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Old 11-19-2016, 12:29 AM #2513
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

Quote:
Originally Posted by CurtisOliver View Post
Brexit sure was. Even the people who voted out did not expect to win. It is a shame that most who voted out, voted for the wrong reasons. Mostly immigration control BNP style.
I voted out simply for Britain to get a grip of its own countries. We are too reliant on others, we need our own independence to learn how to fend for ourselves again.
I don't think it's your place to say if someones motivation to vote was correct. They might also disagree with your motivation to vote out, but the goal is still the same and it just comes down to getting enough people to vote out to win such a referendum, regardless of their mixed bag of reasons.

For example, a commercial fisherman might vote out to get rid of EU imposed quota, a factory worker may vote out because he lost is job to some eastern european migrant worker, and artisan beer brewer may vote out because his product doesn't comply with EU regulations despite being perfectly safe.

I'm sure the same could be for people that vote remain: they could work abroad in the eu themselves and want to keep that right, do trade with the mainland, employ foreign workers, or just want a visa-free retirement on the canary islands.



In the US i think this is similar: people voted for Trump for very different reasons, but the end result is that he won the elections under the US system (not the popular majority vote, but those quirky rules apply to both parties).

As for people protesting against the outcome of elections: They are hyprocrites. If they believe in democracy and have to serious reason to suspect the elections were somehow unfair, they shoud stand by their principles and respect the outcome.

I can understand people protesting an outcome that was obtained unfairly by making ballots disappear and all. I very much doubt this is the case in the US though, especially when resulting in a Trump victory.


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Old 11-19-2016, 04:25 AM #2514
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

Well this is going bad fast. Trump is already filling the govt with extreme right wing nutjobs like Sessions. Trump isn't the one I'm worried about ruining our country. I'm worried about what will happen when he stuffs the government with illogical, science denying, extreme right wing evangelical fascists who want to use the government to enforce their moral views. These aren't even traditional establishment Republicans. These are hard right true believers.

W/e. Nothing to do but embrace the insanity of this all. How many people are so lucky as to potentially witness the fall of an empire?
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Old 11-19-2016, 05:58 AM #2515
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

It appears you think of Trump the same way I think of Hillary, in an extreme biased manner

I doubt he will be that bad, but Hillary, I have no doubts would have been terrible! Is this all gutter expectations on both our parts? We will never know with Hillary of course
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Old 11-19-2016, 11:28 AM #2516
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

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Originally Posted by Razako View Post
science denying, extreme right wing evangelical fascists who want to use the government to enforce their moral views.
It's surprising how quickly this has become a buzzword.
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Old 11-19-2016, 02:55 PM #2517
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

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Originally Posted by Alaskan View Post
It appears you think of Trump the same way I think of Hillary, in an extreme biased manner

I doubt he will be that bad, but Hillary, I have no doubts would have been terrible! Is this all gutter expectations on both our parts? We will never know with Hillary of course
It's not Trump I'm worried about. It's the people he's filling our government with. They aren't the most rational or scientifically inclined individuals. Open climate change deniers, evangelicals who want to ban abortion and people who joke about the KKK not being all that bad (Sessions). Ordinarily I wouldn't trust such people to manage a burger restaurant, and now they will be running important parts of our government.
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Old 11-20-2016, 12:55 AM #2518
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

It remains to be seen how much of it will turn into actual legislation. A ban on abortion would probably be a bad thing, though i suspect people will simply have them done in canada or some other nearby country were it is legal. This happens in europe as well, for example women from Poland where abortions are legally difficult having them done in Germany.

As for climate change: this is a choice. The fact that CO2 emissions probably play a large role in it doesn't really change what you should do policy-wise. One option is to reduce emissions, the other is not to and find technical solutions when and if it causes problems.

To keep any promise of returning industrial jobs to america, the choice needs to be the latter. It is dubious if this will actually make a difference in global CO2 emissions though: countries that try to cut their emissions simply resort to bullying away factories like steelworks that emit a lot of it. The demand for steel does not really change though, it's just that those factories are set up in different countries that care a bit less.

An extra argument for keeping the emissions inside the borders is using local fuel sources like shale gas and oil to achieve energy independence. This has it's problems as well, but is a good political selling point.
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Old 11-20-2016, 03:42 PM #2519
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

Helpful hint for Dems trying to figure out what went wrong:

https://youtu.be/vKOb-kmOgpI

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Old 11-20-2016, 08:13 PM #2520
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

When the pendulum swings out to the left a long way it has a tendency to swing the other way just as far.
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Old 11-20-2016, 08:41 PM #2521
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

Here is just a tiny bit about Barry's appointments.

From 2009 >>>>> Obama Surrounds Himself with the Most Extreme Appointees in American History







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Old 11-21-2016, 12:32 AM #2522
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

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Here is just a tiny bit about Barry's appointments.
I move that Trump be permanently named "Donny" because of this "Barry" silliness.

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Old 11-21-2016, 12:37 AM #2523
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

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I move that Trump be permanently named "Donny" because of this "Barry" silliness.

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Old 11-21-2016, 12:53 AM #2524
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

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It's always darkest before the Don...
Barry Punny
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Old 11-21-2016, 01:21 AM #2525
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

...it is really funny though, looking at Donny's recent tweets. It's almost like he needs a safe space free of criticism!

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Old 11-21-2016, 03:45 AM #2526
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

What is the word for being afraid of being labeled a racist to the point of letting someone quietly get away with far more than anyone else could ever do? What ever I could call it, I believe that is part of the reason Obama was able to do so many outrageous things. In America, we have become afraid of the label of being a racist, especially if that individual is involved in a minority religion, then they get double freedom to do what they want to further their own racial and religious agendas. America has taken the issue of race discrimination and freedom of religion to the point where the issues have become inside out, now they are becoming the new threat.
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Sincerely investigate any of these three short quotes as new concepts and you've taken your first step into a larger world:

"I regard consciousness as fundamental. I regard matter as derivative from consciousness..." - Max Planck. "Everything we call real is made of things that cannot be regarded as real" - Neils Bohr. "What we call physical things and events do not exist independently of subjective experience..." - Deepak Chopra.

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Old 11-21-2016, 04:22 AM #2527
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

If my facebook feed for the last 8 years has been any indication, the general hatred of Obama that compounded over the years emboldened my friends that were closet-racist in 2008 to become overtly racist by 2016.

...but that's just anecdotal.

EDIT: That's also based on a sample from southwest Virginia, which isn't necessarily known as a hotbed of liberal hippy drum circles. So take that as you will.

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Last edited by Trevor; 11-21-2016 at 04:26 AM.
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Old 11-21-2016, 04:31 AM #2528
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Default Re: LPF's Presidential Candidate Vote USA

I did not vote for the new president elect but I'm also not loosing my mind over the outcome. The people of the United States have chosen their new commander in chief and although I remain quite skeptical of the outcome of the next 4 year term I also remain hopeful.
In all honesty I am glad he won over Clinton. At least with Trump the next 4 years is an unknown verses 4 more years of lies, power control, and corruption as would have been the case for Clinton. Also the second amendment will be defended and gun rights possibly expanded upon such as CCW reciprocity and removing suppressors and short barreled rifles from the NFA act.
Trump does IMO has some good ideas to bring manufacturing and industry back to the states as well as bringing the overseas billions of dollars back into the economy but his ignorant position on the environment namely climate change is very disturbing.
I think having all 3 branches of gvt in republican hands is a good thing. Lets see what they got so we can know more quickly if his plans are good for america or not. If yes then that's good for the nation, if not then we can move on in 4 years time rather than 8.
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Last edited by olympus mons; 11-21-2016 at 04:33 AM.
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