FS: 225mw br laser sold

i have a new mini br laser that outputs 180ma(v4 driver @ 225mw  with a plastic lens its using a SF-AW210 diode. will include a glass lens kit (not complete) but like jayrob makes    and 2 new 10440 batts (this only takes one) asking 125.00

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

jake21 said:

will include a glass lens kit like jayrob makes    

Click to expand...

I see that your selling a Micro chrome build that you talked to me about...

I'm selling kits, and not complete builds. So it is not so bad.

But please don't start selling the same lens mods that I am selling. This would not be cool.

No, I do not have a patent on the modification or anything, but it should just go without saying.

I like to show details and even tutorials of most of the modifications that I have done because others can see how to DIY. But If it is something that I am selling myself, people should not copy it and start selling it along side me.

There is another guy already trying to do this. It was only a week or two after I showed all of the details and measurements of the modification.

This is the kind of thing that makes me not want to show any details or measurements...
Jay

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

I see you got your kenometer Nice build.
@Jay- I think the upgrade is just for this laser, he shouldnt start selling the lens mods like you, thats your territory

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

[highlight]I see you got your kenometer Cool Nice build[/highlight].


thanks day


come on i cant sell a lens with my own laser :

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

yes you CAN. but..

Basically what Jay is saying, Its not cool to take all or most of his ideas and sell them as your package at lowest price (or any price, but specially lowest price)

Jake, you always seem to do try to do this. As if all you care is selling. Getting all the info and parts from any source ( even if its others designs/ideas), and trying to turn it around as quickly as possible for your profit. And right in their face.  I hardly call that a hobby.

specially that you don't need to do this. You've come up with some of nice mods before.. i think.

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

Miloš said:

yes you CAN. but..
Basically what Jay is saying, Its not cool to take all or most of his ideas and sell them as your package at lowest price (or any price, but specially lowest price)
Jake, you always seem to do this. As if all you care selling. Getting  all the info and parts from any source ( even if its others designs/ideas), and trying to turn it around as quickly as possible for your profit. And right in their face.  I hardly call that a hobby.
specially that you don't need to do this. You've come up with some of nice mods before.. i think.

Click to expand...

I know that we need to keep reminding the community about this, but has Jake EVER worried about intellectual property rights?

Folks -- Don't even start with trying to define this by "legal" definitions.  This is a hobby community, not a copyright court.  If a member of the community designs or invents something and shares it with us, the idea should remain the property of the designer or inventor.   Because the designer/inventor shared it with us, we are free to make our own.  However, taking that idea and selling it for profit, is wrong at a very basic, ethical level.  We have seen, more than once now, a very creative and active member stop sharing their ideas with us and/or leaving the community because their ideas are ripped off and their price is undercut by a pirate.  If you haven't personally seen this, you are either a NooB to the forum or are simply not very observant.

You don't steal the idea and sell it.  You build the laser and then recommend that the buyer purchase the item from the designer/inventor.  Alternately, you buy the component from the inventor/designer and tell the buyer that it has the "cool new Jayrob modified lens" as a selling point.

Personal use and use for profit are NOT the same thing.

Peace,
dave

[highlight]**EDIT**[/highlight] In case it wasn't clear from the above statement, I will NOT respond to arguments about why it is OK to pirate others' ideas. Arguments based in "situational ethics" have no bearing on common sense and respect.

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

daguin said:

[quote author=Miloš link=1238817332/0#4 date=1238857509]yes you CAN. but..
Basically what Jay is saying, Its not cool to take all or most of his ideas and sell them as your package at lowest price (or any price, but specially lowest price)
Jake, you always seem to do this. As if all you care selling. Getting  all the info and parts from any source ( even if its others designs/ideas), and trying to turn it around as quickly as possible for your profit. And right in their face.  I hardly call that a hobby.
specially that you don't need to do this. You've come up with some of nice mods before.. i think.

Click to expand...

I know that we need to keep reminding the community about this, but has Jake EVER worried about intellectual property rights?

Folks -- Don't even start with trying to define this by "legal" definitions.  This is a hobby community, not a copyright court.  If a member of the community designs or invents something and shares it with us, the idea should remain the property of the designer or inventor.   Because the designer/inventor shared it with us, we are free to make our own.  However, taking that idea and selling it for profit, is wrong at a very basic, ethical level.  We have seen, more than once now, a very creative and active member stop sharing their ideas with us and/or leaving the community because their ideas are ripped off and their price is undercut by a pirate.  If you haven't personally seen this, you are either a NooB to the forum or are simply not very observant.

You don't steal the idea and sell it.  You build the laser and then recommend that the buyer purchase the item from the designer/inventor.  Alternately, you buy the component from the inventor/designer and tell the buyer that it has the "cool new Jayrob modified lens" as a selling point.

Personal use and use for profit are NOT the same thing.

Peace,
dave

[highlight]**EDIT**[/highlight]  In case it wasn't clear from the above statement, I will NOT respond to arguments about why it is OK to pirate others' ideas.  Arguments based in "situational ethics" have no bearing on common sense and respect.[/quote]


very well put Dave,
this is our community and laws of respect and decency should be implemented harshly !!

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

not to mention that I didn't forget Jakes crave for, and stealing of my Stingray-1 idea and almost complete ad. Just to start selling it as soon as he built it.

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

jake21 said:

i have a new mini br laser that outputs 180ma(v4 driver @ 225mw  with a plastic lens its using a SF-AW210 diode. [highlight]will include a glass lens kit like jayrob makes[/highlight]    and 2 new 10440 batts (this only takes one) asking 200.00

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Maybe I'm slow.... but
  does this mean that he will include a "Jayrob lens Kit" or a different kit
similar to the "Jayrob lens kit"... :-/

And if it is NOT a "Jayrob lens Kit" but a similar (copy kit) then doesn't he need a lathe for the parts...
I've seen Jay's lathe work and it would scare me to even try get close to his expertise... :

Hey.... for all we know... it's a piece of plastic tubing and a lens and as a "salesman" that he is
he exaggerated  a "bit".... ( I don't know.... haven't seen it).. :

But I understand that a member who shares his intellectual property should not be exploited...
for profit of someone else unless it is shared with that person...
Wait... I think that is called a License...  


Jerry
(1666 - 55)

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

I have a question for you guys while on the topic.. I bought 3 lenses from Jayrob, and I used the same lens nut to mount them. I have 40 of these glass lens nuts which I had originally bought for red diodes, but also use them for the new 405 glass.

Now my mod is completely different to Jay's, the only thing the same is I use the axiz metal nut. No additional parts, drilling, or modification is made to the nut when I mount the lens, and mine is right side up without cutting the spring.

So my question is, would I be in the wrong for selling lasers with this lens and metal nut?

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

I sure hope you offer some kind of warranty on that diode...cause they still really haven't been tested thoughougly yet. The last time I read on that thread, it seems that these diodes are just about as good as a 4x, give or take.

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

WannaBurn said:

I have a question for you guys while on the topic.. I bought 3 lenses from Jayrob, and I used the same lens nut to mount them. I have 40 of these glass lens nuts which I had originally bought for red diodes, but also use them for the new 405 glass.

Now my mod is completely different to Jay's, the only thing the same is I use the axiz metal nut. No additional parts, drilling, or modification is made to the nut when I mount the lens, and mine is right side up without cutting the spring.

So my question is, would I be in the wrong for selling lasers with this lens and metal nut?

Click to expand...

Of course not.... You don't do any drilling or lathe work... it is a completely different lens housing...
Let's not go over the edge...  I know it's not the same....I have one... and it is not like the one
I ordered from Jay...
They are similar... they both hold the Lens and they both screw into a threaded Aixiz housing... but
that is where the similarity ends... IMO...


Jerry

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

WannaBurn said:

I have a question for you guys while on the topic.. I bought 3 lenses from Jayrob, and I used the same lens nut to mount them. I have 40 of these glass lens nuts which I had originally bought for red diodes, but also use them for the new 405 glass.
Now my mod is completely different to Jay's, the only thing the same is I use the axiz metal nut. No additional parts, drilling, or modification is made to the nut when I mount the lens, and mine is right side up without cutting the spring.
So my question is, would I be in the wrong for selling lasers with this lens and metal nut?

Click to expand...

This is why "legalistic" arguments fail in these situations.  The basic question becomes, "Is your idea "a copy of" or "substantially based on" the design of another?" Also you must ask, "Is mine a substantial improvement over the original idea?"  If the answer to the first question is, "Yes." then you have stolen another's property.  If the answer to the second question is, "No." then you have stolen another's property.

In court these questions are answered via witnesses and carefully examining your life to see if you were exposed in some way to the idea from the original source.  Neither the nut nor the lens belong to Jayrob.  However, the idea of combining them into a package that can be easily swapped with a standard AixiZ lens assembly is Jayrob's.  Your lens assembly is put together differently than Jayrob's design.  Is it a substantial improvement over his design?  Although I have not seen yours to compare, it would appear that you have used a completely different assembly technique to accomplish the goal of a 405nm specific lens in an AixiZ nut.  Since I haven't seen it, you (and later the community) get to decide if it is different enough from Jayrob's design to be "yours."

Peace,
dave

[highlight]**EDIT**[/highlight] Apparently Lasersbee has seen both yours and Jayrob's lens assemblies and agrees that it is different enough from Jayrob's design to be "yours."

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

[highlight]I have a question for you guys while on the topic.. I bought 3 lenses from Jayrob, and I used the same lens nut to mount them. I have 40 of these glass lens nuts which I had originally bought for red diodes, but also use them for the new 405 glass.

Now my mod is completely different to Jay's, the only thing the same is I use the axiz metal nut. No additional parts, drilling, or modification is made to the nut when I mount the lens, and mine is right side up without cutting the spring.

So my question is, would I be in the wrong for selling lasers with this lens and metal nut?[/highlight]

It depends ... How much would you be selling them for?

Seriously, it sounds like what you're doing is a different animal from Jayrobs lens, with the exception of course of the lens itself ... I can't say for sure, but I would assume you also have R&D time, costs, etc into the development of your alternative lens assembly, so that might not be such an issue in regards to the theft of the design - you are offering an "alternative to", not a "copy of".

Just to be sure though, I suggest you send me one of your lens assemblies and I'll take a look at it and post a somewhat more educated opinion, sound good? ;D ;D

I'll be waiting by the mailbox, now.....

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

WannaBurn said:

I have a question for you guys while on the topic.. I bought 3 lenses from Jayrob, and I used the same lens nut to mount them. I have 40 of these glass lens nuts which I had originally bought for red diodes, but also use them for the new 405 glass.

Now my mod is completely different to Jay's, the only thing the same is I use the axiz metal nut. No additional parts, drilling, or modification is made to the nut when I mount the lens, and mine is right side up without cutting the spring.

So my question is, would I be in the wrong for selling lasers with this lens and metal nut?

Click to expand...

these lenses are available on ebay and from other sellers online known to some of us for long time now. Anyone can buy parts and build. Jay was even nice enough to provide links and complete design dissected.  I think its ok to build a better lens assembly with common parts if you know how, but its wrong to stand as competition in every way with mods someone else comes up with and shares. Like Dave said, credit giving is a decent thing and bare minimum to mention, as well as other details about your personal build.

Not just " here I got 500mW 405nm laser just like Jay's and lens like Jays for $200.

or

here, "My name is Milos and I can build you Jay's 405-G-1 lens assembly for $40, come on before they are sold" I built one and ist really good. I can build more and sell next to Jay for lower price.

that should  be clear its indecent and unnecessary. Should never happen on our forums. But Jake always tends to push the think line of decency. Not that his versions are as good quality as original designs, but still, many new comers don't know this.

Re: FS: 225mw br laser

BrewCityMusic said:

Just to be sure though, I suggest you send me one of your lens assemblies and I'll take a look at it and post a somewhat more educated opinion, sound good?  ;D ;D
I'll be waiting by the mailbox, now.....

Click to expand...

DARN!  Why didn't I think of that

DOH!

Peace,
dave