Old 12-09-2010, 11:36 PM #1793
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

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Originally Posted by Meatball View Post
1.Your arguments are laughable. The brain is an organ, not what makes you, you. Its how you use it.

2.Who said it? Read "The Scientific Endeavor" by Jeffrey A. Lee
A secular author.

3.Your logic is subjective. Logical is also circumstantial. You want to talk logic? Ever hear of Sir Francis Bacon?

He and Descartes established the scientific method of inquiry based on experimentation and inductive reasoning. In "De Interpretatione Naturae Prooemium", Bacon established his goals as being the discovery of truth, service to his country, and service to the church. Even though his work was based on experimentation and reasoning, he rejected atheism as being the result of insufficient depth of philosophy, "It is true, that a little philosophy inclineth man’s mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion; for while the mind of man looketh upon second causes scattered, it may sometimes rest in them, and go no further; but when it beholdeth the chain of them confederate, and linked together, it must needs fly to Providence and Deity."

What credibility does a Hindu have? They have true religion. They try to better themselves.

4.Smoking crack? Is that your argument? Are you thinking??

They were fishermen, tax collectors, carpenters, and persecutors of Christians.

5.Tell me this, WHERE does the Bible claim that the Earth is only a few thousand years old?? I think you will not find it anywhere.

Christians ignorant to science claim it does, but no where does it say, or imply. Learn Hebrew, and you'll find that there is no limit to the age of the Earth as Genesis allows.

6.Where does it say the Earth is fixed in space? Velocity is a vector, and very relative.

7.Where does it ignore other continents? Are you reading from a global point of view? I think so..

8.Where does it ignore micro-evolution? Micro is observable, and evidential. Macro is evidential, but NOT observable.

9.WHERE does the Bible say that slavery is ok?? Where do you get these wild notions? Does it HAPPEN in the Bible? Or is it taught in the Bible? Are you looking AT THE CONTEXT?

10.Give me one contradiction, USED IN CONTEXT.

11.Read the thing, and you might learn a thing or two.

12.Sheesh, at least Dave knows how to use context.

13.O wait, you're already a scientist, AND a Biblical expert.
Oh, boy… I shouldn't be wasting my time trying to teach a brainwashed dog new tricks… here goes.

1.Evidence, please. Modern science shows us that the brain DOES make us, us. You might reject that fact because you feel the need to believe in a soul, but it IS a fact. If the brain doesn't make us, us, then why can damaging/stimulating certain parts of the brain change our very personality?

2.Never heard of the guy… even a google search turns up nothing. Sounds like a real idiot…

3.You bet your ass I've heard of francis bacon… the man died because he stayed in a meat freezer so long he got pneumonia or something… Anyway, of course he claimed he was serving the church… if you didn't in that time period (especially where bacon lived) the church would condemn and kill you. Some scientists did actually legitimately support the church, but it was only because they didn't know quite enough to explain the world scientifically yet.

4.I'm thinking… you're not.

5.Bible Age of Earth
Have you even read the bible?

6.chronicles 16:30, psalm 93:1, psalm 96:10, plasm 104:5, isaiah 45:18. You'd better have a damn good response to this one….

7.The bible never mentioned the fact that continents on other longitudes existed… sort of a big omission, right?

8.Wrong again. Macro-evolution is observable in the physical world (darwin saw it in the archipelagos, you can see it in many rain forests over a period of a few years). Entire bird populations will experience major gene shifts in only a few generations. Evolution is also proven in many simulational models. I've done it myself, set up a few digital objects representing animals, kill off the weakest ones and have the rest reproduce (EXACTLY as it happens in the real world). Evolution is observable here too. To be frank, only a complete d*ckhead would honestly try to deny evolution. At least most christians recognize the bible was wrong in a few places….

9.see cyparagon's post. I think you've been taught the dumbed-down, "family-friendly" version of the bible…

10.A List Of Biblical Contradictions
Tons of them….

11.God hates hypocrites. Bible Topics: Hypocrites Have fun in hell.

12.Dave is more patient than I am, he deals with d*ckheads all the time.

13.I'm just open-minded.



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Old 12-10-2010, 01:19 AM #1794
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Biblically epic post Ossumguywill.
There was way too much effort put into that though, I have had a few intellectual battles with religious fanatics (most people call them Catholics) and it is like punching yourself in the face. 1 You can never convince them of anything logical and 2 it feels really good when you stop. ^_^
+1 for the info, not my beliefs but still a good read!
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Old 12-10-2010, 01:53 AM #1795
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

^^^ actually catholics are the least fanatical.
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Old 12-10-2010, 04:34 PM #1796
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

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Old 12-13-2010, 09:54 PM #1797
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

I don't know if god exists and neither does anyone else. They just have faith.

Faith - "belief that is not based on proof" taken from dictionary.com

I've seen horrible things in the world. they happen every second of every day. If a god does exist, hes abandoned us.
most people NEED to believe. Otherwise it's all for nothing. Who you help, who you hurt, what you do and where you go when you die.. None of it would matter when we're gone and people cannot accept that. It's an extremely scary concept. Which is why I am so deathly afraid of..death (no pun intended)

But this fear will not make me entertain the absurd suggestions found in a christian bible.
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Old 12-14-2010, 02:19 PM #1798
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

I also don't know if there's an alligator in Dave's pants. But I should always assume there's one there because no one can disprove it.

"You can DO it! I have faith in you!"
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Old 12-14-2010, 03:05 PM #1799
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Quote:
Originally Posted by ossumguywill View Post
5.BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
How does it feel to be a brainwashing victim?
I've run across Bible-thumper sites, and atheist sites. They come across equally brainwashed. You're brainwashed, I'm brainwashed.

It's ad hominem, douchey remarks that have kept me from participating in what should be an intelligent, mature discourse.

-Trevor
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Old 12-14-2010, 10:12 PM #1800
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Quote:
Originally Posted by chipdouglas View Post
^^^ actually catholics are the least fanatical.
[citation needed]

Quote:
Originally Posted by twhite828 View Post
I've run across Bible-thumper sites, and atheist sites. They come across equally brainwashed. You're brainwashed, I'm brainwashed.

It's ad hominem, douchey remarks that have kept me from participating in what should be an intelligent, mature discourse.

-Trevor
I'm "brainwashed" by logic, not desperate clinging to an afterlife by uneducated ancient farmers. The main difference is that atheism is indisputably correct, being derived from purely logical arguments while religion is the opposite. "Brainwashing" someone with correct information is hardly the same as "brainwashing" them with fanatical fallacies, often designed to suck your money and political power into a central body (whichever church you follow).

Also, I seem to remember that you are a christian so forgive me for not exactly trusting your view on whether or not I'm the deluded one.
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Old 12-14-2010, 10:46 PM #1801
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

^^^^^ are you kidding? i don't know 1 catholic that will die for the cause LOL.. Trust me, i'm catholic. hee-hee. We have the vatican, whoopy! In the US, catholics are known to be the calmest and chillest religion. I understand that you are an atheist but you obviously don't study much.

How do you know the farmers were un educated? the myans did math it would take most of the current world 10 life times to understand, same for the egyptians. So if you are going to use words like "logical" then make sure you own words are too. You through the word fanatic around way too loosely also. just to believe in something doesn't make you a fanatic. I believe in money, i wouldn't kill for it LoL.


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Old 12-14-2010, 10:59 PM #1802
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Quote:
Originally Posted by ossumguywill View Post
I'm "brainwashed" by logic, not desperate clinging to an afterlife by uneducated ancient farmers. The main difference is that atheism is indisputably correct, being derived from purely logical arguments while religion is the opposite. "Brainwashing" someone with correct information is hardly the same as "brainwashing" them with fanatical fallacies, often designed to suck your money and political power into a central body (whichever church you follow).

Also, I seem to remember that you are a christian so forgive me for not exactly trusting your view on whether or not I'm the deluded one.
Did you even read the snippet I quoted? I'm saying that someone like, say, Dave, would not conduct himself in the way that you currently are. I have the utmost respect the people arguing here (on both sides) who are conducting themselves maturely. If you took a step back to read what you're saying, you'd realize that you're losing your credibility to argumentative fallacies. You're obviously a thinking individual - try applying that by writing an argument (speaking of the rhetoric, not subject matter) that Socrates would approve of.

If you want to discuss my "religious views," PM me - but only if you can do so without ad hominem argument. I play a different tune than you have me pegged for; for some reason though, I feel like my inbox will stay empty.

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Old 12-14-2010, 11:08 PM #1803
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Quote:
Originally Posted by chipdouglas View Post
1.^^^^^ are you kidding? 2.i don't know 1 catholic that will die for the cause LOL.. 3.Trust me, i'm catholic. 4.hee-hee. 5.We have the vatican, whoopy! 6.In the US, catholics are known to be the calmest and chillest religion. 7.I understand that you are an atheist but you obviously don't study much.

8.How do you know the farmers were un educated? 9.the myans did math it would take most of the current world 10 life times to understand, same for the egyptians. 10.So if you are going to use words like "logical" then make sure you own words are too. 11.You through the word fanatic around way too loosely also. 12.just to believe in something doesn't make you a fanatic. 13.I believe in money, i wouldn't kill for it LoL.


micahael.
1.Are you? This reads like it was written by a 12 year old… This whole paragraph is so awful I suffered from major second-hand embarrassment.

2.There are plenty… I don't think you have a clue how many fanatic catholics there are (remember the crusades?)… You must be pretty sheltered…

3.Why would I trust you for that? You are literally one of the most biased people who could possible answer this question.

4.Seriously?

5.Ok… And?

6.According to who? Again, [citation needed]. I know plenty of catholics who are fanatics (and plenty more who are just stupid).

7.Umm… "I don't study much"? No offense, but you present yourself as a complete idiot… From your posts, I'd say I'm a hell of a lot more studied than YOU are…

8.Because I've studied history… I don't think you have, judging by the fact that you claim that catholics are the "chillest".

9.First off, it's "mayans"; second, not really. Third, they weren't christian. Christianity itself hasn't contributed to a single significant scientific advancement in its history (in fact, it's held back many), while many other religions have.

10.They are… but again, take your own advice. You are writing like a child and your ideas are barely coherent.

11.Nope. By pretty much any definition, there are many catholic fanatics.

12.No, not all catholics are fanatics, but if you believe in something like christianity it can certainly make you pretty stupid.

13.That's because money incontrovertibly exists… the things you believe in don't.


Quote:
Originally Posted by twhite828 View Post
Did you even read the snippet I quoted? I'm saying that someone like, say, Dave, would not conduct himself in the way that you currently are. I have the utmost respect the people arguing here (on both sides) who are conducting themselves maturely. If you took a step back to read what you're saying, you'd realize that you're losing your credibility to argumentative fallacies. You're obviously a thinking individual - try applying that by writing an argument (speaking of the rhetoric, not subject matter) that Socrates would approve of.

If you want to discuss my "religious views," PM me - but only if you can do so without ad hominem argument. I play a different tune than you have me pegged for; for some reason though, I feel like my inbox will stay empty.

-Trevor
I dropped the pretense of respect/maturity in this thread a while back because it was clear none was deserved/none existed for most of the people I was arguing against. You are right, your PM box will stay empty because I know I'm just wasting my time arguing with a fanatic.

Edit:I see that you said you were "religious", not specifically christian, sorry for the mistake. But really, that doesn't change much.

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Old 12-14-2010, 11:25 PM #1804
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

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I dropped the pretense of respect/maturity in this thread a while back because it was clear none was deserved/none existed for most of the people I was arguing against. You are right, your PM box will stay empty because I know I'm just wasting my time arguing with a fanatic.
Fanatic?

Not at all - I'm sort of religious, but not because of anything I was told from a pulpit or anything my parents told me to believe. I dislike churches as bodies and organized religion in general. That's why I thought you might find a mature, outside-of-this-thread discussion with me interesting. That, or you find me more of an idiot after reading the words above and to the left of this sentence.

I live in an honors community on campus, and the long discussions that occur on religion are my favorite. Everyone brings a different experience to the table, and all the views are represented. In fact, just last night I had a really interesting talk with one of my closest friends (who happens to be a staunch atheist) on religion. Respect. It can happen... and does happen.

-Trevor
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Old 12-15-2010, 01:11 AM #1805
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Damn, this forum backs up at the worst times. I've lost so many lengthy posts because it backs up right when I would assume the majority of users happen to be posting... "brb 10 mins".


Anyway, TL;DR
You're right, "fanatic" is a bit harsh, yadda yadda, I would love to chat once I have some free time (finals this week), but most "discussions" on such hot topics (especially ones that aren't based in logic you can actually argue about) devolve into shit rather quickly. You should see this political "chat" I had with an australian cop over PM one time... it turned into "all americans are fat burger-eating pigs" faster than you can say "stereotype".
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Old 12-15-2010, 07:42 AM #1806
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Talking Re: LPF's Religion

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Originally Posted by chipdouglas View Post
^^^^^ are you kidding? i don't know 1 catholic that will die for the cause LOL.. Trust me, i'm catholic. hee-hee.
Well, i know a lot of catholic peoples that killed, and still will kill, for the cause, and this is still a form of fanatism (and in the past, there was a lot of peoples going fight and die for the "holy wars" in foreign countries, and they was also cutting out their "attributes" for have no temptation to left the fight and come back home) ..... i call this fanatism too ..... and i'm catholic too (more or less ).

Does "congregation for the doctrine of the faith" (formerly known as "inquisition" in the past) remember you something ? ..... read their official interrogation guide and then say me that this was not written from a fanatic

The main difference from fanatic catholics and fanatic muslims, imho, is that now we're healed, when they still are diseased (in the brain, i mean ..... i also considerate the "will to die for a religion" nothing other than a mental disease )
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Old 12-15-2010, 10:42 AM #1807
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

Yeah, catholics can be quite fanatic, but when you look at the united states,
with all their televangelists, mormons, creationists and other crazy sects,
among those nutjobs, the US-catholics are actually pretty low profile.
But that's just the USA.

@ossumguywill:
curb your enthusiasm, turn it down a notch, keep it polite.
Right now you really sound just like the religious fanatic you loathe so much.
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Old 12-15-2010, 01:48 PM #1808
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Default Re: LPF's Religion

I think the word you're looking for is strict, not fanatic. As far as Christianity goes, Catholics are second only to Mormons in the number of strange rules they have to follow.
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