Old 04-22-2016, 08:09 PM #337
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

Best case scenario, he apologizes, gives you the money and walks away.

Worst case scenario you get into an altercation.

Most likely scenario, you'll knock on a door and no one will show.

Best thing anyone can do at this point is go through paypal, try to get your money back that way.

If you can't, or want revenge, contact israeli authorities, they would be the only ones possibly interested.

Aside from that... best to not dwell on it and move on. Definitely not worth getting into a fight over a couple hundred.


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Old 04-22-2016, 08:16 PM #338
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

Hi Ped,
it's shame good folks here with hard earned money have to get beat in many ways . It is sad folks looking for a laser at a somewhat reasonable price have to go through this. many members depend on other people to build for them, it's cheaper in the long run for them. Hey don't have to buy countless amounts of tools and hardware which most good people can't afford, but would like to.. Well all i have to say is i hope some good comes out of all this for the folks having issues with this man.

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Old 04-22-2016, 09:39 PM #339
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

How is it that you pretty much have free reign to scam international buyers without consequence? Worst case scenario paypal gives their money back. Unless you literally steal hundreds of thousands/millions of dollars you'll pretty much never suffer any real consequences or get in trouble with local authorities. The world really needs some better laws to protect against online scammers. It would be one thing if he was in some 3rd world trashbin, but he's in Israel. Israel is a technologically advanced country and part of the modern world. Somebody in Israel shouldn't legally be able to screw over dozens/hundreds of US or European buyers without repercussions.

As for Joker, he's either the biggest scammer in LPF history, or simply one of the most profoundly incompetent and unethical business owners I've seen. Perhaps he's a mix of both. He saw that his business model was failing and then held a bunch of sales to really rake in the victims. Best case scenario he's gonna fail at damn near anything he does in life(might make a good used car salesman though). Worst case scenario he's gonna end up in a ditch after screwing over the wrong people.
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Old 04-23-2016, 12:45 AM #340
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

You all won't be happy until we have a public stoning or Crucifixion. I seen this happen to guys trying to start up small autorepair shops.they get swamped and overwhelmed by all the sudden work and no one to count on to help keep caught up. Soon a lot of the customers are needing their cars and end up losing patience. Especially if they work a regular job in the day time.
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Old 04-23-2016, 02:24 AM #341
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

I just noticed that the title says "An Apology for Everyone" not "An Apology to Everyone". Ok. Think I'm good now.

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Old 04-23-2016, 04:57 AM #342
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

Is your solution to spend $1,100 to fly to Israel - hire a lawyer to write a brief in hebrew - wait for an Israeli Judge to determine whether hes broken Israeli law and whether as an American you have standing?

A more likely hypothetical is to take a dollar and buy a lotto ticket. The hundreds of millions youd hypothetically win might ease the loss of dealing with a foreign fraudster.

This is no different than suing a offshore Cuban Cigar retailer for failing to send your contraband to the US. Its an illegal contract and cannot be enforced in the US - and most other countries make it very difficult for a non citizen/non resident to sue a citizen in their country.


Quote:
Originally Posted by InfinitusEquitas View Post
Of course not, but it may be possible to pursue the matter in an Israeli court. Again, all hypothetical and completely impractical given the relatively small amounts in question.

Annoying that paypal always defaults to a bank account... also always use CC for everything.
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Old 04-23-2016, 05:54 AM #343
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

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Originally Posted by Michifan View Post
Is your solution to spend $1,100 to fly to Israel - hire a lawyer to write a brief in hebrew - wait for an Israeli Judge to determine whether hes broken Israeli law and whether as an American you have standing?

A more likely hypothetical is to take a dollar and buy a lotto ticket. The hundreds of millions youd hypothetically win might ease the loss of dealing with a foreign fraudster.

This is no different than suing a offshore Cuban Cigar retailer for failing to send your contraband to the US. Its an illegal contract and cannot be enforced in the US - and most other countries make it very difficult for a non citizen/non resident to sue a citizen in their country.
Okay, IE now it's your turn again . . .



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Alien
Nobody seriously proposed flying to israel - it was at best a hypothetical by a long-term member and i pointed out the lunacy of it in my post.
Hey IE, now your two behind and this is only "at best" the best you can do . . .


----------04/26/2016 08:21AM


IE you think me a Troll? And Neg Repping Michifan? You definitely musta got your panties in a wad now didn't you?




But twas you who invited me out to play, surely you jest in feigning such faux innocence.




Here now is Michifan with authority and class
Calling legal BS on IE's imagined Israeli recourse




Versus IE, try as he may just can't look any less dumbass,
Rather than simply admit his comment was foolish, so of course
he flips from "there's not much to prevent anyone from . . .getting in touch with Israeli authorities. I would if I were owed $900 "
and flops to "Of course not . . .Again, all hypothetical and completely impractical"
Where once and again IE charges in for a battle of wits pants down and completely unarmed

Now let’s put a score for the hand you played.
-1 point for Resorting to Name Calling . . . Typical when you've been bested (the same with your penchant for gif shitting someone's thread)
-1 point for Juvenile Neg Repping, hmm . . . Michifan and I musta hit a nerve me thinks
-1 point for An Uncalled for Swipe at Avery's good Character by insinuating he could be bought to make threads disappear

IE, that is not very good form, not good form at all especially for a wannabe-mod

btw - it is entirely understandable for you to have missed the point in thinking it of My Hands as nothing but a rant.

Play again?
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Old 04-23-2016, 06:09 AM #344
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

Quote:
Originally Posted by trussmonkey25 View Post
You all won't be happy until we have a public stoning or Crucifixion. I seen this happen to guys trying to start up small autorepair shops.they get swamped and overwhelmed by all the sudden work and no one to count on to help keep caught up. Soon a lot of the customers are needing their cars and end up losing patience.
Are you empathetic for this fraud?

If my understanding of your comparison between the auto shop situation and Sci-Fi's scam is correct and you're saying they both "just had too much stress" and "couldn't keep up," then basically every single modern industry and business would not exist. Obviously businesses grow, and with that growth they need to keep up themselves, and hire workers. Failure to grow along with your business's success results in company destruction, angry clients, and sky-rocketing stress levels for everyone.

It's jokers fault that he did not have things under control. There is no other way of saying it. He paid for advertising, surely he could've paid for more workers to keep his business growing and successful without causing a break down and pissing people off in the process.

Some people are out by almost 1000$. False tracking number, no item, and a shit ton of stress. Could you imagine, paying a grand and not get the item you're buying? That's called scamming.

False tracking numbers and lying is unacceptable. Laziness and not even sending out the items to clients who ordered is unacceptable.

If he was really a good person at heart, he would at least be refunding peoples money. But when he realized people are filing PayPal claims and joker's free money was getting taken away, he made this thread to... "Apologize"... and beg for people to close their claims so he can keep the money he scammed from people.
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Old 04-23-2016, 06:29 AM #345
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

My refund is due the 25th I will post here if i get one
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Old 04-23-2016, 08:14 AM #346
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

Personally, if I was a scamming low lifer like that and I were actually a good person, I'd refund everyone, work my ass off and make every single person I deceived a laser for free. Then let them decided if they want to pay me or not. But hey, that's just me.
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Old 04-23-2016, 08:49 AM #347
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

I have shipped about 8 lasers 24 hours ago. Soon a lot will get their codes. I am trying to get a stock of diodes for a lower price from the manufecturer , I will be able to pay him later on. Let's see if it will work.
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Old 04-23-2016, 10:11 AM #348
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

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I have shipped about 8 lasers 24 hours ago. Soon a lot will get their codes. I am trying to get a stock of diodes for a lower price from the manufecturer , I will be able to pay him later on. Let's see if it will work.
42 more to go.
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Old 04-23-2016, 03:47 PM #349
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

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I have shipped about 8 lasers 24 hours ago. Soon a lot will get their codes. I am trying to get a stock of diodes for a lower price from the manufecturer , I will be able to pay him later on. Let's see if it will work.
Good! This is a step in the right direction. However, I won't be satisfied until everyone gets what they payed for.

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Old 04-23-2016, 04:14 PM #350
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

Man this sure has turned in to a ugly mess of a sh!t show. I do not agree with Eithans tactics and the way this whole thing came about. I am on the side of the buyers their money should be refunded. But making this thread a circus is ridiculous. There are a few I know are really hot about this and they have a right to be but continuing to argue back and fourth is pointless and is a lesson in futility
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Old 04-23-2016, 05:35 PM #351
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

I'm going to defend Truss here.

I know he bought from Eitan and endured a long long wait for his unit. I know he was frustrated by the experience, but it did eventually show up and worked as expected.

Eitan got in over his head. I don't think he handled things ethically - certainly not in accordance with US law - but he's not a US citizen. I'm not an expert in Israeli law or Israeli export regulations.

But I think you are reading more into Truss' comments than he intended to say. And I only can say this because he and I have had private conversations about this subject.

Tis all.




Quote:
Originally Posted by ElectricPlasma View Post
Are you empathetic for this fraud?

If my understanding of your comparison between the auto shop situation and Sci-Fi's scam is correct and you're saying they both "just had too much stress" and "couldn't keep up," then basically every single modern industry and business would not exist. Obviously businesses grow, and with that growth they need to keep up themselves, and hire workers. Failure to grow along with your business's success results in company destruction, angry clients, and sky-rocketing stress levels for everyone.

It's jokers fault that he did not have things under control. There is no other way of saying it. He paid for advertising, surely he could've paid for more workers to keep his business growing and successful without causing a break down and pissing people off in the process.

Some people are out by almost 1000$. False tracking number, no item, and a shit ton of stress. Could you imagine, paying a grand and not get the item you're buying? That's called scamming.

False tracking numbers and lying is unacceptable. Laziness and not even sending out the items to clients who ordered is unacceptable.

If he was really a good person at heart, he would at least be refunding peoples money. But when he realized people are filing PayPal claims and joker's free money was getting taken away, he made this thread to... "Apologize"... and beg for people to close their claims so he can keep the money he scammed from people.
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Old 04-23-2016, 05:52 PM #352
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Default Re: An Apology for Everyone

"Can't we all just get along?"
Let's don't let eitans misdeeds get between members here, everybody has opinions and are entitled to them. This forum is, after all, for that purpose.

Last edited by VirtueViolater; 04-23-2016 at 05:54 PM.
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