WTF is with PL?

yobresal · Jun 23, 2010

I used to like going to PL to learn about RGB laser scanners, companies, modulating laser, and all kinds of useful information. I have always followed the rules there. Recently though I had a for sale thread of some 445nm diodes and many of the members there bought them all up. I also received a message from one of the members telling me that it would be a good idea for me to remove the sales thread. Curious as to why he would say that I posted in my own sales thread asking for information from anyone who might know about a possible rule regualtating the sale of 445nm diodes on PL. Well the thread was deleted today without response. I thought that was weird. I read through the rules of the forum again to make sure I didn't miss anything. I then posted a thread in the suggestions box titled "post all the rules" the thread simply state that it would be wise to post all the rules of the forum. Including the unwritten rule that 445nm diodes are not to be sold on PL. The response from the moderator was an instant 1 week BAN! What the hell is going on with them that things have gotten to the point of banning anyone who asks for information about about a secret rule. Anyway I am glad I call LPF my home where the rules are written for everyone to see and not hidden traps for people to fall into.

ElektroFreak · Jun 23, 2010

Amen to that brotha.. there are some folks there with pretty high opinions of themselves. The comparatively few people there riding on thier high horses are a solid third of the reason why I remain there.. Those specific people need a thorn in their side.

There was an *alleged* legal scare there for a brief instant (very funny to me that the threat was only directed at PL, when this forum has a great many more members and lurkers). Frankly, I'm not 100% sure that there ever was any real threat. What I DO know is that certain members there have decided (in their unlimited greatness) to take it upon themselves to try to block certain people that they decide "aren't worthy" of possessing these diodes from being able to get them. They claim it's because these diodes present an "unacceptable threat" to the safety of the general public. Always the conspiracy theorist, I believe that it has more to do with the threat that cheap blue presents to their livelihood. I suspect that you have been a casualty of these actions. I also suspect that PL might lose some members because of this in the long run, especially if the censorship continues into other aspects of the forum. Once censorship has started, how do you determine where it stops? It seems like certain influential members there are trying to make sure that the laser hobby is run by their rules..

Fortunately for all, some of us already know more than they would like... and if it comes down to it I'll stop at nothing to ensure that the information that they want to keep hidden remains very, very public. Anyone who wishes to silence me is more than welcome to give their best effort.

DjHeadie · Jun 23, 2010

Alot of the 445nm related thread were deleted for now reason one day, including one i was avidly following by a local slicklasers.

then came back

mysterious.

yobresal · Jun 23, 2010

Thanks Olivia, You are probably right, If I had followed the goings on and read the deleted threads I might know more about what is going on internally with PL. I couldn't find them though. Maybe it was because they were deleted. And if I happened to be online while someone was talking about it in the IRC chat then I may have known that way too. I am an active member there but I admit I have not read every word that has been typed there about 445nm. Especially those that are no longer available to read. I just think it is messed up to ban someone for not knowing about a rule that doesn't exist. If the information was posted anywhere on PL at the time I started that thread I would have gladly complied.

ElektroFreak · Jun 23, 2010

Olivia said:
@ELECTRO - "Always the conspiracy theorist" ...i think your way over the top there ... the 445nm forums back , sharing information , but just with sales of diodes missing ? your looking for conspiracies where there aint none IMHO ! youand laserboy james should set up a club !

if you say so

conspiracies never exist, now do they?

I do listen very closely to PLs IRC.. but yet I still believe what I believe.

Everyone here is aware of how shitty the actions of the Chinese pointer manufacturers are, AND the risk they represent.. but after many lengthy conversations with some of these few "influential" people from PL (and NO I won't name names in case I'm wrong, I certainly could be... and Admin is not one of them) it SEEMS like they are milking this shit for all it's worth, trying to stifle it as much as possible, even in an environment where there is practically no interest in these pointers.. I question their motives, myself, but I am pretty cynical. In the time that I've been at PL it is far from the first time I've seen things that make me raise an eyebrow. How long am I to be expected to see actions that are questionably founded and just shrug it off? Admin may have simply found the legal basis to return the 445nm section to use..

Yobresal is correct in stating that ALL rules that give grounds for banning should be clearly posted for all to see. It's BS to expect people to keep up with everything that goes on on a forum.

yobresal · Jun 23, 2010

Well not only did they delete the thread that was selling 445nm diodes, they also deleted the thread which asked them to post the rule banning the sale of 445nm on their thread. IMHO this is more than just a conspiracy theory. This is a conspiracy. PL might want to be careful walking down that slipery slope.

Meatball · Jun 24, 2010

I too, noticed that some of the members there are sometimes outright hostile towards LPF and any who decide to tread here as a member. As a hobby, lasers are not always widely accepted by even those in the laser profession..

Eidetic · Jun 24, 2010

yobresal said:
.... I just think it is messed up to ban someone for not knowing about a rule that doesn't exist. If the information was posted anywhere on PL at the time I started that thread I would have gladly complied.

People have been immediately banned from here for violating the unwritten rule of making "drug references", or disagreeing with the "veterans". This forum has been so ban-happy that "ban polls" are no longer tolerated. It's never nice having the door slammed in your face, especially for trivial or unjust reasons. PL is in the middle of turbulence over this whole 445nm laser issue the past few weeks. LPF has a very long history of "drum head trial" bannings. I don't like any of them, on either forum. It's just too easy to slam the door in the face of someone you're not standing right in front of. It's part of the big downside of internet based communication.

ElektroFreak · Jun 24, 2010

^That is true.. it would be great if BOTH forums were a lot more consistent with their rules and disciplinary procedures. Yobresal has always been a great member of both forums, so I think it's a total crock that he was temp banned because he hadn't been following each twist and turn of the PL "turbulence" as you call it. Hopefully some of PL's "influential" members will get over their control complexes and stop trying to stifle responsible hobbyists ability to use these diodes through censorship and by encouraging corporate legal action. Instead the main focus should be on educating people. That's the only proper course of action here.

Eidetic · Jun 24, 2010

Every time anyone "points" a laser into the sky, they're doing a "laser light show". Those at PL have fought long and hard against those doing that irresponsibly, before laser pointers were popularized by the introduction of DPSS green around '95. The professionals' battle with "lightsaber wavers" has been going since then. You have to understand, they have a vested financial interest. Those here, in general, don't. They may have overreacted in this situation, but this new laser is a game-changer (just like the green pointers of the mid '90s), and their reaction (though seemingly unfair) is understandable in my opinion.

jander6442 · Jun 24, 2010

I think it's what is going on behind the sences that is the true danger. More often than not the PMs and other none posted rederic is the most dangerous.

There is definatly a group going around "walling" up knowleged and freedom of that knowleged. Can't put my finger on it.

Off topic I'm still looking for a macro pic of the casio 445 diode... anyone?

nikokapo · Jun 24, 2010

yobresal said:
I used to like going to PL to learn about RGB laser scanners, companies, modulating laser, and all kinds of useful information. I have always followed the rules there. Recently though I had a for sale thread of some 445nm diodes and many of the members there bought them all up. I also received a message from one of the members telling me that it would be a good idea for me to remove the sales thread. Curious as to why he would say that I posted in my own sales thread asking for information from anyone who might know about a possible rule regualtating the sale of 445nm diodes on PL. Well the thread was deleted today without response. I thought that was weird. I read through the rules of the forum again to make sure I didn't miss anything. I then posted a thread in the suggestions box titled "post all the rules" the thread simply state that it would be wise to post all the rules of the forum. Including the unwritten rule that 445nm diodes are not to be sold on PL. The response from the moderator was an instant 1 week BAN! What the hell is going on with them that things have gotten to the point of banning anyone who asks for information about about a secret rule. Anyway I am glad I call LPF my home where the rules are written for everyone to see and not hidden traps for people to fall into.

This is called Paranoia and it's been around us for weeks now

liteglow · Jun 24, 2010

I have some stuff to fill in here..
But first, it`s funny that PL was created because the users was banned from CPF !
And the reason: We did post images of lasers pointing up in the skies !

If you do some searching at PL you will find many pictures of lasers pointing up in the sky.

But you should remember that many (some) users at PL is (ehm.. older) have a longer lifetime experience with lasers.
And many users KNOW that you dont point a laser into an airplane.
But the users there (as myself) also know that it`s beautiful to see a laser in the clouds.

Dont forget that we ALL love lasers

But you have to admit that in the last years there have been many many problems with "kids" playing with the life of other humans while pointing at aircraft, cars, boats...

And that is BAD news for the laser industry (both show and pointer lovers) !

I think that because of the large usergroup of "important" users on PL,
they want to take high precaution against being recognized as a group of "1watt blue dangerous stupid kids" !
On PL there is members of Pangolin, Laserwave, Viasho, CNI and many other companys that dont want to have theyr name in the same article as "Kid was blind because of a laser" !!

I dont say that the ppl here at Pointer Forum is kids that dont know the rules about a laser..
But do the media know that??

Sure the guys at PL forum burn stuff and have crazy fun with their 1-6WATTs lasers sometimes !
But we dont share that on YouTube

We dont want the kids to think that i`s OK to pop ballons and point lasers into the sky.
Because THAT is not why we have lasers !!

About being banned 1 Week of no reason, that is just bad move from Admin (if there not is any background/history that we dont know about) !

yobresal · Jun 24, 2010

Eidetic said:
Every time anyone "points" a laser into the sky, they're doing a "laser light show". Those at PL have fought long and hard against those doing that irresponsibly, before laser pointers were popularized by the introduction of DPSS green around '95. The professionals' battle with "lightsaber wavers" has been going since then. You have to understand, they have a vested financial interest. Those here, in general, don't. They may have overreacted in this situation, but this new laser is a game-changer (just like the green pointers of the mid '90s), and their reaction (though seemingly unfair) is understandable in my opinion.

This was not a battle over pointers VS projectors. They are banning the 445nm diodes themselves from being sold on PL. (that is unless you are an old vet...in which case you can start a WTB or WTT thread for the diode and no one will bat an eye) Who is to say how the diode will be used. Their reaction is understandable yes but perhaps misdirected. If it is their livelyhood they are worried about then promoting laser bans might not be the best of ideas. How many articles have we all read about some idiot with a projector giving crowds of people eye damage. They are the ones who are aiming HIGH powered lasers into crowds of people. All it is going to take is some wack job with a MULTI-WATT laserscope blinding a room full of people and the use of lasers for entertainment purposes is going to banned (including pointers) They live in a glass house.

pullbangdead · Jun 24, 2010

liteglow said:
On PL there is members of Pangolin, Laserwave, Viasho, CNI and many other companys that dont want to have theyr name in the same article as "Kid was blind because of a laser" !!

This is a salient point. I enjoy posting here because it's more active and there's more banter, and because I like and post most about laser diodes, and barely anything about other types of lasers. But my career, at this point, is based on laser diodes, and I do find myself more and more self-censoring anything that could be used to identify me in real life. I find myself trying to obscure more and more anything that might reveal my real name or exact associations. The cat's already out of the bag if you search hard enough, I think, but still, I completely understand this feeling for people whose lives and careers are lasers, and to whom it is more than just a fun hobby.

jander6442 · Jun 24, 2010

liteglow said:
I have some stuff to fill in here..
But first, it`s funny that PL was created because the users was banned from CPF !
And the reason: We did post images of lasers pointing up in the skies !

If you do some searching at PL you will find many pictures of lasers pointing up in the sky.

But you should remember that many (some) users at PL is (ehm.. older) have a longer lifetime experience with lasers.
And many users KNOW that you dont point a laser into an airplane.
But the users there (as myself) also know that it`s beautiful to see a laser in the clouds.

Dont forget that we ALL love lasers
But you have to admit that in the last years there have been many many problems with "kids" playing with the life of other humans while pointing at aircraft, cars, boats...

And that is BAD news for the laser industry (both show and pointer lovers) !

I think that because of the large usergroup of "important" users on PL,
they want to take high precaution against being recognized as a group of "1watt blue dangerous stupid kids" !
On PL there is members of Pangolin, Laserwave, Viasho, CNI and many other companys that dont want to have theyr name in the same article as "Kid was blind because of a laser" !!

I dont say that the ppl here at Pointer Forum is kids that dont know the rules about a laser..
But do the media know that??

Sure the guys at PL forum burn stuff and have crazy fun with their 1-6WATTs lasers sometimes !
But we dont share that on YouTube
We dont want the kids to think that i`s OK to pop ballons and point lasers into the sky.
Because THAT is not why we have lasers !!

About being banned 1 Week of no reason, that is just bad move from Admin (if there not is any background/history that we dont know about) !

These same companies that you've pointed out still sell and advertise on this site:wtf:

WTF is with PL?

yobresal

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ElektroFreak

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DjHeadie

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ElektroFreak

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