Bad Experience with SwimminSurfer256

zdarkazn · Nov 27, 2011

benmwv said:
Now I know it would really suck for this to happen, but I think you are being very unreasonable.

You bought a used laser that did work that was sold as no returns or refunds with a description that it worked. While it may not have been quite up to par with a new argon laser when you received it, you have to remember that this wasn't a new laser. He had no way to know it would stop working. I really think you have no leg to stand on here, considering it was stated no return or refunds as long as it wasn't DOA. That pretty much means "as is", as long as it arrives working.

And now that you are offered a partial refund (which you were lucky he even considered it, especially after you opened a dispute against him) you complain that it's not enough and that you have to return the laser. Well surely you didn't expect to A. Get a full refund given the item was sold as no return or refund, and B. Simply claim it doesn't work and get free money without having to send it back.

I think you should either accept his offer (which I think is more than generous, considering the circumstances of the trade) or go with rhd's idea and sell it to recoup your lost money (but I think in this case swimminsurfer shouldn't have to give him any money).

So you're saying if i sold you a tv that works for one minute and then dies, thats your fault then? It was functional when you had it for the 1 minute..

benmwv · Nov 27, 2011

zdarkazn said:
You're forgetting the fact that a USED item is FULLY functional. An fully functional argon is able to idle on low power for over an hour..this one didnt even reach an hour. How is that MY fault that the laser isnt fully functional? It didnt even perform as intended..they're meant to run for long periods of time..thats the main reason i even bought it in the first place, which is why i stated i wouldnt have bought it he had stated that he only tested it for 10-20 minutes in the first place.

But he stated no returns/refunds...
It doesn't matter what happens with it as long as it wasn't DOA you aren't really entitled to a refund. At least that's the way I see it.

zdarkazn said:
So you're saying if i sold you a tv that works for one minute and then dies, thats your fault then? It was functional when you had it for the 1 minute..

So your saying that if you sold someone a used TV, stating that there are no refunds or returns, only guaranteeing that it will work when they receive it and they later come back and say it stopped working you would give a full refund and take the loss entirely yourself when you did nothing wrong and the product was as advertised?

jcranmer · Nov 27, 2011

Did you quote the wrong message? I was only suggesting an option that might get you the working laser that I assume you want.

However if I bought a USED tv without any warrenty and it died. I'd be stuck with it. It would suck but that is the risk you have to take if you buy used.

zdarkazn · Nov 27, 2011

benmwv said:
But he stated no returns/refunds...
It doesn't matter what happens with it as long as it wasn't DOA you aren't really entitled to a refund. At least that's the way I see it.

So your saying that if you sold someone a used TV, stating that there are no refunds or returns, only guaranteeing that it will work when they receive it and they later come back and say it stopped working you would give a full refund and take the loss entirely yourself when you did nothing wrong and the product was as advertised?

Yes, if its within a week, thats usually what happens. Thats usually a "item i received is not as described" on ebay.. Ive done that before when i sold off my gaming laptops. I described them as "like new" condition, however, some buyers found that the hard drive was failing and kept giving a blue screen after a few hours of gaming. I took the laptop back and refunded.. Now about the Tv, If the TV was stated as works great, and dies within a week(its usually 45 days on ebay, but most problems show up in a week), the buyer can dispute and is able to return the TV. This laser didnt even reach a week..it was an hour AND it was described as "works great".. Now what about hard drives then? Those fail easily, if you sell someone a laptop and say it works great, and you only boot up the laptop to desktop screen to see that the hard drive has the correct storage, and then ship the laptop..you're going to get it shipped back very soon if the hard drive fails. Because you said it works great, the buyer turned on the laptop, then used it, and it failed..that is NOT a "working great" laptop. I guess no one here really works with a lot of electronics to know what i mean. Someone made a comment about buying a used car..BUT thats in person, you CAN test the car however much you want. THIS is online..i CANT test the item myself before i buy it...

zdarkazn · Nov 27, 2011

jcranmer said:
Did you quote the wrong message? I was only suggesting an option that might get you the working laser that I assume you want.

However if I bought a USED tv without any warrenty and it died. I'd be stuck with it. It would suck but that is the risk you have to take if you buy used.

Sorry, fixed. Your opinion is good.

SpyderFire · Nov 27, 2011

My 2 cents,

When items are sold without a specific warranty, and used, it's usually as-is.

It got there in a non DOA condition.

I would say that is pretty much it. Case closed.

On the flip side if swimmin would like to help you out that would be nice of him.

Being on the losing end of the deal doesn't feel good, I'm sure , but fighting your view of
The matter usually doesn't change the outcome.

Good luck to you and I hope it all gets resolved .

benmwv · Nov 27, 2011

zdarkazn said:
Yes, if its within a week, thats usually what happens. Thats usually a "item i received is not as described" on ebay.. Ive done that before when i sold off my gaming laptops. I described them as "like new" condition, however, some buyers found that the hard drive was failing and kept giving a blue screen after a few hours of gaming. I took the laptop back and refunded.. Now about the Tv, If the TV was stated as works great, and dies within a week(its usually 45 days on ebay, but most problems show up in a week), the buyer can dispute and is able to return the TV. This laser didnt even reach a week..it was an hour AND it was described as "works great".. Now what about hard drives then? Those fail easily, if you sell someone a laptop and say it works great, and you only boot up the laptop to desktop screen to see that the hard drive has the correct storage, and then ship the laptop..you're going to get it shipped back very soon if the hard drive fails. Because you said it works great, the buyer turned on the laptop, then used it, and it failed..that is NOT a "working great" laptop. I guess no one here really works with a lot of electronics to know what i mean. Someone made a comment about buying a used car..BUT thats in person, you CAN test the car however much you want. THIS is online..i CANT test the item myself before i buy it...

Well, on eBay you may win the dispute. But I believe in this circumstance you knew that there were NO refunds. The only way you could get a refund was if it didn't work when you received it. Since it did work, all terms of the trade have been fulfilled and I don't see how you can justify wanting a refund when it was sold as no refunds.

The way I see it, he really doesn't have to give you anything. Offering you a partial refund was generous, and a full refund would only serve to help his reputation but is in no way required.

Pontiacg5 · Nov 27, 2011

I don't see what the big deal is here. Argons have a very finicky nature, it's something anyone wanting to play with gas lasers knows. The thing arrived to you working so as far as I'm concerned Swimm doesn't owe you anything. Trying to demand an agreement such as "the argon should be tested for a week before shipping" or whatever after the fact is just silly.

This whole thread reeks of someone trying to work someone else over for their own mistakes. I bet you left the thing on with the fan off or something. Either that or you were running it hot and then just shut the fans off or something else like that.

It was sold as used, it arrived in working condition and worked for a considerable period of time before mysteriously dying. I don't even see why there is an argument about this...

Flaminpyro · Nov 27, 2011

So are you saying here that if YOU bought something and it only worked for less than one hour you would not complain about it, huh...

Yea that makes perfect sense, I'll have to try that some time :crackup:

And shame on you for implying the buyer burned up the laser, what do you know about it
have you ever owned this model of laser ? can it even be run with the fans off if it is hot ?
do you even know what the model number of the laser is, how can you say such things
with so little knowledge about the subject :shhh:

Pontiacg5 said:
I don't see what the big deal is here. Argons have a very finicky nature, it's something anyone wanting to play with gas lasers knows. The thing arrived to you working so as far as I'm concerned Swimm doesn't owe you anything. Trying to demand an agreement such as "the argon should be tested for a week before shipping" or whatever after the fact is just silly.

This whole thread reeks of someone trying to work someone else over for their own mistakes. I bet you left the thing on with the fan off or something. Either that or you were running it hot and then just shut the fans off or something else like that.

It was sold as used, it arrived in working condition and worked for a considerable period of time before mysteriously dying. I don't even see why there is an argument about this...

swimminsurfer256 · Nov 27, 2011

Wow this is getting a little out of hand... First of all, @zdark, there was some sarcasm in the whole "take our private messaging here" but I realize that's hard to convey over text. Second, @flamin I agree that it should not be assumed that the buyer mishandled the laser somehow, but it could be considered (it is possible to shut off the whole laser without letting it cool off -- I think the fans run when you turn the key 'off' until the laser is cool. It is possible to switch the entire thing off and not let it do that).

I don't want this to get more out of hand. The situation has been told and my reputation's been sufficiently attacked I believe (as is the purpose of the thread

). I'm going to just let the PayPal decide.

Flaminpyro · Nov 27, 2011

I would agree it was used and it really could be expected to die at any second, but then couldn't you say that about most electronics :thinking:
especially something that has been through the USPS :crackup:

in any case to pay several hundred dollars for something and then only get to use it for 45 min seems a little expensive.

I would hope you guys can come up with a compromise that you both can live with :beer:

My only interest is that both parties walk away satisfied and there isn't a bunch a flaming going on for no reason if it can be helped.

There has already been name calling by unassociated parties, lets try and avoid that if we can

next we'll have mods in here shooting up the place :crackup:

@ swim I personally don't think your rep is trashed ! and I don't think that was the purpose of this thread, i think it's purpose was about a laser that only worked for 45 min. I think what happens to your rep is kinda up to you :thinking:

swimminsurfer256 · Nov 27, 2011

Flaminpyro said:
@ swim I personally don't think your rep is trashed ! and I don't think that was the purpose of this thread, i think it's purpose was about a laser that only worked for 45 min. I think what happens to your rep is kinda up to you :thinking:

Not trashed -- attacked. I'm just a little peeved that this negative thread (see title) was created before the situation came to an end.. That's just personal feelings though.

I asked for $200 which is half/half, yet you seem unwilling to give up anything and only want to give me $150 AND make me ship the laser back to you..giving me only $100 after s/h. You call this an attempt at a refund..? Okay, you say you're in debt, you're only thinking about yourself.. Think of other people's lives too. I just requested to cancel 2 laser purchases(ebay sale) after having sent the money due to my sister being in a car accident. Those sellers could have shipped me the item anyways and disregarded my message and i couldnt have done anything about it, but they were nice enough to refund me. You're extremely lucky this wasnt an ebay sale..your attempt at a "works great" description would not work..

If that had occurred with our transaction and you paid and then said you needed the money and asked me to not ship the item to you I would have happily obliged. I would not "have shipped the item anyways and disregarded [your] message." This is not even close to that situation at all. You're asking me to take back a broken item that I offered zero refund/return on and refund you money I don't have. I feel like you're just trying to attack me at this point because I don't see the similarity between the transaction you mentioned and our transaction.

Also, yes, I consider that me offering to refund you $150 is "an attempt at a refund."

lasersbee · Nov 27, 2011

This is a hard one to call....

1) only the sender can open a Insurance Claim....
2) If you pay for Insurance then you get a receipt of the Value Insured.
3) RHD's idea is doable and fair.
4) You could get it repaired and split the cost of repair
5) Perhaps it is only a PS part that has blown and a Member could fit it.

Jerry

Elektrotechniker · Nov 27, 2011

On the other side, " hey i've already bought a laptop and have no money to refund I'm so sorry" is VERY lame IMO.Sounds like the laser could be malfunctioning and you wanted to get rid of it asap and use the money so you won't be able to refund. That's why I can't choose side here. If you try to blame one, there's something opposite from the other which does not give the second the right at all. Hope you guys can sort this out peacefully. That's just the way I look at this situation. Really hard to tell if someone doesn't know exactly what's the issue with the laser.

swimminsurfer256 · Nov 27, 2011

Silvershot said:
On the other side, " hey i've already bought a laptop and have no money to refund I'm so sorry" is VERY lame IMO.Sounds like the laser could be malfunctioning and you wanted to get rid of it asap and use the money so you won't be able to refund.

I mean it's just the truth. I needed spare cash and the purpose of selling the laser was to be able to buy a laptop -- which I did. That's the reason I didn't offer return/refund -- because I KNEW I wouldn't have the money to. I waited until the laser arrived not DOA to use up my money. I can show you the receipt for the computer if you want. I don't have a job/income other than what I can get from the overspec pen sale thread which isn't exorbitant amounts of money.. Still just a sophomore..

@lb, meant PayPal dispute. It still froze my funds and was escalated to a claim when I didn't accept giving a full refund. And I have the insurance receipt that shows the destination address and full insured amount. Apparently that wasn't enough!

lasersbee · Nov 27, 2011

I corrected what I meant to say... Oops...:yabbem:

Jerry

Bad Experience with SwimminSurfer256

zdarkazn

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benmwv

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jcranmer

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zdarkazn

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zdarkazn

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SpyderFire

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benmwv

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Pontiacg5

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Flaminpyro

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swimminsurfer256

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Flaminpyro

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swimminsurfer256

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lasersbee

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Elektrotechniker

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swimminsurfer256

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lasersbee

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