Old 12-18-2010, 05:24 AM #1841
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

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Originally Posted by daguin View Post
The original question was much more close to simply "If god?

I'm not "referring" to anything beyond what I have written. You do not need to try to figure out what my intentions are. I have been very much up front with them. The only "fact" you referred to in your statement above was that "you believe."

Read something not given to you by your church.

Or are you not strong enough in your belief to eat the meat?

Peace,
dave
The "meat" is there, (Its in my name) but I just want to have a straight answer to the question. It uses simple logic. "If" this, then "what"?

I'll read that book of yours if you send it to me. I'll send you my copy of Mere Christianity. CS Lewis is a little more "meat" than the majority of my congregation can handle per page lol.

I'll put down into more usable terms then.

"IF the God of the Bible (the one I believe in- the one that Dave does not) inspired scripture, would it be inerrant?"


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Last edited by Meatball; 12-18-2010 at 05:31 AM.
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Old 12-18-2010, 05:33 AM #1842
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

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Originally Posted by Meatball View Post
The "meat" is there, (Its in my name) but I just want to have a straight answer to the question. It uses simple logic. "If" this, then "what"?

I'll put down into more usable terms then.

"IF the God of the Bible (the one I believe in- the one that Dave does not) inspired scripture, would it be inerrant?"

Sorry. My biblical reference was apparently too subtle (1 Corinthians; Chapter 8). No matter. It was a personal challenge anyway.

Your "question" is a "loaded question." It places something up as fact that has not yet been proven as fact. I could just as easily ask, "If the person who wrote the translation of the bible that you are using as "The Word" was NOT inspired by god, would it be inerrant?"

The fact is that your text is NOT a "faithful" or even an "inclusive" translation of the original texts professed to be the "source."

Who decided which words were actually god's and who's were the ramblings of an insane doomsday cult?

Peace,
dave

**EDIT**
Responding to your edited post -- I have found that if a person is not even willing to spend $10 to find something out, then my "giving" it to them is pointless. Also, I have read Mere Christianity.
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Last edited by daguin; 12-18-2010 at 05:43 AM.
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Old 12-18-2010, 05:35 AM #1843
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

If GOD had inspired the bible it would be accurate, but the bible gets so many things wrong that you can only believe MAN wrote it. You have to ignore all of the errors to believe GOD had anything to do with it.
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Old 12-18-2010, 05:37 AM #1844
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Wrong? According to who? How do you know? What in the Bible is "wrong" to you?
ALL the errors? Can you give me one? And explain it in context for me?

Can't God have someone write something without errors?

EDIT: That detergent is starting to burn
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Old 12-18-2010, 05:41 AM #1845
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

inspired ≠ created. There are four possibilities I can think of.
1.Your god wrote the bible, and is a liar. It is errant.
2.Your god wrote the bible, and is not a liar. It is inerrant.
3.Your god inspired all the biblical texts, but the bible has been censored and modified so many times it is errant.
4.Your god does not exist, and your bible is errant.

Even without looking at the actual chances for these main possibilities (ie, 4 is around infinity times more likely than the others), there is still only one situation in which your bible could be inerrant. After original texts have been bastardized so many times, there's no way they can contain the exact same information.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Meatball View Post
Wrong? According to who? How do you know? What in the Bible is "wrong" to you?
ALL the errors? Can you give me one? And explain it in context for me?

Can't God have someone write something without errors?

EDIT: That detergent is starting to burn
Are you f#cking serious? We've been over this like a million times! I'm done posting links or references about this, every time I do someone whines about how one of them is off-context or something. We've proven, beyond a doubt, that the bible is full to the brim with errors and bullshit, and I'm not sure how you can possibly sit there and say otherwise.

Last edited by ossumguywill; 12-18-2010 at 05:45 AM.
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Old 12-18-2010, 05:48 AM #1846
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Meatball I thought We were having an impassioned debate on this thread only! No need to carry it over to other threads. If you're having a problem with this I'll leave you to it, and I'll seek my fun and discussions elsewhere.

Peace Out.
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Old 12-18-2010, 05:53 AM #1847
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Meatball View Post
Wrong? According to who? How do you know? What in the Bible is "wrong" to you?
ALL the errors? Can you give me one? And explain it in context for me?

Can't God have someone write something without errors?

EDIT: That detergent is starting to burn
Religious scholars admit the errors and try to find the reason for them. Zealots do not admit that errors exist.

If he was a god, he most assuredly could have had someone write something without errors.

Unfortunately, the bible is not without errors.

Therefore either he is not god or he chose to intentionally screw with us

That ain't benevolence, mate

Peace,
dave
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Old 12-18-2010, 06:12 AM #1848
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

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he chose to intentionally screw with us
I knew T_J was evidence of God!

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Old 12-18-2010, 06:16 AM #1849
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

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I knew T_J was evidence of God!

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You owe me a new keyboard

Peace,
dave
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Old 12-18-2010, 08:12 AM #1850
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Quote:
Originally Posted by daguin View Post
..... If he was a god, he most assuredly could have had someone write something without errors.
Unfortunately, the bible is not without errors.
Therefore either he is not god or he chose to intentionally screw with us
.....
This reminds me one discussion i've seenyears ago between a geologist and a priest, in one of these meetings they keep here and there ..... the priest was insisting that the books had to be taken literally, so the geologist asked him "then, why we find items from millions years old, if the book says that the universe was created 2000 years ago ?" ..... and the priest, perfectly seriously, replied "cause, ofcourse, those items was created intentionally from God with wrong age indexers, for test your faith: if you trust the books regardless the false proofs that your science gives you, this means that you are a man of faith, if instead you trust your false proofs over the words of God, this means that you are an infidel".

Yeah, perfectly logic, right ? ..... i needed almost 2 minutes for stop to laugh, when i've heard this, and the priest was not exactly happy, about me, that time .....



EDIT: twhite828 : ROTFLMAO ! ..... i understood it only now (still half asleepd, need some caffeine flebo )
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Old 12-18-2010, 11:46 AM #1851
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Quote:
Originally Posted by HIMNL9 View Post
"then, why we find items from millions years old, if the book says that the universe was created 2000 years ago ?" ..... and the priest, perfectly seriously, replied "cause, ofcourse, those items was created intentionally from God with wrong age indexers, for test your faith: if you trust the books regardless the false proofs that your science gives you, this means that you are a man of faith, if instead you trust your false proofs over the words of God, this means that you are an infidel".
Creationists, the people who lobby (succesfully in some US states)
for teaching little children in school that Darwin's theory
is false
, and god created the earth a few thousand years ago,
use this "argument" all time as their defense against dinosaur bones and such.



That T_J joke is gold.

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Old 12-18-2010, 03:56 PM #1852
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

"If god inspired the bible, would it be inerrant?" You mean like those movies that were "inspired by a true story"?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HIMNL9 View Post
This reminds me one discussion i've seenyears ago between a geologist and a priest...
Ah, that's a classic

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Old 12-19-2010, 05:32 AM #1853
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Quote:
Originally Posted by daguin View Post
Religious scholars admit the errors and try to find the reason for them. Zealots do not admit that errors exist.

If he was a god, he most assuredly could have had someone write something without errors.

Unfortunately, the bible is not without errors.

Therefore either he is not god or he chose to intentionally screw with us

That ain't benevolence, mate

Peace,
dave
No need for "religious" scholars or zealots here, just what YOU see. Not what others claim. I'm serious, I WILL swap books with you and I will read yours if you would want me to. Let me know. I'll consider whatever you want me to read.

You claim that what was written is errant, but what scholars talk about are the translations, and interpretations we have. I will state it again, that I believe that scripture in its original form, is the Word of God.

If these "errors" are so evident to a few "scholars", why don't they appear to make any heavy implications upon their faith? If there were such errors, it would be on the front page of the newspaper, the news would be revolutionary, and change the world forever. Christianity would have been completely and comprehensively wiped from the face of the Earth for all its "lies" and "evils". Yet it remains. Is that so illogical that it remains?

Some would argue that he does screw with us. I DO believe he is an active part in my life, not static by any means. I would though, more importantly say, that God can, and has overcome man's free will, in order to enable man to write something that is inerrant.

If God is god, and can have someone write something without errors, then if God "inspires" someone to write "There is a God", is what that person writes a true and inerrant statement or a false statement? This is still assuming the validity of the "if" statement.
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Old 12-19-2010, 11:18 AM #1854
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

How do we know that there is a god?
Through the bible....
Where did the bible come from?
From god...
So wait, how do we know we can trust him to be true and not a hoax?
Oh right, because it says so in the Bible...
But who wrote the bible again?
Oh yeah god did.

circle ad infinitum wihout a logical way to break away from the vicious circle.


What scripture exactly is the original one? It sure was written physically by
some man who was in turn inspired by god, but not written by god himself.
Since in the final instance, a MAN wrote it, it cannot be divine, perfect, infallible.
So unless the bibles 1st edition was published through big fiery letters written across
the sky, or billions of heavenly flyers dropped all around the world.....

The bible is the word of men, not god.
Why trust ONE random dude who said he got the word from "HIM", why wouldn't god
send it to at least a 1000 respected citizen at the same time?

Does god really care about us puny humans? I don't think so, IF he actually does
exist, he has totally and utterly forsaken every last one of us.

If HE wanted humanity to believe in HIM and the bible, I'd suggest he get his divine ass
off his heavenly throne, come down to earth for a visit and introduce himself to
everyone. He cannot send anyone to do the job for him (like Jesus, or Mohammed for example) because that's not credible. It's too easy to dismiss "prophets" as nutjobs.

So yeah, the day I can perceive the manifestation of GOD through one of my five
senses I will happily become a believer, untill that day though, FAT CHANCE....
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Old 12-19-2010, 11:39 AM #1855
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

god didnt write the bible...
mathew mark luke and john did
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Old 12-19-2010, 11:55 AM #1856
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

^ naah, they only wrote evangelions ..... priests wrote the bible(s)
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