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Old 08-17-2017, 04:12 AM #49
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Default Re: Is simply shining a Class 3+ laser into the sky illegal?

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Originally Posted by BobMc View Post
I seem to remember reading the law about the 10 mile restriction somewhere about 6 months ago. I've looked for it again but can't seem to find it?
Read post #38 Bob. It's not law, just an advisory.


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Old 08-17-2017, 04:18 AM #50
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Default Re: Is simply shining a Class 3+ laser into the sky illegal?

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Originally Posted by Rivem View Post
Read post #38 Bob. It's not law, just an advisory.
Thanks, Ok, interesting, maybe that's what I read, an advisory??
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Old 08-17-2017, 04:48 AM #51
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Default Re: Is simply shining a Class 3+ laser into the sky illegal?

The F.A.A. owns the sky, they believe it, it's theirs and you need permission to use it! Just ask any licensed pilot.
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Old 08-17-2017, 05:47 AM #52
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Default Re: Is simply shining a Class 3+ laser into the sky illegal?

"The Federal Aviation Administration has established guidelines for outdoor laser use, in FAA Form 7400.2, Procedures for Handling Airspace Matters, Part 6, Chapter 29, “Outdoor Laser Operations”.

These are guidelines. FAA does not have any jurisdiction over laser users. This means they cannot directly regulate laser use in airspace. The most they can do is ask laser users to notify them of their outdoor operations. (The Food and Drug Administration does give FAA indirect control over the three laser uses described below.)

The Food and Drug Administration regulates all laser products (hardware). In addition, under 21 CFR 1040.10, FDA regulates three uses/applications of lasers:
1. Demonstrations including laser light shows and artistic displays
2. Surveying, leveling and alignment (SLA)
3. Medical

Demonstration lasers such as light shows, and SLA lasers are often used outdoors. For these two applications, anyone using Class 3B or 4 lasers (above 5 mW for visible wavelengths) must fill out FDA Form 3147 to obtain a “variance.” The user describes the intended use and safety features in order to get permission from FDA to vary from the regulations.

If the use is outdoors, FDA will not grant the variance unless the user submits a description of their laser operations to FAA using FAA Form 7400.2 and receives a letter of non-objection from FAA. In this indirect way, demonstration/lightshow lasers and SLA lasers are the only outdoor uses of lasers that are required under Federal law to get permission in advance from FAA."

From: U.S. rules and regulations for those using lasers outdoors

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Old 08-17-2017, 05:56 AM #53
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Default Re: Is simply shining a Class 3+ laser into the sky illegal?

Technically, it probably isn't a stretch to consider showing someone your laser pointer beaming into the sky is a light show, they don't specify how many individuals are watching to be considered one, or whether free or not.
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Sincerely investigate any of these three short quotes as new concepts and you've taken your first step into a larger world:

"I regard consciousness as fundamental. I regard matter as derivative from consciousness..." - Max Planck. "Everything we call real is made of things that cannot be regarded as real" - Neils Bohr. "What we call physical things and events do not exist independently of subjective experience..." - Deepak Chopra.

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Old 08-17-2017, 06:12 AM #54
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Default Re: Is simply shining a Class 3+ laser into the sky illegal?

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Originally Posted by Alaskan View Post
Technically, it probably isn't a stretch to consider showing someone your laser pointer beaming into the sky is a light show, they don't specify how many individuals are watching to be considered one, or whether free or not.
Good points.

I would guess any handheld laser > 5mW is covered given current definitions--FDA has closed up the technical loopholes pretty much as follows:

"Laser pointers are hand-held lasers that are promoted for pointing out objects or locations. Such laser products can meet one of two definitions for laser products. The first is for “surveying, leveling, and alignment laser products” as defined by Title 21 of the Code of Federal Regulations (CFR) Section 1040.10(b)(39):

“Surveying, leveling, or alignment laser product means a laser product manufactured, designed, intended or promoted for one or more of the following uses:
(i) Determining and delineating the form, extent, or position of a point, body, or area by taking angular measurement.
(ii) Positioning or adjusting parts in proper relation to one another.
(iii) Defining a plane, level, elevation, or straight line.”

Hand-held lasers promoted for entertainment purposes or amusement also meet the second definition, that of “demonstration laser products” as defined by 21 CFR 1040.10(b)(13):

“Demonstration laser product means a laser product manufactured, designed, intended, or promoted for purposes of demonstration, entertainment, advertising display, or artistic composition.”

Laser products promoted for pointing and demonstration purposes are limited to hazard Class IIIa by FDA regulation.

21 CFR 1040.11(b) and 1040.11(c), limit surveying, leveling, and alignment, and demonstration laser products to Class IIIa. This means that pointers are limited to 5 milliwatts output power in the visible wavelength range from 400 to 710 nanometers."
From: https://www.fda.gov/radiation-emitti.../ucm116373.htm

I could be wrong but my take on current regulations is if the laser is above 5mW and you want to use it outdoors---technically you need a variance from FDA to be in compliance with FDA laws, rules, and regulations and to get a variance for outdoor use requires a letter of non-objection from FAA.

Additionally --On July 15 2016, President Obama signed the FAA Extension, Safety, and Security Act of 2016 in which the Civil Fine was raised to $25,000 from $11,000 for each instance pointing at aircraft or in flight path

Last edited by Encap; 08-17-2017 at 07:40 AM.
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Old 08-17-2017, 11:24 AM #55
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Default Re: Is simply shining a Class 3+ laser into the sky illegal?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Encap View Post
Good points.

I would guess any handheld laser > 5mW is covered given current definitions--FDA has closed up the technical loopholes pretty much as follows:

"Laser pointers are hand-held lasers that are promoted for pointing out objects or locations. Such laser products can meet one of two definitions for laser products. The first is for “surveying, leveling, and alignment laser products” as defined by Title 21 of the Code of Federal Regulations (CFR) Section 1040.10(b)(39):

“Surveying, leveling, or alignment laser product means a laser product manufactured, designed, intended or promoted for one or more of the following uses:
(i) Determining and delineating the form, extent, or position of a point, body, or area by taking angular measurement.
(ii) Positioning or adjusting parts in proper relation to one another.
(iii) Defining a plane, level, elevation, or straight line.”

Hand-held lasers promoted for entertainment purposes or amusement also meet the second definition, that of “demonstration laser products” as defined by 21 CFR 1040.10(b)(13):

“Demonstration laser product means a laser product manufactured, designed, intended, or promoted for purposes of demonstration, entertainment, advertising display, or artistic composition.”

Laser products promoted for pointing and demonstration purposes are limited to hazard Class IIIa by FDA regulation.

21 CFR 1040.11(b) and 1040.11(c), limit surveying, leveling, and alignment, and demonstration laser products to Class IIIa. This means that pointers are limited to 5 milliwatts output power in the visible wavelength range from 400 to 710 nanometers."
From: https://www.fda.gov/radiation-emitti.../ucm116373.htm

I could be wrong but my take on current regulations is if the laser is above 5mW and you want to use it outdoors---technically you need a variance from FDA to be in compliance with FDA laws, rules, and regulations and to get a variance for outdoor use requires a letter of non-objection from FAA.

Additionally --On July 15 2016, President Obama signed the FAA Extension, Safety, and Security Act of 2016 in which the Civil Fine was raised to $25,000 from $11,000 for each instance pointing at aircraft or in flight path
When I don't know the age of the person asking
the question as in this case.... I'll give the quick
and easy to understand common sense response
of Not a Good Idea.
If the OP is a kid he will not read any government
documents or advisories... (TLDR)... IMO

Jerry
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Old 08-17-2017, 12:07 PM #56
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Default Re: Is simply shining a Class 3+ laser into the sky illegal?

Anytime this question comes up there is a mountain of confusion and misinformation. Why is that when all answers can be found be reading the US rules and regulations available online. As laser enthusiasts it is in our best interest to know the rules regulations and laws governing lasers and their use.
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Old 08-17-2017, 07:45 PM #57
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Default Re: Is simply shining a Class 3+ laser into the sky illegal?

You would think so. I guess this will continue to pop up from time to time.
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