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Old 09-18-2015, 12:06 AM #5745
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

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Originally Posted by vortish View Post
you know it might be well for you to take your own advice..
That would be a first


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Old 09-18-2015, 08:23 AM #5746
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

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Originally Posted by TheDukeAnumber1 View Post
Reliable historical evidence of a historical event should not go ignored regardless of the title of the book.
.
Except that pretty much every Theologian, Christian and secular, all agree that the gospels authors are UNKNOWN and no originals have ever been found. Some were clearly written by numerous authors while the only Gospel who's author MAY be known is John. When did 2nd hand un-verified anonymous COPIES of ancient writings become evidence of what is known to be impossible? The greater the claim the greater the evidence must be to support such a claim. I think a man rising from the dead and ascending into another realm of existence is a bit more than ordinary wouldn't you? Seriously if ancient writings is such great evidence do you also accept that Mohamed ascended to heaven on a freaking Pegasus? Why not, it's meets your same exact criteria of evidence to support it?

So the title of the book isn't as discrediting as the fact that nobody know who wrote these supposed accounts Duke. You can look up a mass of inconvenient cited and reviewed sources if you care to but I doubt you do. Your minds made up why complicate things with actual facts.

Its pretty strange to me how few Christians know this or arrogantly feel they know more than expert theologians including those of their own faith regarding the Gospels. The Bible is a weak source of evidence for the resurrection but since its the only one I guess its the best apologists have to work with.

And for all those that continue to say how pointless and wrong it is to attack peoples beliefs I say that as long as ignorant hypocrites like certain county clerks in KY continue to force their beliefs into other peoples lives against federal law those beliefs are fair game. People such as her are terrified of loosing their long raining "Christian privilege" in this country but guess what, it's coming to an end. When equality is such a threat I think that really says a lot. The day faith based beliefs are no longer the cause so much suffering and negative effects on society and human progress is the day I and many would stop attacking these beliefs. As long as Christians continue to deny others their rights and pursuit of happiness and keep trying to force insane/crazy ideas such as a young earth and creationism into the science classroom you better stop complaining and be prepared to start defending your beliefs with things called observed reality and facts.
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Old 09-18-2015, 06:34 PM #5747
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyparagon View Post
Bad
adjective
2. not such as to be hoped for or desired; unpleasant or unwelcome.

Lowering of well-being is unpleasant or unwelcome. Why is that not obvious?
I'm not trying to be repetitive, I'm just trying to keep this focused. I'll stick with your earlier example.

"bombing an abortion clinic will objectively lower the well-being of your neighbors"

Strictly within your atheistic naturalistic worldview. If someone does this, they can believe, without contradiction, these two beliefs -

1. bombing an abortion clinic will objectively lower the well-being of your neighbors
2. lowering the well-being of your neighbors is not bad

Now what I'm trying to point out here is that when you say there is an objective component to your morality, you're mistaken. There is no objective morality within the atheistic naturalistic worldview. To prove this wrong you would have to show the 'bomber" OBJECTIVELY that "lowering the well-being of your neighbors is bad". There is no objective way for you to do this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyparagon View Post
Would you ever admit your interpretation was wrong?
I truly am after what is true Cyp, I recognize that I am a falliable human being and capable of error.



@ nwfreefly


This last post has several incorrect assumptions, a couple about be personally which upon reading are rather disappointing. Anyways, there is a sound and reasonable answer to the question about the gospel authors and how that pertains to their historical value.

Gospel Authorship?Who Cares? | Reasonable Faith
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Old 09-18-2015, 07:00 PM #5748
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

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Originally Posted by TheDukeAnumber1 View Post
@ nwfreefly[/B]

This last post has several incorrect assumptions, a couple about be personally which upon reading are rather disappointing. Anyways, there is a sound and reasonable answer to the question about the gospel authors and how that pertains to their historical value.

Gospel Authorship?Who Cares? | Reasonable Faith
Let me clarify as to not cause offense. When I wrote "some Christians arrogantly feel they know more than experts theologians" I was not implying you specifically unless the shoe fits. I was speaking about many others.
I apologize if it seemed I was calling you arrogant, not my intention at all but the other sentence that I can see probably felt like a dig I will have to stand by. In this thread you have and do ignore facts when they do not align with your personal held beliefs.

Keep in mind that all that is said here I leave here and encourage others to do the same if they enter the great debate. I disagree with most of what yourself, Aalskan and vortish for example write here and we have gone back and forth but I like all of them personally. In fact I have developed a very great friendship with Alaskan, supported Vortish in his times of need in various ways but we just do not agree on matters of the supernatural, a topic that often holds deep passion and importance to those CHOOSING to engage.
Don't take it to personally.
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Old 09-19-2015, 04:25 AM #5749
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Quote:
Originally Posted by vortish View Post
you know it might be well for you to take your own advice..
What advice? There was a definition and a question - no advice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by VisibleGreen View Post
That would be a first
I ignored the first jab, but it seems to be continuing. This is your first and last request: Knock off the ad hominem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDukeAnumber1 View Post
[Someone can believe] lowering the well-being of your neighbors is not bad
Sure. Let's see how well they function in society with this belief. I'd give him 3 days until incarceration.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDukeAnumber1 View Post
you would have to show the 'bomber" OBJECTIVELY that "lowering the well-being of your neighbors is bad".
Are you saying your bible can convince them of this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDukeAnumber1 View Post
I truly am after what is true Cyp, I recognize that I am a falliable human being and capable of error.
So what good is your "objective moral standard" If everyone reads it differently and follows the teachings differently - often to the point of completely opposite actions?
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Old 09-19-2015, 09:02 AM #5750
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

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I ignored the first jab, but it seems to be continuing. This is your first and last request: Knock off the ad hominem.
There's plenty more where that came from. I don't know what ad hominem means nor do I care to find out but keep talking, it's entertaining to me now.
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Old 09-19-2015, 09:22 AM #5751
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

I don't think some of us should even try to talk to each other, am not talking about everyone, only a few, our thinking can be so alien to each other. Don't ever assume that others think like you or can ever be convinced to see things your way. Some people can't even communicate with each other because each person will understand or interpret something differently, if you don't understand that, then it will lead to problems.



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Old 09-19-2015, 09:36 AM #5752
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pi R Squared View Post
I don't think some of us should even try to talk to each other, am not talking about everyone, only a few, our thinking can be so alien to each other. Don't ever assume that others think like you or can ever be convinced to see things your way. Some people can't even communicate with each other because each person will understand or interpret something differently, if you don't understand that, then it will lead to problems.



Alan
I agree. But some on here don't think that they are talking to real people or don't take it seriously so they keep doing it. Best thing to do is just shrug it off or have a chuckle at it.
This forum is saturated with it and nothing is going to change any time soon unfortunately.
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Old 09-19-2015, 04:07 PM #5753
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Quote:
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I don't know what ad hominem means nor do I care to find out but keep talking
So basically:

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Old 09-19-2015, 05:46 PM #5754
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

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So basically:

Did you link a youtube video? For some reason I can't see those on here.
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Old 09-19-2015, 10:15 PM #5755
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

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I apologize if it seemed I was calling you arrogant, not my intention at all but the other sentence that I can see probably felt like a dig I will have to stand by. In this thread you have and do ignore facts when they do not align with your personal held beliefs.
I appreciate the apology and always find it commendable to stand by your words. Although I completely disagree with that statement. I do not ignore facts for the sake of my beliefs.


Quote:
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Are you saying your bible can convince them of this?
Well that really depends on the "bomber" doesn't it. But my Bible can objectively show that it is bad, where your worldview cannot.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyparagon View Post
So what good is your "objective moral standard" If everyone reads it differently and follows the teachings differently - often to the point of completely opposite actions?
Again, the answers for this varies greatly depending on the circumstances.
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Old 09-20-2015, 07:55 PM #5756
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

This is sooooo rich, I just had to share it

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Each of these three rabbit holes go deep, ending up in the same place.

Useless troll fighting.
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Old 09-20-2015, 10:13 PM #5757
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This is sooooo rich, I just had to share it

Oh boy we got a live one! Took a quick look at work but I intend to watch the whole thing when I get home. This kind of stuff is just too priceless. Watching that video made me as cross eyed as the guy on it
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Old 09-20-2015, 10:40 PM #5758
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

LOL.... yea, he has the truth, lots and lots of it.
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Old 09-20-2015, 11:40 PM #5759
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

How does your subjective book objectively show anything?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDukeAnumber1 View Post

Well that really depends on the "bomber" doesn't it. But my Bible can objectively show that it is bad, where your worldview cannot.
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Old 09-21-2015, 02:22 AM #5760
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

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Originally Posted by T_Warne View Post
How does your subjective book objectively show anything?
You're going to have to go deeper and explain your premise for declaring a book that presents an objective moral framework is subjective. You're not making sense with this statement.

But perhaps from your perspective this does make sense, morals are subjective when you deny the truth in the Bible and hold to an atheist naturalistic worldview. Your subjective view of the Bible just furthers this point.
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[SIZE="1"]“It is impossible that any ill should happen to the man who is beloved of the Lord; the most crushing calamities can only shorten his journey and hasten him to his reward. Ill to him is no ill, but only good in a mysterious form. Losses enrich him, sickness is his medicine, reproach is his honour, death is his gain. No evil in the strict sense of the word can happen to him, for everything is overruled for good. Happy is he who is in such a case. He is secure where others are in peril, he lives where others die.”—Spurgeon

Last edited by TheDukeAnumber1; 09-21-2015 at 02:23 AM.
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