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Old 06-04-2013, 05:41 PM #433
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Following up on recent problems facing the 1st, 2nd, and 4th amendment rights, we're now looking at the decline of the 5th amendment;

Deadline Looms for Suspect to Decrypt Laptop, or Go Directly to Jail | Threat Level | Wired.com

This is not the first such case.

At issue is whether a person can be ordered by a judge to decrypt their encrypted data.

Specifically when that data can be used to then convict said person.

To me, to the judge in question initially, and to everyone else, it seems pretty clear cut that they man should not be forced to do anything to aid in his own persecution. Yet he is facing contempt if he does not comply.


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Old 06-04-2013, 06:03 PM #434
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

6/4/13 - Some more pictures from Turkey.

This is what happens when police are tasked with enforcing government policy.

Note some of these images are rather graphic. If you are squeamish you may want to ignore this post.













































































Girl shot in the head with a tear gas gun;


Protester shot in the head with a bullet;


Real bullets being used;


Marks left through restrained use of iron bar by police on protestor's back;


Marks from plastic bullets - you know the "less than lethal" ones;


Man loses an eye - from a teargas canister;


Man loses an year - you can see the evil protesting hooligan holding on to it;


Journalists are being treated with courtesy and respect;


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Old 06-04-2013, 07:33 PM #435
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Seriously tragic, and as you pointed out, we are not so far from it. Terrible but something which must be understood. I heard about the decryption thing, this is beyond the fact that encryption is no longer really "unbreakable" anymore with some of these high power computers. No not every cop can just break your encryption but the technology is there if someone really wants to get in.

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Old 06-04-2013, 07:47 PM #436
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

The main reason that judges even entertain the notion of the argument for forcing a person to decrypt, is the claim by the prosecution that decrypting places an undue burden upon law enforcement.

Personally I think it's irrelevant. Unfortunately what I think doesn't really matter in the scheme of things.

One thing that puzzles me with regards to these cases, is that people do not use the classic political answer of "I do not recall."

After all, most likely a complicated password, of phrase is needed as a key... not unfeasible that a person can forget.

Another interesting point about encryption is the truly secure methods aren't really available to John Q. Public.

As a side note... police are able to break into iphones, and android phones through the screen protect in literally seconds, and SCOTUS has yet to rule on the constitutionality of the use of data that can be accessed with a smartphone. With a smartphone in hand it's really not hard for anyone to reset the password to just about any website/service a suspect uses.
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Old 06-04-2013, 07:59 PM #437
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Kind of moot as all transmitted communication is sucked up now anyway. No they may not ever need to access it, but it is there stored away if it is every really needed to be used against someone...

And LE frequently uses cell phone tower "*****" to pursue suspects, however everyone who happened to be using that tower has there info mixed in there. There is no regulation or guideline in terms of privacy with this.

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Old 06-04-2013, 08:03 PM #438
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

The amounts of data sucked up are massive, and often also encrypted to some degree by default. Simply to find it presents a challenge.

Hopefully it will always remain beyond the capabilities of a regular cop.
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Old 06-04-2013, 08:08 PM #439
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Yes, just don't piss off the Feds

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Old 06-04-2013, 08:48 PM #440
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Default Re: Gun Discussion



Yup, but remember, even if the guns are gone, you can still build a machete slingshot
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:00 PM #441
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

He R ready for the Zombie Apocalypse Who need guns, or clothes for that matter...



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Old 06-04-2013, 09:13 PM #442
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Well, I think it's safe to say that from a government perspective, it would be a scary scenario in the US for them. For example, when is the last time you've seen riots in a state where the population is heavily armed?

For the present at least, quite a few people can shoot back... and considering LEOS are outnumbered 1-4 to 1000, they know if the people ever turn on them, they are screwed.

You also have to wonder how many LEO's would fire at civilians... then again DHS is buying up non traditional "zero hesitation" targets for a reason.
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:17 PM #443
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Default Re: Gun Discussion





"police restraint"

Infinitus...
Quote:
You also have to wonder how many LEO's would fire at civilians... then again DHS is buying up non traditional "zero hesitation" targets for a reason.
This has been coming up with LE and domestic military forces. Questionnaires asking whether or not they could fire upon US citizens. Also fueling reports of NATO troops training on US soil.

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Alecto 405nm
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Malice ~ an SBA Lasers Custom Build (Sinner MS-SSW host PL520)
MXDL host 56mw Fasttech green Pman custom build
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Daguin Mini Red
Deadeye Lasers Sirius 445nm Blue
AnselmoFanZero MLG-01 445nm Blue
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:48 PM #444
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Yes, kids, pregnant women, old men, woman with a stroller, etc,.

I doubt foreign forces would be needed... just roll in people from another part of the country.

Besides, no disrespect to our veterans, but have you ever talked to some of guys coming out of military training... to follow orders is literally drilled into them.

LEO is an acronym for Law Enforcement Officer. Though personally I feel like it means Lie Enforcement Officer instead.
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Old 06-04-2013, 10:48 PM #445
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

Of course.

From a law standpoint, if you know beyond any doubt that the order you are being given is unlawful, you do not have to comply.

For example you do not have to produce identification unless you are in a car, or entering a restricted space.

You do have to provide your name, and address, if requested, but that is it. You absolutely have no requirement to possess on your person a form of identification otherwise.

If you start walking away though, all of a sudden you're fleeing. Even if you're backing up because you have two armed guys in your face for no reason.

If your hands move - that's resisting arrest. If you start putting your hands inside your pockets - out of habit - oh you're REALLY in trouble - you're reaching for a weapon.

Oh and what Officer Friendly hasn't been told to yell "STOP RESISTING!" when beating a suspect?

While I think the days of lawful gun ownership may be ending, I do hope that more cameras will lead to more accountability. Cops don't pull half the crap they do off camera that they do on camera - after all they can no longer control the narrative if there is videotape evidence that completely contradicts what they write in their reports.

What's really scary, is a lot of cops still write out reports that contradict what happened, even when on camera.

Last edited by InfinitusEquitas; 06-04-2013 at 10:48 PM.
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Old 06-05-2013, 05:12 AM #446
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

You got lucky. Now days you would probably just get tazed, arrested for disturbing the peace, and resisting arrest.

Edit;

http://pro.wmal-af.tritonflex.com/co...6543&is_corp=0

Quote:
The father of a middle schooler in Calvert County, Md. says his 11-year-old son was suspended for 10 days for merely talking about guns on the bus ride home.

Bruce Henkelman of Huntingtown says his son, a sixth grader at Northern Middle School in Owings, was talking with friends about the Sandy Hook Elementary School massacre when the bus driver hauled him back to school to be questioned by the principal, Darrel Prioleau.

"The principal told me that with what happened at Sandy Hook if you say the word 'gun' in my school you are going to get suspended for 10 days," Henkelman said in an interview with WMAL.com.

So what did the boy say? According to his father, he neither threatened nor bullied anyone.

"He said, I wish I had a gun to protect everyone. He wanted to defeat the bad guys. That's the context of what he said," Henkelman said. "He wanted to be the hero."

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Old 06-05-2013, 10:10 AM #447
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

New Jersey: Court Upholds Man Arrested For Visible Gun Case In Car New Jersey


Quote:
Part of the problem is that the federal safe haven law for interstate transportation of firearms does not protect you from magazine bans and ammunition bans at the state level.

Learn the lesson here: Blankets are cheap...cover everything up in your car and avoid visible inspection like this when the Constitution doesn't offer very much protection as its a all set aside for "security".
~ D.S.

New Jersey: Court Upholds Man Arrested For Visible Gun Case In Car

This man was a Vet, former Police Officer and in the process of moving.

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Old 06-05-2013, 01:48 PM #448
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Default Re: Gun Discussion

http://www.delaware1059.com/features...n%20032113.mp3

Here's a good phone call taken on a radio station in my state pertaining to open carry.

to the radio host, Dan Gaffney, for being so damn awesome.
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