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ArcticMyst Security by Avery

Has anyone had experience with this 300mw portable

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As the topic says, I am in the market for a pretty powerful green (you may have seen my previous post regarding a 300mw labby) but I decided a 1/3 watt portable would be heaps more fun.

http://store.oemlasersystems.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=5_23&products_id=125

The guy who sells them (Tony) seems like a good chap, but $824 (less discount - Tony has offered me a one off discount, so that makes the deal even better) is a lot of dosh for someone who doesnt earn a lot of money, so I want to be putting my cash down on a good laser that will last many years to come.

Basically after anyone who has one and what they think.

If I happen to be the first one to guinea pig one of these I will mail it to a forum member with a test meter (probably pseaudoman or senkat - I think senkat has a meter) so we can all be informed.

I will be buying my higher powered green early next year (say feb/march).
 





Milos

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Re: Has anyone had experience with this 300mw port

That is obviously an RPL model up until recently only obtainable from Optotronics.
Price looks very good. However, it does not say if it peaks or averages 300mW.
For example. My RPL can reach max peak of 502mW and averages around 380mW over 3-4 minutes period.

Othervise, it is one of the best hand held high powered laser currently available. It is the smallest unit that can give you well over 300mW of quality green beam.

here is my recent review on the same (but higher power)model.
http://www.laserpointerforums.com/forums/YaBB.pl?num=1193531616
 

Milos

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Re: Has anyone had experience with this 300mw port

Just noticed this!!

It states that life expectancy is 5000hrs. That tells basically that it has cheaper diode and therefore the rest of the crystals set than current Optotronics model. It probably is from the old Optotronics batch.
 
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Re: Has anyone had experience with this 300mw port

I'll chime in on this just a bit since I represent the company. I'm not going to sit and tell you these are the best things since sliced bread. They are what they are. My company is not in the business of supplying enthusiasts. We provide a very limited range of portable laser systems. Our customer is business and research and thus our specifications are very conservative. We tow the manufacturer line on specs so there is no question to our customers (university customers in particular) about the expectations of the operations and performance of a system.

Power output is average power, not peak. We don't play the mW game. When we purchase a 100mW unit for example, we don't go through each one measuring the average output and stating these few are 100mW so we sell them as 100mW and these one's average 125mW so we'll call them 125mW and sell them at a higher price even though it cost us the same. If you buy a 300mW and it averages 375mW, good for you. We are not going to charge you for a 350mW or a 375mW. You pay for a 300mW because that's what we paid for. By the way Opto does not have an exclusive distribution for RPL systems. The RPLs are manufactured by VIASHO and both Opto and OEM purchase the units from them.

You won't find pictures or videos of us popping balloons or lighting matches. That's not our business. I've made you aware of us because, being a member here, I've read over and over about how this company or that company screwed this or that person. The nature of what we do does not allow us the freedom or the luxury of screwing anyone. Anyway, take my statements at face value or read whatever you want into them.

Our prices are good because, once again, we are not in the business of supplying enthusiasts. We don't need to make our monthly payroll on one sale. Frankly, I would not want to distribute exclusively to enthusiasts as these other companies do. In fact, our site does not even show our high end industrial systems. We offer YAG and CO2 systems also.

My goal was just to let you know there is an alternative for purchasing laser systems, if you so choose, without having to bring the vaseline. You won't find us advertising portables and enthusiast type lasers on any other site or media. I've identified ourselves because I thought I could help you all out a bit.
 

Milos

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Re: Has anyone had experience with this 300mw port

Thanks for stepping in Frothy Chimp
I'm glad that 300mW is an average output as this price is very good then.
It is obvious that OEM focuses on more serious laser purposes from hobby use that most of us here does.

So , I take that only difference between Optotronics and OEM model now is that OEM sold model diode setup has shorter life span. (5000hrs vs 80000hrs) Same as Optotronics used to before they started using 2.5W diodes.
For people who don't look for the best there is, and with smaller pocket, that fact shouldn't matter imo.
 
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Re: Has anyone had experience with this 300mw port

I think a reply is in order here regarding several of the below comments, so here they are posted inline.

FrothyChimp said:
I'll chime in on this just a bit since I represent the company. I'm not going to sit and tell you these are the best things since sliced bread. They are what they are. My company is not in the business of supplying enthusiasts. We provide a very limited range of portable laser systems. Our customer is business and research and thus our specifications are very conservative. We tow the manufacturer line on specs so there is no question to our customers (university customers in particular) about the expectations of the operations and performance of a system.

Power output is average power, not peak. We don't play the mW game. When we purchase a 100mW unit for example, we don't go through each one measuring the average output and stating these few are 100mW so we sell them as 100mW and these one's average 125mW so we'll call them 125mW and sell them at a higher price even though it cost us the same.

So does this mean, you just sell a laser that comes in as a "100mW" as a 100mW?
That's ok I suppose if every 100mW portable laser that came in to you performs at or above that level, but what about the ones that are only 95mW or maybe even less? or those with bad divergence or a beam that is being emitted at an angle? It sounded like you said in the above statement that you don't test each laser.

If the answers to these questions are yes, then I would guess that you have not been selling these for very long or have not sold many of them. I say this as the variability from laser to laser in a high power portable is not like that of the much more stable and predictable lab laser systems.

If you buy a 300mW and it averages 375mW, good for you. We are not going to charge you for a 350mW or a 375mW. You pay for a 300mW because that's what we paid for.

Just to set things straight here, the manufacturer who I've dealt with for the past two years provides me with 3 power levels of portable green lasers from Viasho in a special/custom configuration with the n-light 2.5W 80,000 hr. MTTF diode rather than the 2.5W diode that is normally used. This does come at a premium price of $80 each, but it's worth every penny.
They are promised to me to be in these 3 power ranges:
(175-200mW)
(250-300mW)
(+300mW)
My cost increases with each increase in power range.
The RPL lasers fall into these categories. Their is nothing wrong with binning them based on performance, at least this way, the customer really knows what they are buying. This is the only fair way to do it. If every 250-300mW laser was at least 250mW, this might not be a bad deal or I could even do as WL does and offer a laser as 250-300mW; but in reality a fair percentage (I would estimate 10% or more) do not meet the minimum power level of what they were rated. This is not goos if your laser you've saved up for is in this 10%, so each needs to be tested. If a 250-300 is 240mW, then it can honestly be offered as a 225mW. Also, it may not be a milli-watt game to you, but to the enthusiast performance is everything and power output is one of the most important specs. So much so, I get requests all the time for the very top power output performing laser and the buyer is more than willing to pay extra for these higher performing units. It's just supply and demand, the demand for the highest output is big and the supply is low as it's much more rare for a +300mW to be 350mW than it is to be 310mW.

I know that oemlasersystems has been in the "laser system" business for some time; but the high power portable business is a completely different animal. You would think that universities and corporations that use the lab laser would be the most demanding of the performance of their lasers, but they are not. I know as I've been selling both laser systems and high power portables for the last two and half years or so. The "enthusiasts" you speak of as if they are ignorant or uninformed are actually much more demanding in the performance of the product they buy. This was not case two years ago, but the hobby has progressed a great deal. Most have a power meter (or at least knows someone who does), so they are quick to make sure they get every milli-watt they paid for and one of the 1st things they will do is measure the divergence and verify every specification they can. If it fails any of these specs, it's likely to get returned for repair or replacement. With a corporate or university order, of course they can measure power and other specs, but they are not as concerned about the specs as the "enthusiast" as long as it doesn't directly affect their work. If a 100mW lab laser happens to test at 95mW when a corporation or university by a laser, they don't consider it a big deal, probably because they are buying with someone elses money; however with an enthusiast, they spent their hard earned and saved cash for their purchase so they have a much more vested interest in the laser performing up to it's spec.



By the way Opto does not have an exclusive distribution for RPL systems. The RPLs are manufactured by VIASHO and both Opto and OEM purchase the units from them.

This is now true.
Up until mid July I had an exclusive agreement with the manufacturer/distributor I was working through. This has expired. I had contacted Viasho last year anonymously to work with Viasho directly, but it seemed they were not interested in the USA portable market or perhaps they too had an agreement with someone. About 6-7 weeks ago I was contacted directly by Viasho about distributing their product line here in the USA. The details of this are being worked out, but they are very impressed with the sales and reputation that Optotronics has gained in the past two years. However, the trademark name RPL for the use of portable lasers was submitted to the USPTO a couple weeks ago and is going through the approval process.

You won't find pictures or videos of us popping balloons or lighting matches. That's not our business.

Does this mean if a customer that's an enthusiast emails/calls you for support on the portable laser they bought from you saying it can't pop a balloon at such and such feet or it won't light a match at such and such feet, you will tell them "that's not our business, we bought is as an xxx mW laser and it was sold to you as an xxx mW lassr"?
If you want part of the "enthusiast" market, you will need to be testing them throughly for each specification and if a customer calls and says the laser can't pop a balloon or light a match, you better be able to assist them and "make it your business" or you won't be in that part of the market for long.



I've made you aware of us because, being a member here, I've read over and over about how this company or that company screwed this or that person. The nature of what we do does not allow us the freedom or the luxury of screwing anyone. Anyway, take my statements at face value or read whatever you want into them.

Be careful what you say about other companies around (with the exception of WL), it could come back in the future to bite you in a big way.

Our prices are good because, once again, we are not in the business of supplying enthusiasts. We don't need to make our monthly payroll on one sale. Frankly, I would not want to distribute exclusively to enthusiasts as these other companies do. In fact, our site does not even show our high end industrial systems. We offer YAG and CO2 systems also.

My goal was just to let you know there is an alternative for purchasing laser systems, if you so choose, without having to bring the vaseline. You won't find us advertising portables and enthusiast type lasers on any other site or media. I've identified ourselves because I thought I could help you all out a bit.

Like was said before, be careful what you say. The vaseline you speak of you may need for yourself sometime. Just for the future record, are the words you put down here in this forum, the official opinions and views of OEMlasersystems?

One last statement, the only way Optotronics could pay it's employess (all two...actually three of them, myself, my wife and my son) for a whole month in a single order is if that order was for more than several dozen RPL lasers of the mid level power range. I personally spend a good 25 hours a week answer customer and potential customers questions by email, another 4-5 hours a week by phone, probably at least 10-15 hours a week answering and posting in the forums as well as all the real time testing and doing the burn-in process of our RPL lasers to ensure the customer "gets what they paid for".
This doesn't include the packaging, doing customer full certifications and all the paperwork involved in running a business. Oh, yes we do run a real business (Delaware LLC) and pay real taxes and income taxes as well as 3.1% custom duties fees on every incoming order (we know it doesn't pay in the long run to try an avoid the tax man/uncle sam, not saying you don't also have these expenses you probably do if you're doing everything by the book). Then add to this 2-3k per month in advertising costs....I haven't even gotten started when it comes to how much health insurance costs are for a family when you have to pay this your self. We live in a modest home in a modest neighborhood and I still drive a 1988 Toyota Camry with +212k miles on it. I think if I were making money hand over fist, I would get myself a new car, and lastly we usually pull in enough to make our monthly budget by around the third week of the month; but we have been profitable from the beginning and the way things are looking, it's going to be getting a lot better for us very soon.

Somehow, I get the idea you are not very closely involved in the running of OEMlasersystems or have no idea of what it takes to run a legitimate business as far as costs, taxes, fees and work hours needed. Either this or you're going to be in for a surprise when the portable laser market comes to you and they want their products to perform exactly to or better than every specification and want lots of customer support to go with it.

I always thought being your own boss was the greatest thing to be. I worked for many years as an electrical engineer making good money and only worked 40 hrs a week. Then I started Optotronics on the side and put every spare minute into the company. Early this summer, I left my day job to dedicate all my work week to the company as the customer service was slipping a bit and I couldn't provide the level of support I wanted to give. Now I got what I wished for (being my own boss) and the 75 hr. work week to go along with it.

This is a friendly forum,
I hold no grudges and look forward to possibly working with Oemlasersystems and their portable business in the near future, but please don't jump to conclusions about other companies until you deal with them 1st hand...or maybe even 2nd hand:)

Take care.

Jack
 

Rhith

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Re: Has anyone had experience with this 300mw port

Thank you for your insight Jack. I am sure no one's intention here was to try and put down any other company or to make themselves look better than anyone else. I know personally I would love to get a laser that is fully up to spec beyond all belief from you Jack but also as a student I don't have as much money so getting the "same" product cheaper but without all of the support is almost tempting. This is an odd issue to try and form a good opinion over though due to all of the specifics involved and both the positive and negatives between companies and even different models of lasers. I hope that OEM can possibly boost their portable market but I am in no rush to see them try and boost it any sooner then they need to.
 
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Re: Has anyone had experience with this 300mw port

Jack,

You are absolutely right. I grouped your company with less than questionable suppliers and it was unfair and actually not my intent. I'm actually quite aware of your business and have not heard a bad word. As I mentioned we do not normally supply enthusiasts nor do we wish to. That is your arena. I don't feel that we are competitors. My intent was to help out a member who was actually looking for a lab model and who then began thinking about a portable. I'm actually more impressed by your company knowing you are an EE. I went the other route and am working on my PhD in physics.

Rhith,

What we have for portables is what we have. Our intent for having portables was for field research work by our clients such as oblique illumination, etc. Well....except the little blue 473nm pen model. We have that on the site because I wanted one, lol.
 
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Re: Has anyone had experience with this 300mw port

Rhith - bear in mind that (as long as i understood what Jack said correctly) they aren't the exact same laser, optotronics uses a higher quality diode. to me at least, that's worth the extra cost of an RPL, along with the testing and the customer support from Jack.
 
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Re: Has anyone had experience with this 300mw port

FrothyChimp said:
Jack,

You are absolutely right. I grouped your company with less than questionable suppliers and it was unfair and actually not my intent. I'm actually quite aware of your business and have not heard a bad word. As I mentioned we do not normally supply enthusiasts nor do we wish to. That is your arena. I don't feel that we are competitors. My intent was to help out a member who was actually looking for a lab model and who then began thinking about a portable. I'm actually more impressed by your company knowing you are an EE. I went the other route and am working on my PhD in physics.

Hi Frothy,
No problem, I too may have over reacted a bit as I felt it was directed at Optotronics and laserglow.
I wish I would have studied phsyics more while in school, but it's never too late and I'm now working towards that as well, but it's only one course at a time as I have very little time nowadays.

take care
Jack

Rhith,

What we have for portables is what we have. Our intent for having portables was for field research work by our clients such as oblique illumination, etc. Well....except the little blue 473nm pen model. We have that on the site because I wanted one, lol.
 
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Re: Has anyone had experience with this 300mw port

Hi again guys

Seems I started a little slanging match here, but it sorted itself out in the end.

I'm going to go with the RPL. its more expensive, but does have the higher quality diode. This is a big purchase for anyone, and I'm sure 99.999% recurring of people want the laser to last as long as possible.

Also to mention is there is heaps of happy reviews of the RPL units, so I take that into consideration as well....

Jack, Frothychimp, and all others I thank you for your time and input on this matter. This forum is really friendly, and I have joined the IRC channel (you'll see me in there lots now.

Cheers
Ben
 
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Re: Has anyone had experience with this 300mw port

One more thing I want to point out is Optotronics offers 12 month warranty :D while OemLaser only 3 month.
 

Milos

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Re: Has anyone had experience with this 300mw port

I would like to quote Jack's statement (from above post) because it is very true and important for all manufacturers of portable lasers to know. I'm glad Optotronics are very aware of it, and it sure shows!

"I know that oemlasersystems has been in the "laser system" business for some time; but the high power portable business is a completely different animal. You would think that universities and corporations that use the lab laser would be the most demanding of the performance of their lasers, but they are not. I know as I've been selling both laser systems and high power portables for the last two and half years or so. The "enthusiasts" you speak of as if they are ignorant or uninformed are actually much more demanding in the performance of the product they buy. This was not case two years ago, but the hobby has progressed a great deal. Most have a power meter (or at least knows someone who does), so they are quick to make sure they get every milli-watt they paid for and one of the 1st things they will do is measure the divergence and verify every specification they can. If it fails any of these specs, it's likely to get returned for repair or replacement. With a corporate or university order, of course they can measure power and other specs, but they are not as concerned about the specs as the "enthusiast" as long as it doesn't directly affect their work. If a 100mW lab laser happens to test at 95mW when a corporation or university by a laser, they don't consider it a big deal, probably because they are buying with someone elses money; however with an enthusiast, they spent their hard earned and saved cash for their purchase so they have a much more vested interest in the laser performing up to it's spec."

It is becoming more serious and not just "I like laser pointers" hobby.
Some of us will soon be considered "LASERFILEs" ;D ;D
 




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