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Old 08-24-2016, 12:39 AM #401
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

That's a very good picture!

I thought these things were fairly well known really as pilots see them too. Thinking of that you'd see them as an airplane passenger too and i never have, so they can't be super common.

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Yeah, we'd also need to be able to manage a planet's temperature pretty well too. Venus being located at 0.72AU to the Sun means it will get quite a bit warmer and as the years go by and may become inhabitable unless we can properly cool it. In terms of short term Venus may be a good idea, but long term Mars would make more sense as it won't get "eaten" by our parent star
I wouldn't worry too much about that whole sun blowing up thing as it's pretty long away, and even if you survived the following lack of solar output would be a huge problem, if you didn't get burned off mars first.

It will become a white dwarf radiating off it's energy and slowly going dark, so that'd probably be the end of any life in the solar system, regardless what body it's on.


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Old 08-26-2016, 02:51 AM #402
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

Cool video here



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Old 08-27-2016, 12:52 AM #403
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

He makes pretty good videos

Leaving before 2050 will not happen though, even if we see it coming today. One thing we could try is building a generational space station which may or may not work. If it does it cannot travel outside the solar system though as it would need sunlight for power, so setting course for another star would mean doom in the dark space between them.

On such a small closed system you'd be likely to eventually run out of -something- vital though, and with no means to re-supply that'd be the end of that ordeal.

Surviving in space is not like surviving in the woods. If you want to build campfire the problem is not lack of matches, but lack of anything combustible, and lack of oxygen to combust it in. Oh, and those campfires don't even work without a decent amount of gravity, so you couldn't even make one inside the ISS if you were isane enough to attempt it
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Old 09-23-2016, 04:05 AM #404
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

Hello folks,

I wanted to bring back this thread to talk about a subject I would like to know what everyone's thoughts are. I was watching a regular news channel I watch on YouTube & one subject was AI and the fact that one day us humans may be able to have 100% leisure time, whilst robots do all the work for us. Do you think this is possible? Robots work for us, but we get to relax & collect the money made from that day except we didn't do anything?

This is a very general overview but it would be a sweet situation!

-Alex
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Old 09-23-2016, 04:21 AM #405
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

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Hello folks,

I wanted to bring back this thread to talk about a subject I would like to know what everyone's thoughts are. I was watching a regular news channel I watch on YouTube & one subject was AI and the fact that one day us humans may be able to have 100% leisure time, whilst robots do all the work for us. Do you think this is possible? Robots work for us, but we get to relax & collect the money made from that day except we didn't do anything?

This is a very general overview but it would be a sweet situation!

-Alex
We watch it happen every time a job is automated.

We will know they are getting close to this when automated jobs fully automate maintenance.

I suspect we will always need people to troubleshoot the robots.

Also thanks to "traditionalists" (every one from Amish to Organic farmers to people who want everything done by hand) the chance that we will forget how to live without the bots is minimal.
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Old 09-25-2016, 02:02 AM #406
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

It depends on how far automation will go, and if money will even be a factor in that. We could become so productive that an hour of work a month maintaining the automation could provide for enough food, dwelling, entertainment etc.

One risk is that we start to fail to fully understand technology we use.

For example, in the 1970s we had cpu's (say 4004 to 8080) with under 10.000 transistors on them, and they were mostly hand-designed by humans and there were some people around that actually knew what each individual transistor on there did. On a modern computer that number is over a billion for the cpu alone, though much of that is L1 cache and such.

I think you'd have a hard time to find an individual that fully understands, in reproducable detail, how something like a smartphone works, all the way from the silicon wafer to the processor architecture and the software running on that. You may find a team that collectively does, but not a single person. As stuff gets more complex that problem gets worse, and once we take stuff for granted it gets much worse.

Wether or not we should want such a future is a matter for debate though: it has great potential benefits and risks. A risk could be something sci-fi like the technology becomes so smart it has no use for humans any longer and simply stops caring for them or even eleminates them, but also simply technology failing with noone around having the slightest clue on how to fix it.

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Old 09-25-2016, 02:20 AM #407
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

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It depends on how far automation will go, and if money will even be a factor in that. We could become so productive that an hour of work a month maintaining the automation could provide for enough food, dwelling, entertainment etc.

One risk is that we start to fail to fully understand technology we use.

For example, in the 1970s we had cpu's (say 4004 to 8080) with under 10.000 transistors on them, and they were mostly hand-designed by humans and there were some people around that actually knew what each individual transistor on there did. On a modern computer that number is over a billion for the cpu alone, though much of that is L1 cache and such.

I think you'd have a hard time to find an individual that fully understands, in reproducable detail, how something like a smartphone works, all the way from the silicon wafer to the processor architecture and the software running on that. You may find a team that collectively does, but not a single person. As stuff gets more complex that problem gets worse, and once we take stuff for granted it gets much worse.

Wether or not we should want such a future is a matter for debate though: it has great potential benefits and risks. A risk could be something sci-fi like the technology becomes so smart it has no use for humans any longer and simply stops caring for them or even eleminates them, but also simply technology failing with noone around having the slightest clue on how to fix it.
Definitely, such interesting topics!

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Old 09-25-2016, 02:32 AM #408
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

Frightening and exciting at the same time i suppose.

Perhaps we shoud literally carve something in stone on the history of technology just in case it fails us at some point and the people left over need to rebuild.

Even something very trivial like smelting iron from ore is quite difficult with rudimentary means if you have no idea on how tho go about it, despite being possible with very primitive technology.

Making a how-to-restart-101 guide seems silly, but it could be useful at some point, and if not entertain historians of the future for a long time
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Old 09-25-2016, 06:45 AM #409
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

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Frightening and exciting at the same time i suppose.

Perhaps we shoud literally carve something in stone on the history of technology just in case it fails us at some point and the people left over need to rebuild.

Even something very trivial like smelting iron from ore is quite difficult with rudimentary means if you have no idea on how tho go about it, despite being possible with very primitive technology.

Making a how-to-restart-101 guide seems silly, but it could be useful at some point, and if not entertain historians of the future for a long time
Haha, it would be pretty funny indeed to review what we've written in case of self-destruction! Congrats on 1,000 posts by the way

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Old 09-25-2016, 12:08 PM #410
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

On top of missing PI and not knowing what has happened to him, he was the one who kept us updated about the Juno spacecraft and it safely making it to Jupiter.
I think October was the time line of some very nice close pic's.
Anybody have any info on this?
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Old 09-25-2016, 01:33 PM #411
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hap View Post
Hello folks,

I wanted to bring back this thread to talk about a subject I would like to know what everyone's thoughts are. I was watching a regular news channel I watch on YouTube & one subject was AI and the fact that one day us humans may be able to have 100% leisure time, whilst robots do all the work for us. Do you think this is possible? Robots work for us, but we get to relax & collect the money made from that day except we didn't do anything?

This is a very general overview but it would be a sweet situation!

-Alex
I can see this one day being a reality. I fear though technology for killing each other is moving faster than technology for helping each other.
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Old 09-25-2016, 02:27 PM #412
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

If the automation we see today is any indication, automation will sap away jobs, but will not change society's view that people should occupy most of their time with work. Labor is a way of keeping people busy and unable to contemplate things such as rebelling or demanding changes to the status quo. Until there is a suitable distraction created to occupy peoples' time, there will always be an emphasis on work and labor, even if there are no jobs to be had.
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Old 09-26-2016, 02:06 AM #413
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

I think we've been doing a great job at creating distractions as well. Thinks like facebook, netflix or silly video websites and such give people a larger choice of enterntainment than was ever available before.

People are not that likely to go war if they are safe and comfortable, and even less likely if entertained continously.

I suppose that this may lead to a situation where what you do for a living is no longer a key defining characteristic. If you ask people 'what they are' the answer will often be something like 'a 30 year old programmer from san fransisco'.

Currently that all is very relevant information since long-range rapid point to point transportation is not really available, socio-economic status is important, and lifespan is quite limited.

These are all things that could be overcome by technology over time though.

There is the off chance that we will use technology to wage war. There are plenty of examples of this, most notably drones that allow technological superior states to engage in overseas wars with little risk to their own soldiers. One thing about these wars is that they are already very assymetric to begin with: There is no war between say the US and Syria. If there was a full out war that'd last a day or two, or only a few hours if nuclear weapons were used.

The mutually assured destruction status-quo between nato and russia is still there, and no amount of automating systems will change that. There will still be dudes available to press launch buttons if need be
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Old 09-26-2016, 04:05 AM #414
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

One thing that is great in our modern times is the ability to self educate.

I, for example, am working on obtaining better quality fabry-perot interferometer than NASA uses for it's "Warp Field Interferometer" based on pictures/articles NASA has posted online about it's own equipment. (Ground up less than 10K worth of equipment for building a "Warp Field Interferometer")

I am also studying the theory and mechanics of the "EmDrive" in particular the theory that it is a Alcubierre Drive and warps space/gravity AND that since light is in the EM spectra like microwaves that an optical version of the EmDrive should work.

The only real evidence I have that I'm not completely wasting my time is that LIGO (a massive 808nm fabry-perot interferometer) measured the gravity waves produced by two black holes combining. So if the EmDrive does have a "Warp" effect than my "Warp Field Interferometer" should indeed detect it.

If there was a collage class that taught this material I would be taking it. Apparently I am well beyond what is taught in any school...
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Old 09-27-2016, 08:28 PM #415
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0qo78R_yYFA

Video released before the SpaceX Mars Architecture Announcement - interesting!

Edit: Reddit live thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/spacex/comm..._architecture/

Edit 2: Jesus Christ, some of those questions at the Q&A were utterly dreadful. People asking dumb questions and trying to plug their own shit.
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Last edited by diachi; 09-27-2016 at 09:38 PM.
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Old 09-28-2016, 04:21 AM #416
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Default Re: Space Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by diachi View Post
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0qo78R_yYFA

Video released before the SpaceX Mars Architecture Announcement - interesting!

Edit: Reddit live thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/spacex/comm..._architecture/

Edit 2: Jesus Christ, some of those questions at the Q&A were utterly dreadful. People asking dumb questions and trying to plug their own shit.
While I think it's cool that SpaceX came out with this video and "plan", I honestly find it very disappointing. Tons of hype with not much progress at all. NASA + Lockheed are still MUCH closer to a manned interplanetary spacecraft, but people are freaking out as if SpaceX is going to start selling tickets next year.

Plus, the practicality of Elon Musk's Mars vision is still highly questionable in terms of overall feasibility. I guess it sounds great for the media. That Q&A was definitely atrocious though.

All that said, people don't care enough about space research right now, so a bit of hype may just be necessary even if it likely won't be fulfilled.
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