Slick Transaction... ya think???

lasersbee said:

There is no stalking involved...
If I happen to stumble on him sell anything I'll
just link back to here and the buyer can make
up his own mind...
And it seems he doesn't believe in Karma...

Just trying to protect the LPF community from
sellers like that....


Jerry

Click to expand...

I was joking and I know.

EDIT: na na na na na na na na na na na na na na na na Jerry!

Trevor said:

Jerry, I completely understand why you're upset over this transaction.

But I'd cool it a bit on the ad hominem if I were you. You may not take a reputation hit for it, but people do remember things like that. :undecided:

Just my opinion; it's worth what you paid for it...

-Trevor

Click to expand...

I hear you.... :spank:

Guyfromhe said:

I was joking and I know.

EDIT: na na na na na na na na na na na na na na na na Jerry!

Click to expand...

Yeah I know...:na:

Jerry

FutureOne said:

All you had to do was pay for the product and let me ship it like every other normal transaction on the internet.

In fact, if you had done this, you'd have the original WL unit and not the other one because it would be on its way out before I had a chance to change my mind.

Click to expand...

Using a middle man is perfectly acceptable and encouraged practice when dealing with new members.

Changing your mind after a deal is reached, is acceptable so long as money has not changed hands, but it is impolite to say the least.

FutureOne said:

So the guy is in my city. I'm willing to drive over and hand over the stuff for inspection, but he still rather have me ship it?

Click to expand...

The guy is doing you favor, by agreeing to act as middle man, and you're complaining because he's too busy to have you drive up to his house? Original deal was to have packaged shipped, why did you all of a sudden decide on driving instead? Driving to the post office was always an option since you like to drive so much.

FutureOne said:

What do I do if I send it and I never heard from you guys again? It's my word against Laserbee™ because I'm the "new" guy.

Click to expand...

Right here's a guy with hundreds of transactions and a good rep to his name... yeah, he's gonna risk his reputation to scam you out of a $300 laser. I think not.

FutureOne said:

So yeah, I will take the bad rep rather than risk losing my stuff thanks.

Click to expand...

Since you asked for it.

FutureOne said:

All you had to do was pay for the product and let me ship it like every other normal transaction on the internet.

In fact, if you had done this, you'd have the original WL unit and not the other one because it would be on its way out before I had a chance to change my mind.

You are a corporation and I am an individual. I don't ask you to ship a LPM to a 3rd party to get checked out before I pay you. I just give you the money and you send me the product. That's how it works for 99.999% of transactions on the internet.

Yet you expect me, the individual, to risk sending my laser out without payment to get "checked" before I can get payed. Even though it was an inconvenience, I was willing to meet you halfway, since the guy was in my city, why not just drive over? Yet he doesn't have time for me to drop by and have the laser inspected, but he does have time for me to ship it and then have it inspected. What's the difference? If he's afraid to meet face to face he's got bigger issues. I'm helping my dad search for a used car, and we're meeting face to face with people like 3 times a week.

So the guy is in my city. I'm willing to drive over and hand over the stuff for inspection, but he still rather have me ship it?

What do I do if I send it and I never heard from you guys again? It's my word against Laserbee™ because I'm the "new" guy.

So yeah, I will take the bad rep rather than risk losing my stuff thanks.

Click to expand...

All you had to do was say "no I dont want to sell to you under those conditions" you went wrong when you said "yes"

FutureOne said:

Actually no agreement was ever made.

Click to expand...

Why were you going to take it to a middle man if no agreement was made?

The middleman shoulnt have check his email.

InfinitusEquitas said:

Using a middle man is perfectly acceptable and encouraged practice when dealing with new members.

Changing your mind after a deal is reached, is acceptable so long as money has not changed hands, but it is impolite to say the least.



The guy is doing you favor, by agreeing to act as middle man, and you're complaining because he's too busy to have you drive up to his house? Original deal was to have packaged shipped, why did you all of a sudden decide on driving instead? Driving to the post office was always an option since you like to drive so much.


Right here's a guy with hundreds of transactions and a good rep to his name... yeah, he's gonna risk his reputation to scam you out of a $300 laser. I think not.



Since you asked for it.

Click to expand...

the middle man wasnt doing the seller a favor. He was doing jerry a favor. the purpose of a sale is to make money. not spend much on double shipping. so driving to the 3rd party makes perfect sense.

as to this kid not keeping jerry in the loop, that is the problem. It sucks thinking something is yours when it isn't. and to lead him on a second time is even worse.

and this whole thing goes back to the main problem we always see here. the seller doesn't communicate!!!! i guess some things will never change.

Michael.

chipdouglas said:

the middle man wasnt doing the seller a favor. He was doing jerry a favor. the purpose of a sale is to make money. not spend much on double shipping. so driving to the 3rd party makes perfect sense.

as to this kid not keeping jerry in the loop, that is the problem. It sucks thinking something is yours when it isn't. and to lead him on a second time is even worse.

and this whole thing goes back to the main problem we always see here. the seller doesn't communicate!!!! i guess some things will never change.

Michael.

Click to expand...

A middleman helps to facilitate the transaction, as such, imo, he's doing a favor for both parties.

Driving to post office, and sending out the package, which was the agreement, makes even more sense imho.

I do agree though, biggest issue here is communication.

i say the middle man needs to be outed!!!!! Heads need to roll...


michael.

chipdouglas said:

i say the middle man needs to be outed!!!!! Heads need to roll...

Click to expand...

Lol, I'll get the guillotine:crackup:

I don't check my spam inbox either though

Here you go guys, I copied the string of E-mails I sent and received. Actual E-mails and names were removed to protect the innocent (and I guess the guilty too)







From: (3rd Party E-mail)
To: (My E-mail)
Subject: RE: Arctic Laser
Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 19:58:19 -0400




I am afraid I wont have time in the near future to meet up.. I am currently doing 14hr days of seasonal work
and can barely squeeze in time for my kids..

The idea of a middle man is not just to test the laser, but to ensure the buyer meets with no foul play.
He pays for shipping after I receive it and resend it. You only pay once which is approx 5-8$ for express within the GTA.

I check that all the pieces which were included in the sale are present, the item works as described, give
him the 'ok' and he sends the cash... This way there is no risk to the buyer with a fairly new seller on the forum..

If you are concerned about either myself or LasersBee, I can assure you, we are both long standing members
with plenty of similar transactions through the forum with no issues...



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: Arctic Laser
From: (My E-mail)

Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 07:25:58 -0400
To: (3rd Party E-mail)


You're in Toronto right? Whereabouts? I could probably just drop by and have you test it, and you can give your friend the go ahead. Let me know, thanks.


Sent from my iPhone


On Aug 23, 2011, at 9:09 PM, From: (My E-mail)
To: (3rd Party E-mail) <From: (My E-mail)
To: (3rd Party E-mail)> wrote:






Sorry, found this in my junk mail folder... I spoke to Jerry and he was mentioning a middle man
for the sale of the laser. Traditionally what is done is you send the laser to the 'middle man' being
me, and I ship it to the buyer after the $$ has been sent.

This is just to ensure buyer protection, as in the past people have sold on the forum and failed to
deliver.. This just avoids any issues. Jerry is a stand up guy, and trusted, but even with a middle man
I dont ship until I have confirmation from the seller that the $$ has been sent..

If everything is a go, I will send you my mailing address, and notify lasersbee when it arrives and all is 'ok'.



(3rd Party) aka From:
To: (3rd Party E-mail)from LPF.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: (My E-mail)
To: (3rd Party E-mail)
Subject: RE: Arctic Laser
Date: Tue, 23 Aug 2011 13:40:49 +0000


Hi there.

Not sure if you received my previous E-mail, so I am sending it again. Let me know when you have received it.

Thanks.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: (My E-mail)
To: (3rd Party E-mail)
Subject: Arctic Laser
Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 20:08:33 +0000


Hi there.

Your friend Laserbee wants me to show you the Arctic Laser. Where in Toronto are you? I'm near the west end, around (Intersection).

Let me know. Thanks.

If you ship to an address other than the Address supplied to
PayPal by the buyer... you risk not being protected by PayPal
and risk loosing the product and your money...
I will never ship to an address other than that attached to the
buyers PayPal account.
If the address is not correct it is up to the Buyer to update it
before he pays...

quote from Jerry--
read and heed-- PP conf. addy is a must.

well said Jer..


hak

Actually the shipping to the buyer was included in the deal we
made...

It was cheaper for him to ship it to the middleman... Then the
much longer shipping from the middleman to me was covered
by me... not the seller.

I think the Lasers may have been defective and that's why he
didn't ship to the middleman..

@FutureOne...
You have no reputation as a seller.... The only reputation as a
seller you have is this "slick" transaction...

I have a fairly decent reputation as a seller. I've been doing
it for years. My address and telephone number is easily accessed
and is not hidden.

Get your facts straight....
The agreement was that you ship it to the middleman. Once he
OKed it I would immediately send you the funds.

lasersbee said:

You will need to ship it to a middleman member...first.

When he tells be the Arctic and parts OK.. I'll send the
money to you,

The middleman is LPF member XXXXXXXX...
He lives in Toronto as well. He will get in touch with you
after I contact him.

Do you have an E-Mail address... You can send your
E-Mail address to my E-Mail address :- info@bauer-ee.com


Jerry

Click to expand...

Look familiar ????
Never did get your E-Mail Address....

You were the one that NEEDED to drive to his private home. He
owes you nothing. He was kind enough to offer to check out your
Laser for Free....
You calling him a Flake and Stupid does not help your case.

It seems to me that you were trying to hide something... by
looking for excuses why you couldn't/shouldn't ship as agreed..

I sell Brand New products... You were selling used in unknown
condition Lasers with a total Post count of 48 and no Rep Points
on this Forum.

As a third party who would you trust to send $175.00 to.

FutureOne said:

Hi there.

Your friend Laserbee wants me to show you the Arctic Laser. Where in Toronto are you? I'm near the west end, around (Intersection).

Let me know. Thanks.

Click to expand...

BTW.... That is a blatant lie to manipulate the middleman...:tsk:


Jerry

Believe whatever you want. You can afford to lose $175. I can't. If the unit was defective, which is not, what would happen if your buddy agreed to have me drive over? What, I'd take a dead laser over to him to inspect? He'd still say it was defective and the transaction would end there. I simply did not want to part with my laser until I had cash in my hand. Would you send a LPM to someone with the promise that a third party would "check it out" and then when they were satisfied, you'd get your payment? Of course not! And you may be known here on this board, but try in on eBay and see if that works for you. Try it on your commercial web site and see if that works for you.

Bottom line:

1. You are angry with me for lack of communication. Sorry I thought your 3rd party would keep you appraised of the situation, isn't that the whole purpose he was involved?

2. The guy took 3 days to get back to me the first time. I didn't think he was going to reply at all. When he did I asked him where he lived (He didn't have to give me a full address, a simple intersection would have told me relatively how far away he was). Maybe he lives down the block from me? I have no way to know. Maybe I could have walked over and could have tested to his hearts content.

3. How do I trust that your 3rd party gets the unit, takes it out, drops it by accident and kills it, and then guess what, gives a bad report to you, and I lose my stuff because of it. Anything can happen, especially when the shit is not yours. I know this is unlikely, but since the guy claims to be in the same city as me, why not just go over there.

4. He eventually told me he doesn't have time to have me drop by with everything in hand and have him test it in my presence. But he does have time for me to ship it, and then he can test it (leave it on for hours at a time, stress tests) which might in fact damage the laser and then he can claim it was defective and I lose my stuff.

5. Why is this guy so scared to have someone drop by if that's the problem? I'd have suggested a public meet (as I usually do for other local transactions) but considering the nature of the product, not exactly something you want to be shining in a public coffee shop. Even then it doesn't make sense as he still had to give me his address for me to ship to him. So what was HE hiding that I couldn't just drop by?

6. Being strung for a week while other people are offering me money DID piss me off. If he had checked his E-mails on time, the second day he would have told me a local visit was not an option, and I might have decided to just take the chance and send it.

Anyway, you lost nothing. No money was exchanged. I got my asking price from someone else (I don't even know if they post on this board, but I will ask him) and hopefully when they get it they can confirm the unit works just fine.

That's all I have to say on the matter.

"That's all I have to say on the matter. "

Promise??

'cause I think we have already heard too much.

hakzaw1 said:

"That's all I have to say on the matter. "

Promise??

'cause I think we have already heard too much.

Click to expand...

Yeah.... he can back pedal all he wants....
What a "slick" operator.....:crackup::crackup:

I've said what I had to say and the Forum Community can
access this Thread anytime if wanting to deal with FutureOne...



Jerry