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Old 12-28-2012, 02:13 PM #65
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

I think some topics are very polarizing, and to be honest I have no idea, I both support gun control and the right to bear arms. I do not see why everyone sees a simple tool as such of a controversial object, the biggest danger is to being rash though. At one time I lost the right to conveniently fly because of current events of the past, the right to go to a range and plink some rounds off conviently may be the next to go. Is gun control good or bad, who knows, but who wants extra laws complicating their life. I say it should be up to local laws that way if I disagree, I at least get a choice of moving to keep my freedom. I see no reason to have this a federal issue, the only real reason its such a hot topic was because of a event that no one will care about 10 years from now. Laws can be forever. So I am a bit polarized but I will always be slightly an opposition to a way of thought, that eliminates freedoms that I enjoy. Any who that's my take on this.


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Old 12-28-2012, 02:15 PM #66
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

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@IE: @anyone else with an opinion on a pistol; I'm buying a good concealed carry soon, to keep for home defense until I'm 21, then getting qualified for my carry. (ah, the one good thing about the South, for now) Any suggestions, since you seem quite versed in weaponry?
Springfield XD sub-compact in .40 S&W

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Old 12-28-2012, 02:31 PM #67
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

I am an avid shooter myself and shoot mostly military arms. I am also an advocate for law abiding citizens who shoot responsibly at a range or area that is safe to do so.
I am quite frankly shocked at the response by some group in the US actually pushing teachers to be armed in their classrooms. I'm shaking my head at this, because it is just plainly wrong. No teacher should have to have a loaded gun in a classroom setting.. ever... I feel both the anti-firearms groups and the NRA sponsored groups missed the point. The problem is not with weapons. It is with (societal) attitudes on how we treat each other. Also more to the point a simple background check might be a good idea.
Banning is a bandaid patch to a much bigger problem.
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Old 12-28-2012, 03:39 PM #68
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Armed Teacher Pilot Program to Provide Free Training to Educators

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Old 12-28-2012, 04:07 PM #69
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

@Dave; that XD is sharp, much more my speed than a little six shooter, and I've heard amazing things about Springfield Armory through history. I could even put a low powered green lasersight on it. ^_^ And surprisingly reasonably priced. Any particular reason to go .40 rather than .45?

@Seoul_; I agree totally on your point of laws being forever and these little massacres only having political clout for about two years at the national level, obviously much longer at the local level near the site of the massacre, but nothing should be permanently changed regarding our tools, when the problem is the people wielding them and said peoples' inner and outer conflicts. I think over half of these incidents could seriously be headed off by a more readily a available state run mental health system. Most of the state run mental help I know of was opened up back when the best treatment for a violent schizophrenic was a lobotomization...
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Old 12-28-2012, 05:24 PM #70
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by ped View Post
Indeed.
But personally, coming from a country that doesnt arm its police officers, and you need a really good reason to own a gun, we have very little gun related crime here.
The problem in the US is our cops are not just armed, they are armed for war.

They are continuously upgrading with bigger, and better weapons developed for, and intended for military use.

There are countless instances of local police departments in small towns, purchasing military vehicles, guns, and crowd suppression systems, in addition to all kind of other equipment that really, short of a war has no reason being in the hands of local small town cops.

At the same time, I really can't see any way that police departments, or other agencies would ever disarm themselves.
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Old 12-28-2012, 05:38 PM #71
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

@Ped; @IE; this drives your point home perfectly I believe, a city of 23,000, with only two murders since 1999, has a $300k "tank" as they call it, I'm gonna call it what it is, a light armored vehicle, but still, these things are made to withstand an IED, multiple grenades, rounds up to and including .50cal.. I feel I need to be better armed with something like this floating around in such a clueless small town's hands, so maybe the police are all stand-up guys there (HA-HA!!), what if someone steals it? What stops that? Call in the fucking Abrams....
Anyway, link: Police 'Tank' Purchase Riles New Hampshire Town

>From the article-
"Since the 1990s, the Pentagon has made military equipment available to local police departments for free or at steep discounts. This, along with drug war-related policies, has spurred a trend toward a more militarized domestic police force in America. Law enforcement and elected officials have argued for years that better-armed, high-powered police departments are needed to fight the war on drugs."

...The war on drugs. Which mostly refers to potheads. Whenever I see a hard (real drug) bust around here there's no SWAT involved, there's a few detectives with sidearms, they breach the home at an early hour and get the guy while he's in bed or cooking a fresh batch of his chem-cookies. I've seen it firsthand a few times. The police DON'T NEED tanks. I do think an assault rifle here and there is harmless, but they should be abiding by the same rules as us, they are after all, civil servants.
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Old 12-28-2012, 05:51 PM #72
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Taking from that article, and touching upon another closely related subject...

Quote:
Since the 1990s, the Pentagon has made military equipment available to local police departments for free or at steep discounts. This, along with drug war-related policies, has spurred a trend toward a more militarized domestic police force in America. Law enforcement and elected officials have argued for years that better-armed, high-powered police departments are needed to fight the war on drugs.
Therein lies the problem.

Personally I'm all for a war on mental illness.
A war on poverty.
A war for education, and a war for health.

Instead we have the war on terror, and the war on drugs. Both have resulted in trillions wasted, countless lives ruined, and no discernible benefit.

If we didn't need to fight these wars anymore, if police departments were also disarmed, in that scenario I would be for more gun control.

That's not going to happen though. It's not profitable. So no thanks. I'll keep my right to own a gun.

/rant.
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Old 12-28-2012, 05:55 PM #73
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

It's like they're up-arming for an impending invasion in the traditional sense, when the enemy is clearly guerrilla style on the terrorist front.. What is that tank gonna do against a dirty bomb? It's gonna be a dirty, silly little tank with police lights all over it.
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Old 12-28-2012, 06:11 PM #74
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Equally importantly, why is there such a huge double standard?

Why is being prepared a positive for law enforcement agencies, and cops, but it's a criminal looney-bin act for a citizen?

Especially at a time when the defense contractors supplying these products spout things like this;

Quote:
"I don't think there's any place in the country where you can say, 'That isn't a likely terrorist target,'" Massery said. "How would you know? We don' t know what the terrorists are thinking. No one predicted that terrorists would take over airplanes on Sept. 11. If a group of terrorists decide to shoot up a shopping mall in a town like Keene, wouldn't you rather be prepared?"
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Old 12-28-2012, 06:20 PM #75
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

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current events of the past
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Old 12-28-2012, 07:42 PM #76
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Here's another example;

Man Who Killed 2 Firemen Left Note On Killing Plan - Philadelphia News, Weather and Sports from WTXF FOX 29

I'm sure many of us have read about this in the news. What I would like to point out, is once again, an ex-con, with a criminal record for violent crime was able to obtain firearms.

This man could not care less about laws...

How in the world would stricter gun laws have been able to prevent this crime?

Imo they wouldn't. Couldn't.

What new regulars will do, will be to impose more on law abiding gun owners.

Edit: This relates very well to post #57... http://imgur.com/gallery/YUv5k granted there is minecraft, but IMO, use of actual physical objects is far more beneficial to development.

Me across this just now...



Yeah, I can't see US cops EVER disarming themselves, and if they don't feel safe without a gun... surprise, surprise, I don't feel safe either.

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Old 12-28-2012, 09:21 PM #77
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodofcville View Post
@Dave; that XD is sharp, much more my speed than a little six shooter, and I've heard amazing things about Springfield Armory through history. I could even put a low powered green lasersight on it. ^_^ And surprisingly reasonably priced. Any particular reason to go .40 rather than .45?
For CCW weight and size is a consideration
The .40 ammo is a bit cheaper
Granted the .45's recoil is a bit smoother, but the energy transfer is virtually identical with a smaller round

Plus, the XD is what my son carries as his back-up

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Last edited by daguin; 12-28-2012 at 09:23 PM.
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Old 12-28-2012, 09:49 PM #78
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Hmm, well that explains the california and guns paradox... you always had me puzzled with that Daguin.
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Old 12-28-2012, 11:08 PM #79
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by InfinitusEquitas View Post
Hmm, well that explains the california and guns paradox... you always had me puzzled with that Daguin.
LOL!
I am a Life member of both the NRA and the California Rifle and Pistol Association
When I was young (and still a construction worker) I used to hunt furbearers (coyote, bobcat, fox, etc.) to supplement my income during the winter when work slowed down.

It is true, though, that California has been a little weird for quite some time
I remember when I was in the Air Force (early 70's)
I was a Security Policeman
I was qualified with the shotgun and the 40mm grenade launcher
I was qualified "Expert" with the M-16 and pistol
I used to singly guard alert F-4 Phantoms that were loaded with tactical nuclear weapons

Once, when I came home on leave, I wanted to go "plinking" with some friends

I couldn't buy .22 rimfire rounds because they were classified as "pistol ammo" here and you had to be 21 years old to buy it
I was 17 years old at the time

Peace,
dave
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Old 12-29-2012, 12:33 AM #80
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

I feel that banning guns or limiting what you can buy isn't going to help at all. The only people it will hurt are the one that abide by the laws. Not only that, killers will use other methods to kill. People would still get killed if the planet was perfectly flat with no other objects on it.

As for needing weapons to fight the government or military, they might not me needed as badly as some people think. I haven't met one person in military that is anti-gun. There are some that don't own any type of gun though. It doesn't seem like there are many that would be willing to fight against the citizens they serve to protect. It would probably depend on why they are fighting. I'm sure there are a few that would fight against them no matter what. There are probably a few slect citizens that most military members would also fight against. Serial killers would be one example.
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