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Old 10-10-2011, 08:55 PM #1
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Default Will I get a criminal complaint?

Hey guys,

I am from Germany.

I bought a 2,1W Laser some time ago and the package was intercepted by customs.

Today I was there to get my package. They wanted that I open my package. I opened it and showed the laser customs. They told me that they wanted to test it, because no warning was on the laser. I followed them into the next room. There, they turned on the laser. They said that it was not a 1mW laser and asked if I received the package as gift? I said that it was a gift. I also said I am not versed with lasers. They said that in Germany everything is forbidden and will be prosecuted offenders about 1mW. They kept the laser and said that the laser will be analyzed in the laboratory within 1month. They told me If the result is over 1 mW, I would get a criminal charge.

Is this really true? I dont know if I can get a criminal complaint because I had a laser.

regards,
Dennis




Last edited by fischyyy; 10-10-2011 at 09:47 PM.
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Old 10-10-2011, 09:09 PM #2
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

Not sure how they can. You didn't ship the item. if this were the case i would just start mailing illegal shit to anyone i hated and report it as it arrived.

I can't speak for german law but in the United states it's not criminal, it's civil. at least that's what i was told by my lawyer when I got into trouble with the FDA.

Stick with the 1mW story.
tell them you paid for a 1mW laser. you cannot be held responsible for a manufacturers defect and as far as spending whatever you spent on a 1mW laser...well, stupidity isn't a crime.


alternatively if your REALLY worried about it, stop talking right now and call a lawyer.

Last edited by Mohrenberg; 10-10-2011 at 09:11 PM.
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Old 10-10-2011, 09:19 PM #3
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

Hmm... very bad. I thought the only countries, where are lasers over 1mW forbidden were UK and Australia. Some people from Germany wrote here, they bought ~500mW lasers and they hadn't any problems at all. I hope you won't have any troubles as well as DTR.
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Old 10-10-2011, 09:19 PM #4
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

How did they turn it on?

Did it ship with batteries? A 2.1Watt laser must take at least a 18650 or 2x 16340. It's not like they could just put AA's in there and it would turn on...
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Old 10-10-2011, 09:28 PM #5
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

I do not know German law, so I am only speculating, and might have no idea what I am talking about.

But it would seem to me, that the minute you said "It was a gift", you should be off the hook.

Because how should you be held responsible for junk that someone sent you as a surprise gift?

(Of course, I have also read and taken to heart Franz Kafka's "The Trial" and "The Castle", so maybe in Germany you can be held responsible for things that you have no responsibility for).

EDIT: For future buys, it might be good to ask for the item to be sent in 2 or 3 shipments a few days apart, so it won't be possible to test the item).

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Old 10-10-2011, 09:29 PM #6
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

Were the customs forms labeled as 'laser'? How did they know what it was to
begin with?
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Old 10-10-2011, 09:35 PM #7
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowspawn View Post
EDIT: For future buys, it might be good to ask for the item to be sent in 2 or 3 shipments a few days apart, so it won't be possible to test the item).
Or with lens removed so even if they do turn it on, it will not be apparent that it is a laser, but rather a very weird blue flashlight.

I'm supposed to ship a laser to germany tomorrow

Maybe I should refund the price of the batteries and ship without batteries

Haven't had trouble with Canada or UK yet...

Last edited by InfinitusEquitas; 10-10-2011 at 09:36 PM.
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Old 10-10-2011, 09:35 PM #8
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

@Mohrenberg
Thank you very much. I will just wait and stick with my story.

@gulftown
Thanky you. I know that some germans bought some 500mW lasers and there are also youtube videos of germans with 800mW lasers but maybe the customs didnt catched them. They said its illegal to import such lasers. I dont have any trouble with DTR at all. He is going to replace me etc

@benmwv
Thanks benmwv. He send it to me with batteries
But I asked them about that too. I asked them what would they do if there were no batteries inside. They said they would keep the laser either because there is no warning on it and they has to test the power in the laboratority.

@Shadowspawn
I hope you are right. Thanks for the tip with the delivery. DTR is sending me my new Laser pointer in 3 parts, a few days apart + to 3 different adresses.

@wannaburn
After they opened the package. They said "Ahh a laserpointer." <- only in german
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Old 10-10-2011, 09:42 PM #9
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fischyyy View Post
After they opened the package. They said "Ahh a laserpointer." <- only in german
Classic... they already knew what it was before calling you in, there is no question about that. They said it strictly for effect and to watch your reaction.

Should have told them, muss der ***-Spielzeug meiner Freundin gewartet hatte, haben Sie versucht, es, wissen Sie, wenn es vibriert?***

***Do not translate if you're easily offended
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Old 10-10-2011, 09:42 PM #10
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

Sending stuff to the UK is fine, there is no law that I know of that restricts handheld lasers
maybe it would be a good Idea just to send a 1mW sticker in with the box with every laser shipped to the Countries where they are forbidden ???
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Old 10-10-2011, 09:44 PM #11
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

At least you got to turn it on once.

You should have asked them if they had any balloons.

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Old 10-10-2011, 09:55 PM #12
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

Maybe they will measure the power output in 'laboratory' using laserbee bought from a member of LPF
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Old 10-10-2011, 09:55 PM #13
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

@InfinitusEquitas
Hahaha yes thats so true. Thank you that made me laugh. Yeah the next time I will say "Hey, das ist kein Laserpointer sondern der neue Vibrator meiner Freundin wenn Ich auf Geschäftsreise bin"/"Hey, that is no laserpointer. That is the new vibrator for my girlfriend when I am travelling."

@DTR
Yes and it was so beautiful. At first I wanted to say "Here you have 10$ and now you have seen nothing." but I wouldn´t risk a charge for corruption.
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Old 10-10-2011, 10:36 PM #14
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wannaburn View Post
Were the customs forms labeled as 'laser'? How did they know what it was to
begin with?
Quote:
Originally Posted by benmwv View Post
How did they turn it on?

Did it ship with batteries? A 2.1Watt laser must take at least a 18650 or 2x 16340. It's not like they could just put AA's in there and it would turn on...
I just asked him about this and he said they made him assemble it. As it came with the unit in several pieces which included the laser modules, The host and the batteries all in three separate bubble wrapped packages in the main package. I am betting they had him assemble it so they were no longer components but a fully functioning laser pointer. Bastards.

Last edited by DTR; 10-10-2011 at 10:37 PM.
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Old 10-10-2011, 11:11 PM #15
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

Quote:
I just asked him about this and he said they made him assemble it. As it came with the unit in several pieces which included the laser modules, The host and the batteries all in three separate bubble wrapped packages in the main package. I am betting they had him assemble it so they were no longer components but a fully functioning laser pointer. Bastards.
Ok, I already wrote some PMs with fischyyy, but thats really creepy...

We have no general laser ban in germany for class IV Lasers and buying Parts is absolutely legal. There are even german shops wich sell Housings and compatible Modules you just have to screw together...
Im not really sure if they were authorized to let him build it. Im no lawyer but Im curious if you could proceed legally there? But I guess this would just end in new adjudication forbidding lasers in parts...
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Old 10-10-2011, 11:40 PM #16
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Default Re: Will I get a criminal complaint?

Dude. I´m also from Germany. So here some facts. Owning a laser is not forbidden. Just selling lasers above 1mW is forbidden here. You were not selling it but bought it elsewhere and you didn´t do it to sell it further. The customs obviously did understand this right somehow wrong.

I have no clue where you bought the laser, but it was not a good idea as they labeled it as a laser and therefore it took their attention. Now you are in a unfortunally sutuation. I would suggest you to go to a lawyer. Either way you will have to spend some money for it.

Last edited by honeyx; 10-10-2011 at 11:43 PM.
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