+ 18650 1300mAh -" cells

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Originally Posted by LarryDFW View Post
mgc8;
There is no reason to use a 1300mah #18650 battery in the Arctic.
Yes, I know that, I never thought the laser would actually need an IMR to begin with. I'm not using the AW cells atm. because of their size (I think this one is not protected and therefore significantly shorter). I managerd to destroy batteries in the past with "incompatible" flashlights and from giving it a try it seems the AW would sit pretty tight in there .

I don't agree with the "chinese clone" idea though, maybe "cheap chinese clone" or just "a poor imitation" would be more exact... There are a lot of good products being made in China and not all are cheap copies. The AW batteries for one, and a lot of flashlights of very good quality are made there (actually I think China controls 90% or so of the lithium battery production world-wide) -- of course there are many cheap knock-offs as well, but I wouldn't generalize.
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Old 08-22-2010, 05:57 AM #23
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Default Re: Please post info on WL "+ 18650 1300mAh -" cells

Quote:
Originally Posted by mgc8 View Post
I don't agree with the "chinese clone" idea though, maybe "cheap chinese clone" or just "a poor imitation" would be more exact... There are a lot of good products being made in China and not all are cheap copies. The AW batteries for one, and a lot of flashlights of very good quality are made there (actually I think China controls 90% or so of the lithium battery production world-wide) -- of course there are many cheap knock-offs as well, but I wouldn't generalize.
I have used hundreds of "lithium-ion" batteries in UV lights I have built.

The "chinese" batteries had failure rates ~ 10 times higher than the Japanese cells I tested them against.

Sanyo, Panasonic and Sony are the largest manufacturers of the #18650 batteries.

LG and Samsung are also big producers. None of these are chinese mfgs.

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Last edited by LarryDFW; 08-22-2010 at 06:00 AM.
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Old 08-22-2010, 12:56 PM #24
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Default Re: Please post info on WL "+ 18650 1300mAh -" cells

I do not believe it is an IMR at all, also you say it is a protected battery? I don't believe it is protected at all, it measures 65mm.....what makes you think it's protected??

Lastly you do realize that the chemistry of an IMR battery does not need any type protection circuit.

This battery doesn't last any where near that of a True AW IMR battery which I have compared it to; those are Red in color and are not the same as the Black AW you posted.

Edit: added weight info.

WL Green 1300mAh - 42.0g AW Red IMR 18650 1600mAh - 44.3g (calibration of the scales checked against certified calibration weights).

Quote:
Originally Posted by mgc8 View Post
It's been a while since I last posted something, but I just received my Arctic (couldn't resist getting one although at one point I lost all hope to eventually receive anything)...

The battery is a green 1300mAh one, and I was curious about it as well so that's how I ended up here I took a few low-quality pics with my phone, as I'm too lazy to take out the big guns:







And here is a comparison shot with both an old (2200mAh) and a new (2600mAh) AW cells:



Both are protected, and significantly longer than the green one. It is not obvious in the picture, but the 2600 one is actually the longest, even without a button. I didn't try any of those in the Arctic yet, since it seems somewhat low-quality overall and I didn't want to risk damaging the switch because of the size difference.

I won't go into any more details since I don't want to see this thread deleted, keeping on-topic about the batteries only.

Hope this helps in identification -- I also think it may be an IMR, especially since the manual states so when it mentions the battery ("insert one li-ion type 18650 IMR rechargeable battery")...

Best regards!
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Last edited by electron; 08-22-2010 at 01:22 PM.
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Old 08-23-2010, 05:59 PM #25
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Default Re: Please post info on WL "+ 18650 1300mAh -" cells

Quote:
Originally Posted by electron View Post
I do not believe it is an IMR at all, also you say it is a protected battery? I don't believe it is protected at all, it measures 65mm.....what makes you think it's protected??

Lastly you do realize that the chemistry of an IMR battery does not need any type protection circuit.

This battery doesn't last any where near that of a True AW IMR battery which I have compared it to; those are Red in color and are not the same as the Black AW you posted.

Edit: added weight info.

WL Green 1300mAh - 42.0g AW Red IMR 18650 1600mAh - 44.3g (calibration of the scales checked against certified calibration weights).

Thanks for the weight info! While the + contact looks very much like a Sanyo part, the sleeve, the extra round piece on top, and the color of the spacer all point to a not-so-big brand. Interestingly enough, the weight of the Sanyo UR18650SA is only 1/10th of a gram off. Interesting, but of no real meaning.
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Old 08-23-2010, 06:34 PM #26
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Default Re: Please post info on WL "+ 18650 1300mAh -" cells

Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryDFW View Post
I have used hundreds of "lithium-ion" batteries in UV lights I have built.

The "chinese" batteries had failure rates ~ 10 times higher than the Japanese cells I tested them against.

Sanyo, Panasonic and Sony are the largest manufacturers of the #18650 batteries.

LG and Samsung are also big producers. None of these are chinese mfgs.

LarryDFW
Larry, have you tried any of the Samsung 3000mAh batteries out?
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DX-200 660nm & 532nm, Leadlights & numerous 5mw-100mW 532mn
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Old 08-26-2010, 12:23 AM #27
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Default Re: Please post info on WL "+ 18650 1300mAh -" cells

Quote:
Originally Posted by electron View Post
Larry, have you tried any of the Samsung 3000mAh batteries out?
Electron;

The largest "verified capacity" I have tried is a 2800mah Sanyo.

Panasonic/Sanyo does have a 3000mah battery,
but they are more expensive.

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Old 08-26-2010, 04:09 PM #28
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Default Re: Please post info on WL "+ 18650 1300mAh -" cells

One thing I've heard about the >2900mAh cells is that their capacity is rated after a full 4.35V charge, and you would need a better charger for them; one on which you can select the voltage cutoff.

Panasonic makes a regular 2900mAh cell, though.
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Old 08-26-2010, 07:02 PM #29
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Default Re: Please post info on WL "+ 18650 1300mAh -" cells

Yes I got the specs from Samsung and they guaranteed a minimum of 2900mAh with their 3000mAh 18650's but yes it needs 4.35v to properly charge them.

There is a site/dealer in Germany I think it was that has confirmed there are true 3000mAh, but also said they need the higher charge rate to achieve this; thus the "standard" 4.20 charger won't get the job done.
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Old 08-31-2010, 01:15 AM #30
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Default Re: Please post info on WL "+ 18650 1300mAh -" cells

Thought I'd reply here. Electron's 1300mAh 18650 that came with his Arctic had a catastrophic failure during charging in a Li-Ion charger that he had been using for 2 years now without incident. See here:
BEWARE of ARCTIC BATTERY EXPLOSION

This pretty much tells me that these aren't LiMn cells. If they were, I do not think they would have failed so violently. If a normal cell had exploded in the WL charger, it would not have been this conclusive. I sincerely hope that this story gets more publicity. WL doesn't use name-brand cells, or even china "name-brand" cells (i.e. ____fire). We gave them the benefit of the doubt, hypothesizing that they may be lower capacity because they are higher performance. It turns out, they look like crap just like the rest of the laser.

I am still interested in testing a few of these, because I want to know where these came from, but this is a major event. We can only hope that Electron's loss will be a warning for as many Arctic users as possible.

Last edited by BShanahan14rulz; 08-31-2010 at 02:20 AM.
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