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Old 07-31-2016, 06:31 PM #1
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Default Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

Hi, i got some questions. At the end of this year, i want to build an unique 1W 445nm pocket laser (very, very similar to the 405nm build of mine in terms of size and functionality). And sell it on the forum

So the hosts is 90mmx15mm. (Exc the focussing knob and lens) I can fit everything (with an flexdrive) easily in there, no probs. it will take me some hours at school behind a lathe to get everything to fit and watertight, but thats absolutely no problem.

But, since the host is small, but build like a tank. I need to use one 10280 battery or 2 10180 battery's. Can i power an 1W 445nm diode and a flexdrive on an icr10280 or two 10180 battery's in series? Not in parallel.

Can i reduce the voltage while maintaining the amps with a normal diode when the 10180 battery's are installed in series?

Btw, i'm looking forward making an unique small pocket size tank build 445nm laser and sell it on the forum (not overpowered, its going to be underpowered or up to spec, goal is to build this laser in a way, its easily serviceable and going to last at least a year of 2). And i would like to know, if there are people out here who love pocket size lasers with all the features mentioned below.

Anyway, just a recap. Is there a possible way to reach 1W of 445nm output power with the mentioned battery's? If not, 500mW? And does under powering a 445nm laser diode, make it last significantly longer? If so, that would be awesome. Is there a way to connect 2 battery's in series, and reduce the output voltage while maintaining the current capability's?

Features of this laser:
-Build like a artillery
-watertight and fully protected against drops
-watertight (3 element) lens assembly, reason: see below.
-Tail Cap switch (watertight)
-Power OFF when dropped <--- i already know how to make this circuit in such way, it would fit into the module. Its a new feature i will implement for the first time .
-Hidden turn on safety feature and integrated battery protection circuit, just like my previous build.
-reverse polarity protection
-aligned springs, connections and other metal components to enchase reliability and ensure solid connections are made
-watertight aixiz module for "the worse case scenario"
-sealed with o-rings.
-underpowered or up to spec to ensure max lifespan
-unique build
-no rattling components and Internal support brackets to prevent the module for being pressed in, therefore making it a paperweight as you can't fit the battery's in it anymore.

Edit: forgot this one. The 3 element lens is a pain to make watertight. But if it is watertight, nothing will ever get trough. I already made on watertight. The lens would be perfectly cleaned after the sealing job has been done.

Anyways, i like to share my future build idea, but i had some questions with it too, any help is highly appreciated.

Btw, the power OFF when dropped and hidden turn on trigger is to prevent eye damage. Dropping a high power laser while on isn't going to be nice as the beam could go everywhere including the human eye. And we don't want unexperienced people to turn the unit on as well. To turn the unit on, you have to press on the tailcap (its NOT a momentary switch, its either On or OFF), and short the aixiz focusing knob with the host with any kind of metal.

Host see attached picture.
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Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.-image.jpg  


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Old 07-31-2016, 08:47 PM #2
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

I would think you more more battery than a 10280 --those seem to have very little capacity approx 200mAh--why not a 10440?
What duty cycle do you expect.

Have you looked at the Sanwu 99mmX13mm Pocket laser offered in a variety of wavelengths? See: https://www.sanwulasers.com/product/pocket Uses 10440 and offers 500mW 445nm with duty cycle of 50 sec on/25 seconds off--very solid

The Sanwu Guardian is 1W 445nm -- also small form factor --20mmX 130mm https://www.sanwulasers.com/product/guardian

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Old 07-31-2016, 09:30 PM #3
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

Also, what is your price point? That is important if you want to know if it will sell. I think it could be done in a slightly larger build that would have a longer duty cycle and would also have a longer use between charges.
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532nm 200mW Thermostatically Controlled Fan Cooled (Besram) >230mW
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Old 07-31-2016, 09:57 PM #4
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Encap View Post
I would think you more than a 10280 --those seem to have very little capacity--why not a 10440?
What duty cycle do you expect.

Have you looked at the Sawu 99mmX13mm Pocket laser offered in a variety of wavelengths? See: https://www.sanwulasers.com/product/pocket Uses 10440 and offers 500mW 445nm with duty cycle of 50 sec on/25 seconds off--very solid

The Sanwu Guardian is 1W 445nm -- also small form factor --20mmX 130mm https://www.sanwulasers.com/product/guardian
Hi, thanks for your reply, its very hard to fit an 10440 battery in there, unless the driver is pushed in there horizontally (flat with the diode module. But yea, fitting a battery protection circuit and safety features in there is giong to be impossible, As for capacity, its not going to last. But its actually a unique build. As for the duty cycle, i will put the diode in a copper heatsink, and heatsink it with the host using cooling paste. I can also machine a 30mm or 50 mm heatsink for this build to increase duty cycle. . I'm happy with 30 sec on, 30/60sec off.

I haven't seen those sanwulasers yet. They look very nice and promising for their price. I will look into them. But i like to build my own lasers as its challanging and thats what makes this hobby fun. And also, to my experience, it feels nicer to have a selfmade laser that works, then buying one. Thats because, you know what the construction is and if something fails, how to repair it. And you know what the current setting are. You know hwere everything. Fore some online lasers, there is no way getting into them without damaging it or destroying it. The one i want to build is easily servicable.

If i put two 10180 battery's in series, i might get good output power of it. It won't last that long. But those batteries are charged in 20 min.

Main goal is to pack as much features into a small host. And make it unique

However thanks for your reply
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Old 07-31-2016, 10:46 PM #5
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by paul1598419 View Post
Also, what is your price point? That is important if you want to know if it will sell. I think it could be done in a slightly larger build that would have a longer duty cycle and would also have a longer use between charges.
Hi, i just looked online. I found some good stuff on ebay from dtr-lpf.

1 8W 445nm A Type M140 Blue Laser Diode in Copper Module w Leads | eBay
And
1 8A x Drive V6 Laser Driver M140 PLTB450B NDG700 NDB7875 NUGM01T | eBay

Its pretty expensive, but certainly a deal for what you get.

A M140 diode, and a X-drive V6. I will under power the diode. I would like to sell this laser for like $100 or $90. I don't know if this is too expensive or cheap for what i will deliver with this laser, its the first laser out of the many i made the past 3 years. Tell me what you think.

As for the duty cycle, i can machine a nice external heatsink at school with a click system, to make it modular, easy to install and not harmful for the host. So if i'm gonna make a 50mmX25mm heatsink, and drill a 15mm hole in it,The cycle time would be increased significantly. And i can deliver this too. The heatsinks are removable and very modular. Heatsinking isn't gonna be a problem for me.

I can also make a extension piece for the batteries so you could a larger one in there. But i will have to see. Its more of an unique build. I was thinking of two 10180 battery's in series, 3.7v drop diode. I know its going to be a pain to get everything inside, but thats the fun part of building pen lasers. The challenge. And its nice to achieve 1W or 500mW 445nm laser light with protection features in one small barrel. Back in November 2013, i saw a guy on youtube, who made a 2W 445nm zippo laser lighter. I looked back and it is so small for its power. That actually brought me up this idea.

However thanks for your reply. Tell me what you think of this idea
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Old 07-31-2016, 11:42 PM #6
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

If you are going to make these in quantity, you can get those parts for less than the listed prices. What you call an M140 "A" type is the inferior diode that used to come from the A140 machines. They are still a good diode, just not as sturdy or capable of the power of what we call the M140 diode.
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405nm Laser Pointer 45mW
405nm C11 700mW
405nm Laser Shack Pointer 80mW
Thor H Dual Power 445nm, 438 mW & 1648 mW
445nm 1.75 watts SkyRay Gifted
445nm 3 watts MS-SSW-II
445nm 2.2 watts Nichia MS Envy

445nm 2 watt SMP Copper Host
477nm 127 mW 501B
488nm Uniphase #2201-20SLAT argon laser head and power supply >40mW
520nm LaserLands pointer Measures 510nm
532nm LSR532H-1W Laser, LSR-PS-N1 Driver, RS-75-5 P.S. 1300 mW
532nm 200mW Thermostatically Controlled Fan Cooled (Besram) >230mW
532nm 189mW pocket lab laser
532nm lasers X6 100mW-200mW
532nm lasers X4 75mW- 140mW
632.8nm P210 New Laser Tube 0.57mW Melles Griot 05-LMP-827-037 PS
632.8nm Spectra- Physics He- Ne #102-2 4mW heads X2 and #236 power supply
632.8nm PMS He-Ne # 201P/ LPS-115 2mW
632.8nm Siemens HeNe LGK7630S 7.6mW
635nm 1 watt Cyprus II
635nm 1 watt SMP Copper host
635nm 5mW pointer
635nm 100mW pointer
635nm Lifetime17 Mini-camo build 687mW
650nm 65mW pointer
650nm 380mW 501B
808nm 1+W infrared laser
infrared video camera for collimating IR lasers
Ocean Optics USB2000 Spectrometer
Scientech Vector S310 with AC2500 10 Watt LPM
LaserBee II 3.2 Watt LPM
Radiant X4 3.7 Watt LPM
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Old 08-01-2016, 12:04 AM #7
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackOps View Post
Hi, thanks for your reply, its very hard to fit an 10440 battery in there, unless the driver is pushed in there horizontally (flat with the diode module. But yea, fitting a battery protection circuit and safety features in there is giong to be impossible, As for capacity, its not going to last. But its actually a unique build. As for the duty cycle, i will put the diode in a copper heatsink, and heatsink it with the host using cooling paste. I can also machine a 30mm or 50 mm heatsink for this build to increase duty cycle. . I'm happy with 30 sec on, 30/60sec off.

I haven't seen those sanwulasers yet. They look very nice and promising for their price. I will look into them. But i like to build my own lasers as its challanging and thats what makes this hobby fun. And also, to my experience, it feels nicer to have a selfmade laser that works, then buying one. Thats because, you know what the construction is and if something fails, how to repair it. And you know what the current setting are. You know hwere everything. Fore some online lasers, there is no way getting into them without damaging it or destroying it. The one i want to build is easily servicable.

If i put two 10180 battery's in series, i might get good output power of it. It won't last that long. But those batteries are charged in 20 min.

Main goal is to pack as much features into a small host. And make it unique

However thanks for your reply
10180 500mAh would be a better choice, yes.
I don't hink you can get anywhere near 1W of 445nm with those batteries--probably not even 500mW but will be interesting to see how it turns out.

Here are two micro builds done by LPF member jayrob -- this one uses a 10440 FS: Micro Chrome Build Kit! FlexDrive 'Hot' option and this one a 10280 http://laserpointerforums.com/newrep...ply&p=1435229&

Here is one more 10440 build by jayrob FS: Stainless Steel 10440 Kit! - Awesome!
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Old 08-01-2016, 12:17 AM #8
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by paul1598419 View Post
If you are going to make these in quantity, you can get those parts for less than the listed prices. What you call an M140 "A" type is the inferior diode that used to come from the A140 machines. They are still a good diode, just not as sturdy or capable of the power of what we call the M140 diode.
Hi, thanks for your reply, i think i will start of with 1 piece. Those are pretty expensive. As for power, i think the M140 is slightly more efficient. Not sure tough. I will do a research now. But i don't think i will be able to reach 1W. I will be happy with 200mW. But i will have to see. However thanks
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Old 08-01-2016, 12:43 AM #9
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Encap View Post
10180 500mAh would be a better choice, yes.
I don't hink you can get anywhere near 1W of 445nm with those batteries--probably not even 500mW but will be interesting to see how it turns out.

Here are two micro builds done by LPF member jayrob -- this one uses a 10440 FS: Micro Chrome Build Kit! FlexDrive 'Hot' option and this one a 10280 http://laserpointerforums.com/newrep...ply&p=1435229&

Here is one more 10440 build by jayrob FS: Stainless Steel 10440 Kit! - Awesome!
Hi, thanks for your reply. I have seen those builds. They are so small and nice. They have a decent output power too. The reason i actually want to sell a high power laser, is because i don't really like ultra high power lasers. They are still fun to build, that for sure. I have made a 100/150mW red laser back in December 2013. But nothing more powerful since then. But i will keep you updated.
However thanks
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Old 08-01-2016, 01:30 AM #10
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackOps View Post
Hi, thanks for your reply. I have seen those builds. They are so small and nice. They have a decent output power too. The reason i actually want to sell a high power laser, is because i don't really like ultra high power lasers. They are still fun to build, that for sure. I have made a 100/150mW red laser back in December 2013. But nothing more powerful since then. But i will keep you updated.
However thanks

I just finished a Trustfire F23 with a 10440 and a Mitsubishi 300 diode. (about 100mm)

The other BIG issue is HEAT. You aren't going to get much heat sinking on something that small.

Mine will put out great power, but only for a VERY limited time before it overheats. It REQUIRES a good quality 10440, you can't use a trustfire or ultrafire with it.

Better batteries will give you more power on demand. Cheaper ones have a better chance of going boom.

Keep that in mind.

I still need to put it on the LPM though.
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Old 08-01-2016, 01:54 AM #11
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

Well, a man after my own heart! I love little pocket mini's. After you finish your build I would like a shot at taking it off you hands? Keep me in mind and I will be looking for your finished post. Best wishes for your build!
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Old 08-01-2016, 02:21 AM #12
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

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Originally Posted by BlackOps View Post
Hi, thanks for your reply, i think i will start of with 1 piece. Those are pretty expensive. As for power, i think the M140 is slightly more efficient. Not sure tough. I will do a research now. But i don't think i will be able to reach 1W. I will be happy with 200mW. But i will have to see. However thanks

All of the features you list are really good. Nice project.

The limiting factors will be power source and heat dissipation characteristics + heat generated.

Would guess you should be able to get 200mW to 500mW of 445nm with the 10180.

Email DTR for his best advice---you can't go wrong with his service, products, or advice

THe little sanwu pocket that does 500mW of 445nm but uses a 10440-- here is a review of it with images of parts so you can see what sanwu has done.
Sanwu pocket 445nm laser 500mw with G7 lens review

For small but high output see the Sanwu Red Guradian ---2W 445nm output solid red copper host , unlimited duty cycle 20 X 130mm here:
https://www.sanwulasers.com/product/redguardian

Last edited by Encap; 08-01-2016 at 02:38 AM.
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Old 08-01-2016, 02:41 AM #13
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

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Originally Posted by icecruncher View Post
I just finished a Trustfire F23 with a 10440 and a Mitsubishi 300 diode. (about 100mm)

The other BIG issue is HEAT. You aren't going to get much heat sinking on something that small.

Mine will put out great power, but only for a VERY limited time before it overheats. It REQUIRES a good quality 10440, you can't use a trustfire or ultrafire with it.

Better batteries will give you more power on demand. Cheaper ones have a better chance of going boom.

Keep that in mind.

I still need to put it on the LPM though.
Hi, thanks for your reply, yea. Its going to be a challenge. I'm sure i will be able to get everything to fit in terms of the driver and the optical compartment including the lens and diode.

Nice host and build btw, i'm pretty interested in the output power as for heat, i will find a way to make an nice modular 50mm heatsink with an click on system to increase cycle time.
I might be able to make an heatsink for the driver too at school using a cnc milling machine and measuring the parts on the pcb. But i will have to see whether thats possible as we are talking about micro in this case. Its going to be an interesting experiment!
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Old 08-01-2016, 02:45 AM #14
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

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Originally Posted by BobMc View Post
Well, a man after my own heart! I love little pocket mini's. After you finish your build I would like a shot at taking it off you hands? Keep me in mind and I will be looking for your finished post. Best wishes for your build!
Hi, thanks for your reply . I will keep you notified. I will make pictures of the infrastructure. I recommend you to look at this thread: DIY ultra small 405nm laser build.

It is one of my builds, this one is going to look very similar to that one in terms of construction Tell me whether u like it!
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Old 08-01-2016, 02:58 AM #15
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Encap View Post
All of the features you list are really good. Nice project.

The limiting factors will be power source and heat dissipation characteristics + heat generated.

Would guess you should be able to get 200mW to 500mW of 445nm with the 10180.

Email DTR for his best advice---you can't go wrong with his service, products, or advice

THe little sanwu pocket that does 500mW of 445nm but uses a 10440-- here is a review of it with images of parts so you can see what sanwu has done.
Sanwu pocket 445nm laser 500mw with G7 lens review

For small but high output see the Sanwu Red Guradian ---2W 445nm output solid red copper host , unlimited duty cycle 20 X 130mm here:
https://www.sanwulasers.com/product/redguardian
Hi, thanks for your reply! The power source is going to be prob NO-1. As for heat, i can take care of that by machining a 50mm copper cylinder and make a click system onto the host to increase cycle time. Still worried about the power. I will still be happy with 200mW or close. For such a portable small device with that many features (my 405nm build had all those features successfully build into it, except for the power off when dropped as it was a low power build 30/50mW)

Only drawback is that you probably cannot use the laser underwater, its also not a good idea. Problem number one is reflections to the facet. As water will definitely reflect some back. And its overall not a good idea for safety reasons.

I will email DTR soon.
I haven't noticed those sanwu's till today. I will keep an eye on them. But i will certainly try to make this build. And this isn't going to be my only build. Next year, i also want to build an red laser in the exact same formfactor. Might even make an 520nm green one. But for now, i will build a high power 445nm one.

However thanks for your reply
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Old 08-01-2016, 03:09 AM #16
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Default Re: Some questions about pocket size 1W 445nm.

Here are pictures of two minis that I have. One is a Rick Trent kit that have been LPM'd at better than 3.5 watt duty cycle is about 15 seconds but its a great build. ( I didn't build it, I paid someone else to, that man wants to remain anonymous) it runs on a 14500.the other is a laser I bought off bdgreenb here on the forum its 700mw it runs off a 10440 and its real sweet also. So I'd love to get another 1watt 445 mini.
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Last edited by BobMc; 08-01-2016 at 03:15 AM. Reason: more info
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