Laser pointer discussion. Read/write reviews of laser pointers and laser pointer companies. Learn about all types of laser pointers and lasers





Welcome to Laser Pointer Forums! If you are looking for a laser pointer or want to compare different laser pointer companies, you may want to check out the LPF Laser Pointer Company Database. The link will open in a new window for your convenience.








Green Laser Pointers by Category Blue Laser Pointers by Category Red Laser Pointers by Category
Yellow Laser Pointers by Category Violet Laser Pointers by Category Orange Laser Pointers by Category
Top Laser Pointers by Power - 1 Watt+ Top Laser Pointers by Power - 500mW+ Top Laser Pointers by Power - 250mW+
Laser Pointer Database High Power Laser Pointers Laser Pointer Diodes
Laser Technology Laser Pointer Parts Lasers by Wavelength
Top 10 Laser Pointer Companies Laser Pointer Company Database Visible Beam Laser Pointers


One laser store meets all your needs

























Go Back   Laser Pointer Forums - Discuss Laser Pointers > Lasers > Laser Shows



LPF List of Laser Pointer Companies (link opens new window)



Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-10-2011, 11:43 PM #1
SubrosaNJ's Avatar
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Central NJ
Posts: 23
Rep Power: 0
SubrosaNJ is on a distinguished road
SubrosaNJ SubrosaNJ is offline
Junior Member
SubrosaNJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Central NJ
Posts: 23
Rep Power: 0
SubrosaNJ is on a distinguished road
Default Can a laser show blind you?

Sorry if this seems like a silly question, but I really am curious. Still trying to reach out and grab all the info I can as am still pretty new to lasers. My question I guess is more along the line of.. are laser shows ever dangerous? I have never been to one so I dont know the specifics. Does the audience wear protection glasses? Or is there no chance of beam reflection? I would assume that most show lasers are of very high power, how do they not damage a viewers eye?

Thanks for any info on the subject.


SubrosaNJ is offline   Reply With Quote







LPF List of Laser Pointer Companies (link opens new window)







Old 01-10-2011, 11:54 PM #2
Eudaimonium's Avatar
Class 4 Laser
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Pitomača, Croatia
Posts: 6,295
Rep Power: 427
Eudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via Skype™ to Eudaimonium
Eudaimonium Eudaimonium is offline
Class 4 Laser
Eudaimonium's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Pitomača, Croatia
Posts: 6,295
Rep Power: 427
Eudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via Skype™ to Eudaimonium
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

Only one of your questions is rather "silly", which is about audience wearing goggles.

Have you ever seen proper laser safety goggles? Have you seen that the laser is invisible through them? So how can you view a lasershow when you're not seeing anything?

Lasershows are having very powerful lasers inside, yes.

However, they are not always driven at maximum power, there is this thing called modulation. Basically, when beams are passing near the audience, power levels go very low, since angle of beam is very low and it's very visible.

Next, the beams are moving incredibly fast... it's just that you can't see it. So that one beam that appears there, is actually pulsed at some frequency.

Finally, beams themselves are not focused tightly, they are around 1-3 cm wide when they are near the audience. Combine that with low power, and you're pretty much safe.

On a more uhh... logical note, you see, lasershows are beautiful to behold and everything. A lot of people pay a lot of money to construct them and see them.
Do you think people would continue to visit them if they blind everybody in the room?

Events which cause some permanent damage to the audience tend to get very poor reputation and number of people visiting them

This is the first to come to mind on the subject:
Audience scanning - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

For more professional read, try visiting PhotonLexicon. Not sure but I think I saw something on that topic there.
__________________
Accepting and
^Click to enter^

The "Where to get laser components" big compilation thread!

Are you new and need help? Instead of starting new threads, shoot me a Personal Message! I'll answer all the beginner's and advanced questions you might have!

Eudaimonium is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2011, 11:56 PM #3
Bionic-Badger's Avatar
Class 4 Laser
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Oregon, USA
Posts: 5,478
Rep Power: 2687
Bionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond repute
Bionic-Badger Bionic-Badger is offline
Class 4 Laser
Bionic-Badger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Oregon, USA
Posts: 5,478
Rep Power: 2687
Bionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

The short answer: yes, this is what laser show safety regulations are for.
Bionic-Badger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2011, 12:01 AM #4
Eudaimonium's Avatar
Class 4 Laser
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Pitomača, Croatia
Posts: 6,295
Rep Power: 427
Eudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via Skype™ to Eudaimonium
Eudaimonium Eudaimonium is offline
Class 4 Laser
Eudaimonium's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Pitomača, Croatia
Posts: 6,295
Rep Power: 427
Eudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond reputeEudaimonium has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via Skype™ to Eudaimonium
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bionic-Badger View Post
The short answer: yes, this is what laser show safety regulations are for.
Indeed, the shortest possible answer. I was trying to focus more on preventing it.
@OP
Oh also, there are usually some sort of "safe zones" defined within the software so beams will automatically drop to safe power level when in safe zone, so you are even more safe that way.

Every lasershow is carefully constructed and pre-sighted for such things. You don't want a hundred lawsuits filed against you
__________________
Accepting and
^Click to enter^

The "Where to get laser components" big compilation thread!

Are you new and need help? Instead of starting new threads, shoot me a Personal Message! I'll answer all the beginner's and advanced questions you might have!

Eudaimonium is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2011, 12:18 AM #5
SubrosaNJ's Avatar
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Central NJ
Posts: 23
Rep Power: 0
SubrosaNJ is on a distinguished road
SubrosaNJ SubrosaNJ is offline
Junior Member
SubrosaNJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Central NJ
Posts: 23
Rep Power: 0
SubrosaNJ is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

Thanks for the replies. Yeah I know it would be dumb to have a show in which people would be blinded, I guess I was looking more for the answer of why it doesnt blind. But you explained that very well thanks again!
SubrosaNJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2011, 01:35 AM #6
Cyparagon's Avatar
Class 4 Laser
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 9,142
Rep Power: 9321
Cyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond repute
Cyparagon Cyparagon is online now
Class 4 Laser
Cyparagon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 9,142
Rep Power: 9321
Cyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond reputeCyparagon has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

In practice, the only reported injuries have been from pulsed lasers (such as copper vapor and q-switched YAG)
__________________
A problem well stated is a problem half solved.
Cyparagon is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2011, 02:11 AM #7
Benm's Avatar
Class 4 Laser
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 7,437
Rep Power: 18210
Benm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond repute
Benm Benm is online now
Class 4 Laser
Benm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 7,437
Rep Power: 18210
Benm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond reputeBenm has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

Still, i suppose sticking to the MPE levels would be a good idea when any crowd is involved.

Not all injuries would be noted in any case. Its a bit like getting ear damage from music that plays too loud - you get the ringing sound for a bit, but consider that to be a normal morning after effect. The same coud be true for seeing spots as a result of laser exposure beyond recognized safety limits.
Benm is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2011, 02:37 AM #8
Flaminpyro's Avatar
Class 4 Laser
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: West central Oregon
Posts: 5,461
Rep Power: 1768
Flaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond repute
Flaminpyro Flaminpyro is offline
Class 4 Laser
Flaminpyro's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: West central Oregon
Posts: 5,461
Rep Power: 1768
Flaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond reputeFlaminpyro has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

Are laser shows allowed to hit the crowd ? I thought that
they had to keep the beams above peoples heads.
I'll bet EF knows the answer to that one !
__________________
White Fusion Time Machine 445
473nm LRS-0473-KFM-00150-10 158.5mW Lab style
laser used in the making of the latest TRON movie

CNI PGL-III-C-589 125mW
520 in a SH-032
Viasho 532nm 500mW
CNI pen 532nm 84mW
The Violet Pip Squeek 45mW

_____________________________________
LOOKING FOR A HOST WITH PERFECT HEAT SINKING
order your C-88 Cu kit today !


Last edited by Flaminpyro; 01-11-2011 at 02:42 AM.
Flaminpyro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2011, 02:51 AM #9
aryntha's Avatar
Class 3R Laser
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Evergreen, CO
Posts: 2,027
Rep Power: 2778
aryntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond repute
aryntha aryntha is offline
Class 3R Laser
aryntha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Evergreen, CO
Posts: 2,027
Rep Power: 2778
aryntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond reputearyntha has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flaminpyro View Post
Are laser shows allowed to hit the crowd ? I thought that
they had to keep the beams above peoples heads.
I'll bet EF knows the answer to that one !
Yes, EF would know better but: this is called "Crowd scanning". It does happen, sometimes intentionally. More often in Europe than the US. It's also the source of some controversy, to a degree.

I'm sure EF could explain more.
__________________

3392nm:REO LHIP HeNe 2mW ∙ 980nm:OLIKE 155mW

808nm:OLIKE 200mW ∙ JETL PLC 600mW(682pk)
780nm:OLIKE 120mW
685nm:18650 47mW
671nm:PGL3M 281mW DPSS ∙ PGL3C 278mW
655nm:LOC 254mW ∙ OLIKE 221mW ∙ Yob 320mW
638nm:Sanyo 40mW ∙ HL63133 200mW ∙ PGL3C 463mWpk ∙ ML520 700mW
633nm:JDS1145 HeNe 28mW ∙ JDS1145 HeNe 26mW
612nm:MG 05LOR151 HeNe 3mW ∙ REO LSTP 3mW
609nm:REO LHOR 1mW
604nm:REO LSTP 2mW
594nm:Rigel 3mW ∙ LG PGL3C 15mWpk ∙ Lasos 7512 3mW ∙ CNI MGL3 58mWpk
589nm:CNI PGL3C 106mW ∙ CNI PGL3C 85mW
561nm:CNI PGL3C 30mW(41pk)
556nm:CNI PGL3C 20mW(22pk)
544nm:JDS1675P HeNe 2mW ∙ REO LHGR 2mW ∙ Lasos 7786 2mW
532nm:PGL3C 150mW(180pk) ∙ PGL3C 578mWpk ∙ PLC 440mWpk
515nm:JDS 221420GL ArI 30mW
510nm:52mW DG#2 ∙ 50mW 26650 DG
488nm:Nlx DPSS 7mW ∙ JDS 2214 ArI 40mW ∙ JDS FCD488 DPSS 25mW
ML:MG 65A106025 ArI ML 115mW
476/480nm:Nichia Diode 28mW
473nm:PGL3A 45mW(80pk) ∙ PGL3C 110mWpk ∙ PGL3C 95mWpk ∙ RPLB-25 60mWpk
465nm:DTR NDB7676 2.03w
458nm:JDS 2214VL ArI 8mW ∙ JDS 2214VL ArI 12mW ∙ RHD Diode 1.7W
452nm:Osram SM 47mW
445nm:Yob 1410mW ∙ Polaris 156mW ∙ PGL3C 1200mW ∙ DTR-EHG 32650 2136mW
405nm:Yob 630mW ∙ Qfox 750mW ∙ JETL PLC 780mW
aryntha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2011, 03:40 AM #10
Class 4 Laser
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 5,728
Rep Power: 547
ElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond repute
ElektroFreak ElektroFreak is offline
Class 4 Laser
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 5,728
Rep Power: 547
ElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

You folks already have this well in hand.. not much left to say.

Crowd scanning CAN be done safely. As long as the person doing the show takes the proper measurements using calibrated test equipment and determines beyond all doubt that the show will be safe under all of it's programmed perameters, then it can be done safely and legally with gov't approval. Much of what is seen in Europe is done this way, but also there are a lot of European shows that aren't measured. The operators that don't measure rely mostly on what Cyparagon stated above: that there are very few, if any, publically confirmed reports of injury to audience members by CW lasers of any power level commonly found at laser shows, which is up to around 7-8W in most cases. Pulsed lasers are far more dangerous. Even though the pulse is short, the peak intensity is FAR higher (it's very common to see peak powers in the kW range) and a few kW of instantaneous power can do a lot of damage in not a lot of time.

Generally speaking, in the US crowd-scanning is avoided. I believe this is due more to the operator's fear of litigation than actual danger to the audience myself.
__________________
Laser Resources (for n00bs and veterans alike!)

Sam's Laser FAQ (The Laser Bible)

http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/laserfaq.htm

RP Photonics Encyclopedia of Laser Physics and Technology

http://www.rp-photonics.com/encyclopedia.html

ULTIMATE DIY PROJECTOR REFERENCE

http://nqlasers.com/scannerreference...itle=Main_Page

SUCCESS is the best revenge.
ElektroFreak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2011, 05:08 AM #11
hakzaw1's Avatar
Class 4 Laser
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: 'Deep in the Heart Of Texas..."
Posts: 8,338
Rep Power: 25722
hakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond repute
hakzaw1 hakzaw1 is online now
Class 4 Laser
hakzaw1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: 'Deep in the Heart Of Texas..."
Posts: 8,338
Rep Power: 25722
hakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond reputehakzaw1 has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

IIRC bunch of folks got seriuosly eye zapped at a Lasershow in Moscow a while back. Things are way diff. here than elsewhere. Best place to see a great show with audience scanning in the USA is at a LEM. Lawsuits have made most crowd scanning a thing of the past here. Easy to sue- hard to defend the lawsuit.

SELEM Rocks!!!! Aug- 19 to 21 2011- NEWTON NC-
__________________
IF YOU ARE NEW HERE- READ ALL THIS http://laserpointerforums.com/f37/an...ml#post1353314
& Spend some hours reading at LASERPOINTERSAFETY.COM

powered by PANGOLIN-ILDA Member since 2014.

QS/FB3 +Beyond-APC40-Mamba Black(clone) 5paghettix2 and I-show x2-Kasio synth-midi
KGB- 532 1.1W 445 2.2W 655 1.3W DT Pro 40 still needs more red.
KGB1W+ 532 DT Pro 40 soon to be GB.
Laserking 1300RGB FULL COLOR 30K(may be FS)
Laserking RGB LK PD2 500 and LK SD 850
REKE RGB 500- G 300
HeNes-(12)R(3)G-COH-594/5 mW-thnx DrSam
MULTILINE-147mW[
445nm 180mW-Mini spiro-Yob.
LPMs-RadiantAlpha& Pro5W-AixiZ SPER/KenmeterLite/LB1
Spacelas 1178mW 655nm/AixiZ 300mW532&
2 B&W 473nm 5/6mW lab
JETLRS1.3W&1.2W-MGL-H
638 180mW ttl mimi lab (av. 230mW)
405 100mW ttl mini lab
445 300 mW ttl mni lab ^AixiZ^ all for a lumia PJ
*MightyMite 2000* RGB all diode 2.2W 30K- 637/520./450...NEW!!
Guide DIY Pjs by Dan-
http://nqlasers.com/scannerreference/index.php?title=Main_Page
hakzaw1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2011, 08:17 AM #12
vk2fro's Avatar
Class 3R Laser
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 1,154
Rep Power: 160
vk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond repute
vk2fro vk2fro is offline
Class 3R Laser
vk2fro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 1,154
Rep Power: 160
vk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond reputevk2fro has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

There is another way a laser show can blind you. Most laser show projectors are protected against this however, and its a situation where the galvos (the gadgets that move the laser beams around really fast) fail.

This situation is called a "Scanfail" and results in a high powered static beam. However feedback loops in good projectors shut off the laser the instant a scanfail occurs. The protecter for this event is funnily enough, called a scanfail circuit.

Without one, a member of the audiance may not be blinded but if the laser is powerful enough and as we know audiance members like to put there hands into the laser beams, they could get a nasty burn from the laser.
__________________
Taipan Projector: 3.5-4 W B(445nm)1.5W, G(532nm)1.5W R(637nm)1W DT30 Still building!
All solid state PJ: 1W B(462)400mw G(520)200mw R(638) 400mw DT40W (collecting bits)
Pointers: 1.0 watt "Z-Lase" - 520 nm diode by DTR attached to segelei zmax V5 Vaporizer
Gassers: Omnichrome 643 Multi Line AR/KR+ ION!!!! doing ~190mW Low hours too!
Siemens 3 mw 632nm helium neon

Last edited by vk2fro; 01-11-2011 at 08:20 AM.
vk2fro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2011, 07:36 AM #13
Bionic-Badger's Avatar
Class 4 Laser
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Oregon, USA
Posts: 5,478
Rep Power: 2687
Bionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond repute
Bionic-Badger Bionic-Badger is offline
Class 4 Laser
Bionic-Badger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Oregon, USA
Posts: 5,478
Rep Power: 2687
Bionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond reputeBionic-Badger has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hakzaw1 View Post
IIRC bunch of folks got seriuosly eye zapped at a Lasershow in Moscow a while back. Things are way diff. here than elsewhere. Best place to see a great show with audience scanning in the USA is at a LEM. Lawsuits have made most crowd scanning a thing of the past here. Easy to sue- hard to defend the lawsuit.

SELEM Rocks!!!! Aug- 19 to 21 2011- NEWTON NC-
Yeah, it was in 2008.
Bionic-Badger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2011, 09:58 PM #14
flecom's Avatar
Class 2 Laser
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 303
Rep Power: 28
flecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant future
flecom flecom is offline
Class 2 Laser
flecom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 303
Rep Power: 28
flecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant future
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SubrosaNJ View Post
Sorry if this seems like a silly question, but I really am curious. Still trying to reach out and grab all the info I can as am still pretty new to lasers.
thats fine, you learn by asking...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SubrosaNJ View Post
are laser shows ever dangerous?
if done improperly: yes

Quote:
Originally Posted by SubrosaNJ View Post
I have never been to one so I dont know the specifics. Does the audience wear protection glasses?
no

Quote:
Originally Posted by SubrosaNJ View Post
Or is there no chance of beam reflection?
there should be no chance of beams going into the audience in a properly done show (without audience scanning)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SubrosaNJ View Post
I would assume that most show lasers are of very high power, how do they not damage a viewers eye?
only way to guarantee you will not cause any damage (noticable or not) is by simply not letting the lasers enter the audience, so it never enters their eyes, no damage done!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flaminpyro View Post
Are laser shows allowed to hit the crowd ? I thought that
they had to keep the beams above peoples heads.
I'll bet EF knows the answer to that one !
this varies by country

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElektroFreak View Post
Crowd scanning CAN be done safely. As long as the person doing the show takes the proper measurements using calibrated test equipment and determines beyond all doubt that the show will be safe under all of it's programmed perameters,
sounds about right

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElektroFreak View Post
then it can be done safely and legally with gov't approval.
if you are in the US you ABSOLUTELY better have CDRH variance for the audience scanning, and I guarantee you it WILL get you a visit before they approve it...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElektroFreak View Post
Much of what is seen in Europe is done this way, but also there are a lot of European shows that aren't measured. The operators that don't measure rely mostly on what Cyparagon stated above: that there are very few, if any, publically confirmed reports of injury to audience members by CW lasers of any power level commonly found at laser shows, which is up to around 7-8W in most cases.
yikes, just becuase there are no reported injuries does not mean there are no injuries... remember non dramatic eye damage is usually unnoticable, your mind "fills" the gaps usually... its only when there is dramatic damage that it goes reported like when we talk about...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElektroFreak View Post
Pulsed lasers are far more dangerous. Even though the pulse is short, the peak intensity is FAR higher (it's very common to see peak powers in the kW range) and a few kW of instantaneous power can do a lot of damage in not a lot of time.
pulsed lasers should never NEVER >>NEVER<< be aimed at an audience...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElektroFreak View Post
Generally speaking, in the US crowd-scanning is avoided. I believe this is due more to the operator's fear of litigation than actual danger to the audience myself.
no, in the US crowd scanning is avoided becuase it requires a lot of paperwork AND cannot exceed Class I power levels (like .39mW) in the audience... so the effect is kind of lame anyway

Quote:
Originally Posted by vk2fro View Post
There is another way a laser show can blind you. Most laser show projectors are protected against this however, and its a situation where the galvos (the gadgets that move the laser beams around really fast) fail.

This situation is called a "Scanfail" and results in a high powered static beam. However feedback loops in good projectors shut off the laser the instant a scanfail occurs. The protecter for this event is funnily enough, called a scanfail circuit.

Without one, a member of the audiance may not be blinded but if the laser is powerful enough and as we know audiance members like to put there hands into the laser beams, they could get a nasty burn from the laser.
if you setup your projector to be compliant with CDRH requirements you would not need a scanfail because you would have a physical beam block that even if there was a small explosion inside your case, theres NO way for the projector to scan below your set level (normally 3m above audience for example)
__________________
Overkill is a way of life

Pointers:
1x 445nm 900mW in Jayrob stainless host, turned down to ~350mW (as low as the driver would let me)
"Lab" Lasers:
2x 650nm 1000mW CNI
2x 650nm 1000mW unknown?

1x 642nm 1200mW KVant
1x 642nm 550mW LaserWave
1x 593.5nm 50mW CNI
1x 532nm 1500mW LaserWave
1x 532nm 1500mW Viashow
1x 532nm 1800mW Lambda Pro
1x 532nm 2400mW Melles Griot
1x 532nm 15000mW LaserScope

1x 473nm 400mW LaserWave
1x 473nm 10mW B&W Tek

2x 445nm 1200mW O-Like


My 5W RRGBB Projector <~ clicky
My Laser Photography
flecom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2011, 10:54 PM #15
Class 4 Laser
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 5,728
Rep Power: 547
ElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond repute
ElektroFreak ElektroFreak is offline
Class 4 Laser
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 5,728
Rep Power: 547
ElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond reputeElektroFreak has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

Re: my above quotes

I agree with you for the most part Flecom.. My own personal opinion regarding vision damage from laser shows is that unless you've got some SERIOUS legal representation and a whole bunch of money, DON'T audience scan.. but that's just me. As far as reported injuries, the reason I take the stance that I have on that is that I honestly believe that there is such a thing as making a mountain out of a molehill.. generally speaking, unless there is evidence of a problem, there is no problem as far as I'm concerned and I think that's more than fair. Even though I feel a certain way myself, it's just an opinion not necessarily fact and consequently I don't use or recommend unsafe practices myself and I would never allow any of my associates to do so. None of us could afford a lawsuit if someone were to get hurt, and since being of a certain opinion isn't the same as knowing with 100% certainty it's not worth the risk. Those are my thoughts on it.
__________________
Laser Resources (for n00bs and veterans alike!)

Sam's Laser FAQ (The Laser Bible)

http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/laserfaq.htm

RP Photonics Encyclopedia of Laser Physics and Technology

http://www.rp-photonics.com/encyclopedia.html

ULTIMATE DIY PROJECTOR REFERENCE

http://nqlasers.com/scannerreference...itle=Main_Page

SUCCESS is the best revenge.
ElektroFreak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2011, 12:10 AM #16
flecom's Avatar
Class 2 Laser
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 303
Rep Power: 28
flecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant future
flecom flecom is offline
Class 2 Laser
flecom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 303
Rep Power: 28
flecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant futureflecom has a brilliant future
Default Re: Can a laser show blind you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElektroFreak View Post
Re: my above quotes

I agree with you for the most part Flecom.. My own personal opinion regarding vision damage from laser shows is that unless you've got some SERIOUS legal representation and a whole bunch of money, DON'T audience scan.. but that's just me. As far as reported injuries, the reason I take the stance that I have on that is that I honestly believe that there is such a thing as making a mountain out of a molehill.. generally speaking, unless there is evidence of a problem, there is no problem as far as I'm concerned and I think that's more than fair. Even though I feel a certain way myself, it's just an opinion not necessarily fact and consequently I don't use or recommend unsafe practices myself and I would never allow any of my associates to do so. None of us could afford a lawsuit if someone were to get hurt, and since being of a certain opinion isn't the same as knowing with 100% certainty it's not worth the risk. Those are my thoughts on it.
looking at the "real world" picture your absolutely right

problem is even if you do *EVERYTHING* right when it comes to your audience scanning, all it takes is this guy to show up



and mess everything up with his super cool arctic... then the next day when they have blurry vision, they wont think of the jerk off with the pointer, the lawyers will say "well wasn't there some dude running lasers?? sue him!"
__________________
Overkill is a way of life

Pointers:
1x 445nm 900mW in Jayrob stainless host, turned down to ~350mW (as low as the driver would let me)
"Lab" Lasers:
2x 650nm 1000mW CNI
2x 650nm 1000mW unknown?

1x 642nm 1200mW KVant
1x 642nm 550mW LaserWave
1x 593.5nm 50mW CNI
1x 532nm 1500mW LaserWave
1x 532nm 1500mW Viashow
1x 532nm 1800mW Lambda Pro
1x 532nm 2400mW Melles Griot
1x 532nm 15000mW LaserScope

1x 473nm 400mW LaserWave
1x 473nm 10mW B&W Tek

2x 445nm 1200mW O-Like


My 5W RRGBB Projector <~ clicky
My Laser Photography
flecom is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply





Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On











Loading








Green Laser Pointers by Category Blue Laser Pointers by Category Red Laser Pointers by Category
Yellow Laser Pointers by Category Violet Laser Pointers by Category Orange Laser Pointers by Category
Top Laser Pointers by Power - 1 Watt+ Top Laser Pointers by Power - 500mW+ Top Laser Pointers by Power - 250mW+
Laser Pointer Database High Power Laser Pointers Laser Pointer Diodes






Privacy Policy | Advertising Disclaimer | Terms of Use


 


All times are GMT. The time now is 09:42 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO
Privacy Policy | Advertising Disclaimer | Terms of Use
Copyright (C) 2017 Laser Pointer Forums, LLC