Old 07-17-2015, 03:24 PM #1
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Default Another Scam - Be Aware

Hi Everyone ,

Me again.

So the story begins in January. A guy bought 2 lasers. 1W green and a 5W blue for around $1000 total.

I built both lasers and they arrived to him within a month +-.

They got to him and worked good. He loved them. Only one or two things were not good to him. One host had a scratch and second had a focus adapter a little off.

I promised to send nee parts and did that. I sent a pack if parts and it did not arrive. Sent via non tracked mail as it was small parts.

After half a year he made a PayPal Claim. He first told me he want a refund. Which I agreed if he send them both back and if they are in perfect condition. He made the chargeback and to this day I did not get the lasers yet.

He now says paypal gave him $100 less. And want me to refund him. I told him that it might be due to paypal fees. I seriously do not have that $100 he is talking about.

It is a guy from Germany. I lost $1000 + parts worth a lot of money. Be Aware ! Paypal rules are now very bad for us sellers. I am now taking extra precautions.

I make a lot of orders per month. And I guess that every ince in a while you get a punch from someone.

Anyways , if anyone need help with a paypal case let me know.



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Old 07-17-2015, 03:30 PM #2
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

Was this a paypal charge back? Did he get the money back? How can that happen if they don't send the item back?
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Old 07-17-2015, 04:02 PM #3
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alaskan View Post
Was this a paypal charge back? Did he get the money back? How can that happen if they don't send the item back?
The thing is that it is not a claim. It is a chatgeback. Means he turned to the Visa company and told them he did not make the purchase. Paypal take the money from you. I proved I sent it. And they said they can not do anything against the Visa company. Visa decided to refund him and belived him he did not make the purchase.
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Old 07-17-2015, 04:15 PM #4
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

What a scumbag. I hate these type of scammers
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Old 07-17-2015, 04:19 PM #5
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

Didn't the original package have a tracking number?
Very sorry that the person was very dishonest and did that chargeback against you and kept the lasers. $1000 is a lot of money to lose
I have not bought anything from you or dealt with you but from what I have seen here you are a really nice person to buy from and build excellent lasers. Chin up as you have many supporters and thank you for the information.
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Old 07-17-2015, 05:40 PM #6
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

If anyone need his name I will pm it so you can stay away and not sell him a thing.

I did have tracking but PayPal hands are tied up.
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Old 07-17-2015, 06:12 PM #7
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

I want the name. This kind of thing disgusts me. Diodes are consumables and this isn't Walmart
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Old 07-17-2015, 06:20 PM #8
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

This chargeback thing sounds very doubtful. Isn't paypal there to protect both the money of the buyers AND the sellers? I would contact the visa company and see if they cab do something.
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Old 07-17-2015, 06:28 PM #9
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

Sorry to hear this, sometimes you have to deal with difficult customers but this kind of thing disgusts me,
It happened only once or maybe twice and I always be very wary.. You're right pp current policy is entirely in favor of the buyers.
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Old 07-17-2015, 06:36 PM #10
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pman View Post
I want the name. This kind of thing disgusts me. Diodes are consumables and this isn't Walmart
Yes this is happening too often, a list needs to be maintained of these people and shared with sellers, we will all pay higher prices because of scammers.

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Old 07-17-2015, 06:38 PM #11
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

This is not walmart indeed ^^

Visa here in Israel can not take care of their clients in Germany.( He is from Germany ).

And contacting them is not possible as I do not speak german.

I have told paypal everything including sending them an image of his package. But nothing.

Be aware guys.

I do everything for my clients. Even if it takes a long time. I have never took money that I do not own. And I had cases in which the buyer got a broken item and just sent it back and got a refund. Nothing bad here. But this case is just awful. And he actually told me that he will open a thread here if I do not send him another $100. Anyways , it is done $1000 less. But at least you will be aware for these scamms.

The irony here is that paypal try to prevent scamms , but it make an easy life for scammers after all.
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Old 07-17-2015, 07:47 PM #12
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

That's a crappy situation, I'm sorry about your loss.

If it were within the same country, you would be able to challenge the chargeback itself, directly with Visa.

I had the "pleasant" problem of dealing with a customer who tried a chargeback a total of six times. Paid for service, service was done, I had a written contract, signed credit card authorization form, emails confirming payment, and still the guy kept doing it.

Unfortunately, as a general rule, credit card companies will always initially just side with the buyer, and it's up to the seller to fight it.
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Old 07-17-2015, 08:25 PM #13
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

Normally in USA any selling company has a chance to dispute any VISA chargebeack claim with facts.

It sounds like you have no choice but to request wire tranfers of funds from buyers.
If it is not an order froim within Israel anyone can order whatever and simply tell Visa they did not ---is crazy---something is wrong here---Visa is not supposed to be legalized international theft of goods and servicesvehicle.

Contact Visa in Israel and tell them the story---maybe they can do something if you can get the details of the Visa transaction , however , if you don't have a signed Visa charge slip ---usually the seller will lose.

could be PayPal is the problem---they buyer paid paypal with a Visa card not you---so is up to PayPals Visa chargeback policy--however PayPal should not be set up to steal money and products either with idiotic statements like they can't do anything about a Visa chargeback---if they can't then they shouldn't accept Visa at all.

I would contact PayPal again also ----they are not supposed to expedite theft either. They are not a bank however just a money transfer business so who knows?? Tell them you want to dispute the chargeback---you have proof of goods delivered and see what they say.

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Old 07-17-2015, 09:17 PM #14
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

Sorry to hear about this.

Please send me his personal info and Ill add it to the scammers thread. Hopefully it will prevent others from dealing with him.

BTW you should ask him to start a thread. It should make for an interesting discussion!
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Old 07-17-2015, 09:31 PM #15
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

Technically you are not the merchant. Paypal is. The dispute with VISA is with PAYPAL. You unfortunately have no leverage with VISA. PAYPAL is responsible. I would file a small claims lawsuit with PayPal. Your dispute is actually with PayPal.

Credit Card Companies provide the buyer the funds back within 48 hours. The do a 60 day investigation. During this 60 days Paypal would be required to send proof to VISA that they would like to Fight the Dispute. If paypal failed to notify you in a timely fashion so they could fight the dispute on your behalf as they should, this holds PayPal responsible.


*Source* Used to work in Finance Escalations for Sprint.


I assume it is either too late or you have already:
https://www.paypal.com/webapps/mpp/s...chargeback-faq

Seller Chargeback FAQs
What are some ways to avoid chargebacks?

Ship to the buyer's address listed on the Transaction Details page and retain proof of delivery that can be tracked online.
Describe the item you are selling accurately, and in as much detail as possible. Include pictures, measurements, and other relevant details.
Get to know your customers, and respond promptly to their requests.
Save all your customer and transaction-related emails and correspondence.
Publish your return policy in clear and simple terms, and include it in your correspondence with customers. Please note: some laws and credit card issuer policies stipulate that buyers have chargeback rights for merchandise that is not delivered or is defective, even if your policy indicates that all sales are final and that you do not allow returns.
You'll find more helpful tips on safer selling here.

Why do some chargebacks occur long after a payment has been received?

Certain laws and credit card issuer policies allow buyers to file chargebacks weeks or months after the original transaction took place. If a buyer waits and files later, you may encounter a temporary hold on funds in your PayPal account, relating to a transaction from long ago.

How will PayPal let me know a chargeback has been filed against me?

The buyer's credit card company will notify PayPal.
We will immediately email you (the seller).
You can then log in to your PayPal account and go to the Resolution Center to monitor the status of the case, and potentially provide information to help resolve the matter. PayPal may also help you fight against the buyer's credit card company.
Certain laws and credit card issuer policies allow buyers to file chargebacks weeks or months after the original transaction took place. If a buyer waits and files later, you may encounter a temporary hold on funds in your PayPal account, relating to a transaction from long ago.

What happens to my funds when a chargeback is filed against me?

A temporary hold is placed on the funds in question until the matter has been resolved. This means you cannot withdraw or spend these funds until the dispute has come to an end.

If the dispute is found in your favor, the hold will be immediately released, and you'll have full access to your funds.

If the dispute is not found in your favor, the funds will be removed from your account and credited back to the buyer.

Please note - it may take your buyer's credit card company up to 75 days to resolve a chargeback and come to a final decision.

Can receiving a chargeback impact my eBay feedback?

Not directly, as the chargeback system is provided by third-party credit card companies, and is completely independent from eBay feedback. However, a buyer is free to provide feedback at any time - and if they've had a bad experience, they might have something to say about it.

What information should I provide to increase my chances of winning a chargeback dispute?

Proof of delivery, such as postage or online tracking numbers.
Copies of the original item or auction description, including photos.
Proof that the buyer was already refunded.
Proof that the buyer was given a replacement product.
Any buyer correspondence or feedback.
Any agreements signed or accepted by the buyer at the time of purchase.
Any return policy information that was communicated to the buyer.
If a PayPal dispute or a PayPal claim is decided in my favor, will I be covered against any related subsequent chargebacks?

PayPal may protect you against any future claim, chargeback, or bank reversal the buyer files in relation to that particular transaction. To have protection, you must honor the agreements you made with the buyer during the dispute resolution process. But we won't be able to offer protection if the claim has not been resolved by the time the chargeback is received.

Does PayPal dispute every chargeback with the buyer’s credit card company?

PayPal will generally help you fight against unwarranted chargebacks, but we also reserve the right not to dispute every chargeback - especially when a dispute is unlikely to be successful.

Where can I get more information about chargebacks?

Check out the PayPal Chargeback Guide for a closer look.
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Old 07-17-2015, 09:33 PM #16
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Default Re: Another Scam - Be Aware

His name should be outed here with other scammers and idiots to serve as a warning that u cant do that shit and get away with it and hide!, thats just no excuse to do that, he knew exactly what he was doing, he ripped u off and nothing else really sad its that easy get money back just like that since he lied.

One thing i dont understand, if he told them half year after he was supposed to buy them that he didnt, how can they believe him ? nobody does a claim so many months after that... hes full of shit!

And do u have your credit card linked to your paypal, was that how they charged money back to him or ? u should never have any card or funds in your acc u should always send them to your bank account.
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Last edited by mortuus; 07-17-2015 at 09:37 PM.
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