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Old 05-08-2010, 02:33 AM #193
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

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Originally Posted by chipdouglas View Post
What is within reason to you may not be in reason to me and vice versa... lets talk about the "trench" lets say ive been in it and you havent. what about astronauts that see earth from space, but i cant see 5 miles down the freeway because of all the smog. You see, it is all about an individuals own ability to understand and rationalize. as for the infinite numbers between 0 and 1, i will always see it as finite. but mathmaticians clearly see it infinite. the green highlighted green part is something that doesn't make sense. Every thing is "new and unorthodox" to every body at some point. so by your logic no body can learn anything ever? so because a person isn't able to see beyond, isn't fair to say words are meaningless. because to me they mean everything.


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What I meant by the trench thing, was that if I wasn't there, then I couldn't explain it. I'm trying to explain a theory. Words are meaningless here because it's just what that person THINKS. What would have REAL meaning is actual proof of what is really out there. I mean words are meaningless because they hold no solid ground in this instance, they have no backbone, they are just that persons mental depiction of what he/she believes might be in the trench, or on Neptune, or at the boundries of the Universe. And no, I'm not saying you cannot learn, but things that are truely mind-boggling, and extrordinary. Not a new species of fish, or a new dinosaur fossile. But say...proof of aliens landing here and talking with the worlds great leaders, that would be impossible to explain. How could you tell somebody that without them telling you that you're full of it? Things like that, that are just truely out there. But I do fully understand your side of the 'discussion'. I see what you're saying.


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Old 05-08-2010, 02:51 AM #194
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

i believe the universe is infinite, and because of that i am comfortable saying there is an infinite amout of humans out there.

also we apparently have different meanings of what "words" are. so i'll stop here.


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Old 05-08-2010, 03:03 AM #195
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

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i believe the universe is infinite, and because of that i am comfortable saying there is an infinite amout of humans out there.

also we apparently have different meanings of what "words" are. so i'll stop here.


michael
I'm ok with that agreement. =P
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Old 05-08-2010, 11:14 PM #196
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

I've been auditing AP physics this semester, and if what I've been taught is right, the universe is probably infinite. The big bang can be explained by the equation ∆E∆T≥h/2π. What this means is that when you look at a very small frame of time, the amount of energy in the observed area can (and does) fluctuate. This applies anywhere, not where there is just matter. This means that the quantum foam, mesh, whatever you want to call it exists everywhere, and that energy can spring to existence (and probably pop back out of it) anywhere. This includes outside of where there is currently matter. Hell, there's a chance that another universe is in the same dimension as us, just really, really, really far away.
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Old 05-09-2010, 12:47 AM #197
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

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I've been auditing AP physics this semester, and if what I've been taught is right, the universe is probably infinite. The big bang can be explained by the equation ∆E∆T≥h/2π. What this means is that when you look at a very small frame of time, the amount of energy in the observed area can (and does) fluctuate. This applies anywhere, not where there is just matter. This means that the quantum foam, mesh, whatever you want to call it exists everywhere, and that energy can spring to existence (and probably pop back out of it) anywhere. This includes outside of where there is currently matter. Hell, there's a chance that another universe is in the same dimension as us, just really, really, really far away.
"In a galaxy far, far away" Sorry, I just had to. By the way, anybody need me to do some more ellaboration of the 'Bose-Einstein condensate' situation? If so, I'd be more than happy to
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Old 05-09-2010, 01:24 AM #198
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

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"In a galaxy far, far away" Sorry, I just had to. By the way, anybody need me to do some more ellaboration of the 'Bose-Einstein condensate' situation? If so, I'd be more than happy to
Nope we're fine here.

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Old 05-09-2010, 01:31 AM #199
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

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Nope we're fine here.

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Is that a yes???
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Old 07-02-2010, 05:03 PM #200
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

Sorry if this has already been said in this topic however I am new here and I was only able to get a few pages in before skipping ahead and reading the last page over so that I could get my two cents in.
I noticed that string theory was mentioned but the given issue was that there were five different string theories, but adding an eleventh dimension to string theory unites the five.
NASA claims that the universe is infinite, however could it be possible that on our scale it is infinite but in terms of higher dimensions there are boundaries, in effect I think this might mean it is both depending on the frame of reference.
Once again sorry if this is completely wrong or has already been stated.
*EDIT* Ok, wow, read it all now.

Last edited by Volkos; 07-02-2010 at 06:44 PM.
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Old 07-02-2010, 06:22 PM #201
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

i think they decided ages ago that the universe is finite. space is curved around matter. so matter curves all of space into itself, forming a kind of space bubble. however, you cannot reach the "edge" of it. if you kept exploring the universe you would run out of places you havent been to yet, but because the space curves, there is no edge. its like the surface of the earth, but the 2D laws apply in this case to 4D space. i think it is expanding, so maybe more and more space is being created though.
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Old 07-02-2010, 06:38 PM #202
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

That's a non-relativistic/euclidean view of the universe, and has not been proven. It's just another theory. And isn't it worth noting that there is vacuum energy everywhere? Not just how far out matter and light have gone...
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Old 07-02-2010, 06:54 PM #203
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

outside of space is not a vaccuum. there is no existance outside space by definition.
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Old 07-02-2010, 07:40 PM #204
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

"Twistor" Theory Reignites the Latest Superstring Revolution: Scientific American

theory that space-time itself is a secondary construct. Kind of an concept. If true, then the infinite or non-infinite nature of space becomes obsolete. After all, this means there are no deeper differences between separate points in space and time. It would actually explain quantum entanglement's functioning. I thought it was interesting.
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Old 07-02-2010, 08:26 PM #205
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

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outside of space is not a vacuum. there is no existance outside space by definition.
You're assuming the emptiness ends. Many would disagree. As long as there is emptiness, there is vacuum energy. That's how the matter in the universe probably got created.... a flux in vacuum energy thanks to the uncertainty principle.
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Old 07-02-2010, 08:37 PM #206
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

but doesnt there need to be space for the vaccuum to exist inside?
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200mW waterproof 650nm from O-like *outputting 210mW quite stable*
Plan to have soon:
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01010000011000010111001101110100011000010010000001 10111000100000011100110110000101110101011000110110 01010011101000100000011010010111010001110011001000 00011000010110110101100010011010010110011101110101 01101111011101010111001100100001
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Old 07-02-2010, 08:42 PM #207
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

What? Space extends forever, so does the vacuum... It may not have any matter in it, but it still exists... I don't really see what you're trying to say, a vacuum is the absence of matter. You don't need matter around for there to be a vacuum.
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Old 07-02-2010, 08:44 PM #208
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Default Re: Is the universe infinite or finite?

the theory i was talking about states that matter warps space into itself, forming a kind of bubble. hence theres a limit to space.
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Just starting off my collection. Currently have:
150mW 405nm from O-like *outputting 156mW quite stable*
Jayrob SS 18650 kit, A140 diode at 1A putting out 900mW
100mW 532nm from dealextreme *broke*
500mW 532nm from O-like *lense dmg? down to 150mW with scatter*

200mW waterproof 650nm from O-like *outputting 210mW quite stable*
Plan to have soon:
1W 455nm from wicked lasers (ofc)

01010000011000010111001101110100011000010010000001 10111000100000011100110110000101110101011000110110 01010011101000100000011010010111010001110011001000 00011000010110110101100010011010010110011101110101 01101111011101010111001100100001
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