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Old 07-26-2016, 07:50 PM #1009
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

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Originally Posted by paul1598419 View Post
and get to force the wealthiest of this country to pay the same percentage of taxes as the people who work for them and pay a much higher percent.
You do understand that this is also one of Trump's policies, right? I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not about this.


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Old 07-26-2016, 08:35 PM #1010
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

I understand that Trump has said he would do this, but why would he when he has taken advantage of the loopholes himself and the Republican party doesn't support it. And it is only one of many changes we hope to have take place. Many of those Trump is against. Trump has said that crime is up since Obama's "rollback" of protections in the past. Nobody knows what rollbacks he is talking about, but if it's the release of Federal prisoners convicted as drug offenders, this has bipartisan support. The fact is crime is down and has been since the 1990s.
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Old 07-26-2016, 09:00 PM #1011
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

I thought votes won an election, not contributions.....or are you talking about what Hillarys super delegates get paid?

So firearms ownership has doubled in the last 20 years but crime is down.
I see a pattern here.

The American citizen must never lose their voice.

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Old 07-26-2016, 09:47 PM #1012
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

What you neglect to say is that when Citizens United brought suit in the SCOTUS, the justices on the right, instead of ruling on that case and it's merits, took it several steps further and ruled the for the first time in American history, corporations, which are a legal definition and are bound to further their profits by any means legally possible, don't actually have life and do not die, had the same rights of free speech as real people. These were the five conservative justices, several of whom worked as lawyers for Wall Street, and gave us the biggest mess in history allowing them to spend money unconditionally and privately to endorse candidates who would sell us out to big business and give them tax loopholes, reduce regulation and weaken the EPA so they could again dump their toxic waste into our air, soil and water.
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Old 07-26-2016, 10:11 PM #1013
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

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Trump will never be president. As much as I dislike Clinton, she is by far the better choice in this race.
I've always maintained that Hillary is much weaker than even her own party wants to believe. Things change and they change quickly. Trump got an 8 point bump from his convention. What's the Dem convention going to do for Hillary? Hey, if I were for Sanders, I'd be fuming mad over what that Wasserman-Schultz and her cronies did to give Hillary the advantage. Let's not forget, there are many other choices on the ballot other than "Trump" and "Clinton" for Sanders supporters to choose from.
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Old 07-26-2016, 10:35 PM #1014
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

Quote:
Originally Posted by paul1598419 View Post
What you neglect to say is that when Citizens United brought suit in the SCOTUS, the justices on the right, instead of ruling on that case and it's merits, took it several steps further and ruled the for the first time in American history, corporations, which are a legal definition and are bound to further their profits by any means legally possible, don't actually have life and do not die, had the same rights of free speech as real people. These were the five conservative justices, several of whom worked as lawyers for Wall Street, and gave us the biggest mess in history allowing them to spend money unconditionally and privately to endorse candidates who would sell us out to big business and give them tax loopholes, reduce regulation and weaken the EPA so they could again dump their toxic waste into our air, soil and water.
Was that not the case about weather Hobby Lobby had to pay for employee abortions?

Also the EPA has been in court a lot for accusations of overreach, what company is dumping what chemicals into what body of water, I would like to read about it.

Another thing to remember is businesses don't pay taxes, they only collect them, if taxes are raised on XYZ company then they have to raise the price of their product and the customer pays the tax increase.

Businesses gives people jobs, we don't want the government involved in every aspect of a private or publicly traded business, this is why businesses are going overseas, too much red tape and stifling regulation.

The last American primary lead smelter is closed now because of EPA regulations, this was after spending millions to clean up the process, the new regulations were unreasonable.

http://www.thenewamerican.com/econom...y-lead-smelter
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Old 07-26-2016, 10:36 PM #1015
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

Depending on how you view it, the biggest danger is that the actions of the DNC will mean that Sanders supporters just won't vote at all, and that will give the presidency to Trump. Hillary is too much of a known quantity at this point. Short of a drastic change in her platform, people are never going to be excited about her. Even women voters mostly don't like her.

Even if she does change her stance drastically, say she makes a flat tax, or legalizing weed nationwide for recreational use a top priority... is anyone left gullible enough to believe she's gonna follow through on anything she says? Nope.
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Old 07-26-2016, 10:51 PM #1016
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

Businesses will always take the EPA to court. It doesn't mean that they have overreached on anything they have tried to do. So, much speculation on what Sander's supports are going to do and the convention isn't into the second day yet. I thought the first day went very well considering the the Russian dump of hacked emails. I'll be watching again tonight, not on Fox. I watch PBS. I think today will be as enthusiastic for progressives as last night was. If anyone thinks that this isn't going to give Clinton a boost, it is wishful thinking.


Edit: Speaking of Fox News, does anyone think Roger Ales is getting together with Clarence "I've got a big one" Thomas to swap "war stories"?
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Old 07-27-2016, 02:37 AM #1017
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

You know a news story is unbiased when the first sentence has the phrase "thanks to the federal Environmental Protection Agency’s continuing war on American industry." I mean, no one is saying the amount of regulation is perfect in every way in every industry, but that doesn't mean we should get rid of the EPA, or that the EPA's primary goal is to kill industry. What would it have to gain from that goal alone?

I read through the article, and I didn't see any commentary on what the regulation was, or why it was being closed. Regardless of political stance, that's a categorically shitty news story. "This factory is being closed. Why? We're not gonna tell you. But buy more ammo!" is pretty laughable.

There's a lot of hateful language here. I don't suppose it's possible to stick to policy, rather than party, is it? I could yell at Mr. Cowboy for believing the earth is 6000 years old just because that's a stereotype, but that doesn't even necessarily reflect his position and isn't productive anyway.
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Old 07-27-2016, 03:12 AM #1018
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

St. Louis-based Doe Run Co., the world’s third-largest producer of lead from mines, said it will stop smelting operations as part of a $65 million agreement with the U.S Environmental Protection Agency and the state of Missouri. The company has operated the facility since 1986.

Doe Run said the estimated $100 million cost to build a new facility and meet air-quality standards was too risky.

“We saw no alternative to closing our plant,” Gary Hughes, general manager of Doe Run’s Metals Division, said in a Dec. 14 statement.


This will not hurt ammo manufacturing as recycled on hand material and imported material will fill the need, the point is the EPA is on the job, chemicals are not being dumped into rivers as far as I know, if they are I would like to read about it.

p.s. I know the Earth is a hell of a lot older than 6k years, I'm not even religious, as far as I'm concerned abortion should be legal as long as it's not outside the woman's body and breathing on it's own. But I am starting to see the value of religion in standing against a repressive behemoth government.

I am for freedom for everyone, Hillary is all about big government and cradle to grave government intrusion. I wish we had a common sense 3rd party that put all the party line bs aside and focused on our Bill of Rights, a smaller government, and self reliance, sure help people who need it, but stop creating a welfare state and a police state to run it, let people be free, intrude only under the authority of the people in the most limited way.
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Old 07-27-2016, 04:57 AM #1019
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

My concern for ground water is the fact that when fracking was being proposed, they somehow managed to get it free from the Clean Water Act. Now, people have tap water that can catch fire and the chemicals used in the fracking process are called proprietary, so "we can't tell you". They have found benzenes in fracking material and there are other chemicals that are probably harmful as well if we can get the companies using them to disclose them. I don't believe for a moment that the EPA is anti-business. Without it we would be in very poor shape as there aren't any other regulatory agencies to watch out for us. This is your example of contaminated water.

Now, as far as lead smelting goes, they used to do that here in Tacoma, Wa 100 years ago and the soil in many places around here are still dangerous, especially for children, who are at great risk for brain damage from the contaminated soil. It is a big enough problem that the local government here warns parents of this danger. And it never goes away. They also used to produce arsenic here and that is the other heavy metal that parents are warned about. So, if you think that the EPA has outlived its usefulness, you should remember this problem.
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Old 07-27-2016, 04:38 PM #1020
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

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I think today will be as enthusiastic for progressives as last night was. If anyone thinks that this isn't going to give Clinton a boost, it is wishful thinking.
I do not think the Democrat Convention is on track to give Hillary any genuine boost. The progressive/socialists, black-lives-matter, hard-core feminist and other hard-left groups are already going to vote for Hillary. Hillary and her campaign should know that no matter how much noise the Sanders' people make, they will mostly fall in line and vote for Hillary. Look at Sanders himself, the Dems rigged the system against him and even he is caving into the party machine. There may be a few mavericks among the Sanders supporters, but not many and their voice will not be heard after the convention.

So, you have to ask why is Hillary using (so far) all of the Dem convention to pander to the far-left progressive/socialists, hard-core feminists, Islamists and radical black power groups? Is it because she doesn't feel that she can really count on their support? If that's true, the Dems are in serious trouble. The support from these groups should be a given, a done deal and the convention should have been structured to ignore the far-left and go after moderate Republicans, Rhinos, Independents, and anti-establishment people who aren't happy with status-quo Washington.

Not broadening out your message and pandering to the extreme who are already in your party is a big mistake. You didn't see Trump pander to the Evangelicals, or to the Republican Establishment, or to male-dominated mostly white groups, or to the Tea Party factions, or even to the NRA. Instead, you saw Trump reach out to the Police, to the Unions, to LGBTQ, to Independents, to young people, and to a much wider variety of people than are generally thought to be Republicans. And, Trump has his problems with the Republican base, i.e. the Never Trumpers like Michael Medved, Jeb Bush and other pro-establishment types. Nor can Trump be accused of rigging the election; more likely he effectively stopped the Republican Establishment from rigging it against him!

If the Russians did hack Hillary's email (and I'm not convinced it was the Russians - there's absolutely no proof of that) you have to ask yourself "Why?" and "What else do they have on her?" If I were Putin and I had a bunch of damning emails with Hillary's name on them, I would release only enough to let her know I could destroy her. Then, if/when she gets into office, I'd blackmail her with them every opportunity I could to get what I want for Russia. Like I said, I'm not convinced that the Russians are responsible, for no other reason than lack of proof.

Last edited by Skans; 07-27-2016 at 04:49 PM.
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Old 07-27-2016, 05:03 PM #1021
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA


I feel like this is actually a pretty intelligent piece from Biden.
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Last edited by Razako; 07-27-2016 at 05:09 PM.
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Old 07-27-2016, 06:37 PM #1022
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

First off, Biden said that both parties have been guilty of not listening to the people and in the past just saying we have the answer for you. It is still very early in this convention process and we have seen the leaked emails effectively dealt with. We haven't heard from Clinton herself yet, so I think it is far too early to dismiss this party as having failed to connect with disenfranchised Republicans and other groups. It has been a convention free from the mistakes you saw at the Trump convention and the surrogates who have been speaking seem to have genuinely connected with the people they have spoken to. I think Clinton must come out and show she has a plan to make people's lives better. Something Trump didn't even attempt to do. IE: build a wall, deport immigrants, Muslims are terrorists, etc. Trump can reach out to Bernie Sanders voters all he wants, but they still won't vote for him. The LGBT community won't vote for him and he has no plan other than to say I am a successful business man who knows the system, vote for me. If Clinton can come out and show the people she has a plan to make their lives better, it will be a major victory and make the coming general election much easier for her.

Edit: In the last half hour, Trump at a press conference on one of his Florida golf courses asked Putin to release emails of Clinton if he had any from the "30,000" emails from her server. When asked if he was asking for a foreign nation to commit espionage on the United States he told the female reporter to "shut up and let the president ( himself) speak. This has gone from a curiosity to a treasonous event. It's Trump at his best.
I edited this to correct a mistake I made in reporting that Putin was asked to hack into Clinton's server, which is no longer active. The rest of this story was accurate.
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Old 07-27-2016, 10:29 PM #1023
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

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Originally Posted by paul1598419 View Post

Edit: In the last half hour, Trump at a press conference on one of his Florida golf courses asked Putin to hack into the emails of Clinton and release the "30,000" emails from her server. When asked if he was asking for a foreign nation to commit espionage on the United States he told the female reporter to "shut up and let the president ( himself) speak. This has gone from a curiosity to a treasonous event. It's Trump at his best.
Here is an example of how you spin things Paul, Trump did not ask Putin to HACK into anything, he said if they already had the e-mails he would like for them to be released.

Putin can not HACK into a DELETED server that has been WIPED and is no longer even there.

Trumps words were ( Hopes they can FIND the 30,000 missing emails. )

Granted it was a poor choice of a word, but HACK was not what Trump said. Hacking would be impossible at this point.

SPIN SPIN SPIN the evil witch still can not be allowed to win.

-------------------------------------------------------

People don't trust Hillary, Trump says what's on his mind, carelessly even and that's better than a known liar who we simply can not trust, Hillary Clinton's words are worthless because we can't trust her at all.

I would really like to see a race between Cruise and Sanders, what we got with Trump and Clinton is a nightmare.

We should have Bernie as an option, we have all been cheated.
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Last edited by RedCowboy; 07-27-2016 at 10:39 PM.
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Old 07-27-2016, 10:42 PM #1024
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

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It has been a convention free from the mistakes....
No mistakes at the Dem convention??? How about these:
1. DNC Chairwoman had to be fired at the start of the convention
2. Leaked Emails showing the world a rigged election by Democrat insiders
3. Pissed-off Bernie Sanders protesters shouting and booing
4. No American Flag present anywhere at the convention - even the most disgruntled Rino Republican won't tolerate that!
5. Bill Clinton talking about how he stood in a drop-add registration line in college (faking any need to actually be in a registration line) just to try to get in Gennifer, no um Monica, no um Dolly, no um Elizabeth, no um Myra, no um Paula, no um Juanita, no um Kathleen, no um um um what's her name HILLARY'S pants. Yeah, how I cajoled that girl Hillary into.... and years later here we are!
6. Angry women ranting about glass ceilings and how its ok for Hillary to play the woman card. Angry black people bashing the police.

Meanwhile, Republicans demonstrate what "respect" really means by refraining from protesting at the Dem convention, even though Dem protesters demonstrate how they respect NO ONE by protesting at the Republican convention.
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