High Voltage Powersupply Info

At 10 ma some people die. You can't say that if you give me a 10 ma power supply at lets say.. 50 kv. I can't kill you :3

And the 6 meters arc is WHEN TUNED TO RESONANCE. A double mot stack when tuned in a fine way to resonance can give a meter and a half arcs. and am not talking about horizontal.. Am talking about vertical.

Cyparagon said:

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True, actually. What you are forgetting is that voltages above 30V can be conducted through the skin given the correct circumstances.
Be my guest and touch a fully charged 50V 10,000uF capacitor with a touch of moisture on your skin. It'll be the last time you do it...
Read below. Voltage is only part of the story.

Electric Shock | C21 Physics Teaching for the 21st Century

The link is from the University of British Columbia Health Physics dpt.
It explains more or less the same thing as the previous link.
Obviously, there is great misconception about how much damage can be done with lower voltages.

With the projects or devices that were originally posted by our junior member, someone building them
could really hurt themselves. A Flyback driver such as a ZVS can deliver 100's of Watts worth of output. Record is over 1Kw I believe.
That would be more than enough to cause a SEVERE burn.

Anyways.
Right we don't want John Rambo paying a visit to the forum.
Dead members.... comment.

1kW into an arc, maybe. You won't get 1kW into a person.

Wait a minute - you actually believe "75 volts are just as lethal as 750 volts"? I thought it was a part you just missed. I've lost respect for you, sir. You are a fool.

30V... 50V... 75V... it doesn't really matter. None of these voltages will develop enough current to kill someone. The capacitor, maybe, because it will instantly discharge everything it's got in a rather short amount of time.

The training I recieved from the military stated that a person's natural resistance is somewhere around 1M ohms. The lethal limit is typically 1A in 1 second, according to what I absorbed. Now, a person's resistance to electric current varies, according to body composition, how tired you are, sweaty, soaking wet, emotionally unstable, etc., so calculating for 1A is different for different people. Right now I'm 1.6M ohms, according to Mr Fluke.

Anyways, @ 75V, with ohms law:

75V / 1M = 0.075 A, or 75mA, which is hardly lethal.

750V / 1M = 0.750 A, or 750mA, which under adverse circumstances could be.

There's the time aspect, in which if 750mA was not lethal to you initially, it could be over several seconds or longer. There's also intrance/exit wounds from arcing, etc, but I don't think any of this would be a concern at the voltages we're talking about here.

The main concern here would be stored potential in a coil or capacitor. Now that stuff hurts! (personal experience)

Just FYI 75v through 1MΩ gives you 0.075mA or 75μA and 750μA respectively for 750v (0.75mA)

@

MarioMaster said:

Just FYI 75v through 1MΩ gives you 0.075mA or 75μA and 750μA respectively for 750v (0.75mA)

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Assuming your body is dry. Not everyone carries 1Mohm of resistance. A lot of times it can be around 500Ohm or less.
A little moisture combined with sweat (sweat being very conductive at - 40-25Ohms) ... that resistance changes considerably. Yes, 75V *could* cause a problem in that case.
For the average person, you'd be quite right assuming 1000Ohms which is considered for dry skin contact ONLY.
The Electric Shock Questions

Cyparagon said:

1kW into an arc, maybe. You won't get 1kW into a person.

Cyparagon Wait a minute - you actually believe "75 volts are just as lethal as 750 volts"? I thought it was a part you just missed. I've lost respect for you, sir. You are a fool.

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Wait a minute, do a little reading and you'll see that with enough current
ie) lower resistance the entire situation changes.
75V *can* do just as much damage as 750V.
That is what author of the link I gave you was inferring.
No I am not a fool. Keep the post professional please. :tsk:
See below.
http://van.physics.illinois.edu/qa/listing.php?id=6793

http://www.tubelab.com/Safety.htm
The person from this site is a master tube audio designer/repair person.
Large electrolytic capacitors are often used to smooth out the power supply.
They can pack an amazing amount of Amps momentarily.

Btw, who was talking about 6meter long arcs? what does this have to do with
anything...

Spectre Gadget said:

Right now I'm 1.6M ohms, according to Mr Fluke.

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Measuring body resistance with a plain ol DMM isn't particularly reliable, as it also has a slight capacitance and voltage potential itself. Most consumer DMM's rely on a known voltage passing through the resistor to determine it's resistance, the voltage potential and capacitance of the human body renders these readings fairly useless.

Things is right, the ohmmeter gets fooled because our body acts as a capacitor and uses the voltage out from the ohmmeter to charge up

Btw. The record for the zvs driver. is 2.2kilo watts. I wish i had that . Btw. i just finished my mini tesla coil

MarioMaster said:

Just FYI 75v through 1MΩ gives you 0.075mA or 75μA and 750μA respectively for 750v (0.75mA)

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OOPS! Yeah, you're right... how embarrasing! Back to elementary math for me!!!

Spectre Gadget said:

OOPS! Yeah, you're right... how embarrasing! Back to elementary math for me!!!

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Seriously dude. Your the worst ever. YOU STOLE MY CAT AND PUT HER PICTURE ON YOUR PROFILE

Seoul_lasers said:

75V *can* do just as much damage as 750V.

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A spoon CAN do just as much damage as a rocket-propelled chainsaw.
Does that mean a spoon is just as dangerous as a rocket-propelled chainsaw?

Cyparagon said:

A spoon CAN do just as much damage as a rocket-propelled chainsaw.
Does that mean a spoon is just as dangerous as a rocket-propelled chainsaw?

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:crackup: :crackup::crackup:No...

You were assuming that everyone has the same resistance, which is simply not true. Did you read the links I posted? Pretty clear to me.
Resistance can be as low as several 100 ohms on the surface... add AC
to the equation and you increase the Hazard of a shock.
30Vac RMS in every health physics publication indicates this is the start
of where shock hazards occur.
Anyways.

One thing that caught me out by surprise while messing with a sealed Jacobs ladder, was the accumulation of this nasty looking brown gas in the enclosure after running it for a while. Lucky for me I decided to take it outside and let it vent, as later I found it was nitrogen dioxide! More risks to playing with HV than just electrocution and ozone!

Yeah i feel a slight shock when i touch the terminals of my 36 volts ac transformer.. When i rectifed it. i got about 50 volts.
Can't wait to put that on the zvs.. Btw my blown up zvs.. i got the mosfets. And tommrow i get the resistor and teh diode hell yea :3..

Also what is that nitrogen thing??
Btw i always smell ozone when i am arcing. its like. normal to me but just dont use metal electrodes. rust is a friend :3

Things said:

One thing that caught me out by surprise while messing with a sealed Jacobs ladder, was the accumulation of this nasty looking brown gas in the enclosure after running it for a while. Lucky for me I decided to take it outside and let it vent, as later I found it was nitrogen dioxide! More risks to playing with HV than just electrocution and ozone!

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Indeed.
btw, Actually there is a wonderful chemistry tutorial on how to make
20-30% Nitric acid via a high voltage arc. The nitrogen dioxide gets pumped into a beaker containing a small amount of water over the course of 12hrs or so the liquid takes on a viscous pale yellow fluid. white fuming Nitric Acid.
:eg:
It's a horribly inefficient way of making Nitric Acid...
Actually interesting experiment for chemistry class to show effects of air pollution on rain acidity. :tinfoil: